Will Roger Maris ever get into the HOF?

[jingram058]

Well, if we're going down this road, here is $.02, FWIW...no, I don't think Harold Mediocre Baines needs to be in, and no Maris doesn't need to get in. Like the man said, if he hit 59, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

But consider these rather serious omissions...Chuck Klein, Riggs Stephenson, Cecil Travis, and Gil Hodges.

Then we have Joe Jackson (he didn't take the money), Pete Rose (I couldn't care less about his gambling), and Barry Bonds (I couldn't care less about his steroids).

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by jingram058

Well, if we're going down this road, here is $.02, FWIW...no, I don't think Harold Mediocre Baines needs to be in, and no Maris doesn't need to get in. Like the man said, if he hit 59, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

But consider these rather serious omissions...Chuck Klein, Riggs Stephenson, Cecil Travis, and Gil Hodges.

Then we have Joe Jackson (he didn't take the money), Pete Rose (I couldn't care less about his gambling), and Barry Bonds (I couldn't care less about his steroids).

Chuck Klein was elected in 1980. Fun Fact: Klein and Lou Gehrig are the only players in history that have recorded 400 or more total bases in three separate seasons.

[jingram058]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Chuck Klein was elected in 1980.

Duh...Alzheimer's, I guess.

[tjenkins]

I live in northern South South Dakota. Maris grew up 150 miles from me and personally alot of us in this area don't understand, why he is not in? He held arguably the most prestigious record in baseball during a time period when pitching was pretty darn tough. I understand he only had two superstar level seasons but I feel if Maris had one negative quality, it was how the pressure of the 1961 season and outdoing the Babe and Mantle really negatively affected his health. I believe it shortened his career, which in my opinion says something about the type of person he was. I wish like hell he would get in but I do not think he will. There are certainly players less deserving than Maris who are in.

[UKCardGuy]

Originally Posted by jingram058

Well, if we're going down this road, here is $.02, FWIW...no, I don't think Harold Mediocre Baines needs to be in, and no Maris doesn't need to get in. Like the man said, if he hit 59, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

But consider these rather serious omissions...Chuck Klein, Riggs Stephenson, Cecil Travis, and Gil Hodges.

Then we have Joe Jackson (he didn't take the money), Pete Rose (I couldn't care less about his gambling), and Barry Bonds (I couldn't care less about his steroids).

I completely agree with you about Hodges. I never understood Gil's omission especially considering the additional consideration of his managerial career

8× All-Star (1949–1955, 1957)
3× World Series champion (1955, 1959, 1969)
3× Gold Glove Award (1957–1959)
Managed the '69 Miracle Mets

[Harliduck]

Originally Posted by UKCardGuy

I completely agree with you about Hodges. I never understood Gil's omission especially considering the additional consideration of his managerial career

8× All-Star (1949–1955, 1957)
3× World Series champion (1955, 1959, 1969)
3× Gold Glove Award (1957–1959)
Managed the '69 Miracle Mets

I second this one...Harold Baines and Barry Larkin...no Gil Hodges?? Cmon...

As for Maris...Here is a player still revered, talked about, and relevant...above many of his peers...I would want him in for emotional reasons, and not sure that's good enough. I certainly wouldn't be upset if he got in...

[tjenkins]

Originally Posted by jingram058

Well, if we're going down this road, here is $.02, FWIW...no, I don't think Harold Mediocre Baines needs to be in, and no Maris doesn't need to get in. Like the man said, if he hit 59, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

But consider these rather serious omissions...Chuck Klein, Riggs Stephenson, Cecil Travis, and Gil Hodges.

Then we have Joe Jackson (he didn't take the money), Pete Rose (I couldn't care less about his gambling), and Barry Bonds (I couldn't care less about his steroids).

I also agree with EVERYTHING that jingram has said other than I believe Maris should be in.

[mortimer brewster]

Gil Hodges should most definitely be a Hall of Famer.

At the time of his retirement he was 10th on the all time HR list. Second all time among Right Handed hitters. Also at the Time of his retirement he was first on the all time grand slam list. Great defensive first baseman.

Piloting the Miracle Mets to the World Championship in 1969 should also be a factor.

[riggs336]

Originally Posted by jingram058

Well, if we're going down this road, here is $.02, FWIW...no, I don't think Harold Mediocre Baines needs to be in, and no Maris doesn't need to get in. Like the man said, if he hit 59, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

But consider these rather serious omissions...Chuck Klein, Riggs Stephenson, Cecil Travis, and Gil Hodges.

Then we have Joe Jackson (he didn't take the money), Pete Rose (I couldn't care less about his gambling), and Barry Bonds (I couldn't care less about his steroids).

