First Vintage Set - Graded vs. Raw?

[Mbjerry]

Originally Posted by thatkidfromjerrymaguire

Not much new for me to add to the conversation, but just wanted to chime in that my vote is collect your set in mostly raw condition. You will get more for your money, and I think it's more satisfying to handle and sort raw cards, they look great in a binder, and take up less space.

But if you are concerned about authenticity and future value and accurate condition, then purchase the high dollar cards graded.

This is the approach I took with my 1952 Bowman set in EX condition. I only have four more cards to go (I have all the BIG ones), and basically any card worth around $100 or more I purchased graded (about six cards), and everything else is raw.

I have the graded cards in back of my binder in four pocket pages and everything else raw in nine pocket pages. Looks pretty good.

I will say, however, the biggest downside with buying raw online is not being able to tell the true condition of the card until you get it "in hand". My goal is to have a completely EX condition or higher set, which means no creases or wrinkles. However it's fairly common for a card to look EX or NM in scans, only to find they have light surface wrinkles. So it's best to buy graded on the high dollar cards if you have a specific condition in mind.

Also, I think you can add Greg Morris Cards to your list of trusted dealers. His auctions seem to end a little higher than most, but his condition estimates on raw cards are accurate. I've not had any unexpected wrinkles, etc. from anything I've bought from him.

Thank you. This helps. I didn't know they made 4 pocket sleeves for graded. I like this idea of doing almost all raw and the big cards graded in the sleeves. I will add Greg Morris Cards to my saved sellers.

[53toppscollector]

I spent about a year and a half putting together a fully graded near complete (only needed 10 or so cards) 1953 Topps set, everything graded between a 5 and 7. Here are my thoughts:

* If I had to do it again (and I am, actually), I would collect 99% of the set raw. You generally don't have to worry about someone creating a fake copy of Del Rice or Gus Niarhos. The reason I am choosing raw moving forward is that I want to collect so many different sets, especially pre-war tobacco stuff, that for me, it doesn't make financial sense to pay $25-30 for a