I'm a big fan of Riggs Stephenson as my avatar and user id indicate.

Is he more deserving than some of the people already in the Hall? Yes...hello Fred Lindstrom. But he really wasn't a HOF caliber player.

There are already way too many mistakes from that big-hitting era of the late 20's and 1930's. We don't need any more.

Although I collect them both, either he nor Maris belong in the Hall.

[Mark17]

When there is a decent sized list of guys more deserving ahead of Maris (and I'll add Tony Oliva to that list now,) that is reason he shouldn't be in.

If we're going to say his one great year (1961) season and another MVP season (1960) puts him in, then how about Denny McLain? A great year (1968, 31 wins - last guy to win 30, Cy Young award, MVP) and 1969 (24 wins, another Cy award) are comparable. Not to mention 20 wins in 1966.

Despite a long and painfully tedious goodbye, McLain still ended with a .590 winning percentage.

No I don't think McLain should be in, just saying, stat-wise and accomplishment-wise, he's reasonably comparable to Maris, who also shouldn't be in.

[jingram058]

Originally Posted by riggs336

I'm a big fan of Riggs Stephenson as my avatar and user id indicate.

Is he more deserving than some of the people already in the Hall? Yes...hello Fred Lindstrom. But he really wasn't a HOF caliber player.

There are already way too many mistakes from that big-hitting era of the late 20's and 1930's. We don't need any more.

Although I collect them both, either he nor Maris belong in the Hall.

Well, I agree defensively. His football injury hurt him, no doubt. But he hit above .300 for years, and was looked on as a star by every writer and fan it seems.

I guess for me my most glaring omission, the one that I just don't understand, is Gil Hodges. That one I just don't get at all.

[Exhibitman]

Frank "Lefty" O'Doul is the greatest eligible position player not in the Hall of Fame. Over 970 games (30 shy of the 1,000 used for official records) from 1919 to 1934, Lefty averaged .349, winning two batting championships and setting the NL record for most hits in a season. Not in any way a "homer", Lefty hit .352 at home and .347 on the road, proving he belongs among the elite hitters in history. After his days in the majors ended, he returned to the Pacific Coast League, where he was the longtime manager of the San Francisco Seals and later the San Diego and Seattle teams. Lefty was instrumental in organizing Japanese baseball, whose premiere team, the Giants, was named in his honor. Lefty is one of only 3 Americans in the Japanese baseball hall of fame.

[G1911]

The greatest eligible position player not in the HOF is Barry Bonds. Whether he should be in or not is another issue.


I’d pick Dahlen over O’Doul among old timers who are eligible, for one. O’Doul played 6 full time seasons, 4 of his 11 years were under 40 games. One has to ascribe to the theory that very short peaks are enough in and of themselves (the Maris argument, though Maris’ was far more significant), or that O’Doul should be the first person inducted into the Cooperstown Hall of Fame primarily for his contributions to Japanese Baseball.

[John1941]

I like taking into account minor league stats also for pre-1950 guys, and in that case Lefty O'Doul has 10 full seasons, instead of just 6 .Still not a ton, but it gets him closer. And I really think the quality of the NL and PCL back then were at least comparable .For instance, O'Doul won 2 NL batting titles, but no PCL batting titles.

[yanks87]

I, too am a HUGE Yankee fan. I love Maris, but to look at his stat line, never hit above .283, had two really good years, and caught lightning in a bottle to hit 61 in '61. He is worth of a baseball history "tip of the cap", but not hall worthy.

I agree with a bunch of folks here that the hall quality level has REALLY dropped. Since I was a kid growing up going to Cooperstown every summer, I always felt that the Hall should be reserved for those players that were iconic at their position within the era that they played, and numbers in line with the elites of the game. It seems like the recent classes have really stretched both of those qualifiers. I am probably the lone crazy guy who thinks that Edgar Martinez has no place in the Hall. In fact, I think if DH's are going to go into the hall, they should have a minimum of 3000 hits. If not, they are good, not great, players by comparison, minus the fact that they don't play in the field. I stand by the fact that if Edgar is in, the Cobra should be as well, their numbers are almost the same, but Dave Parker actually played in the field on top of all the batting.

That is my problem with the way people are making it into the Hall currently, it seems to be more about perceptions than reality in the context of the history of the game.

[packs]

I'm in general agreement with you about the full picture but Hack Wilson is a HOFer too. He had exactly two outstanding seasons, one that saw him set the RBI record. Not all that different from Maris. Wilson even got in long after Maris hit 61. If there is room for single season achievements in the Hall I think Maris has achieved the most.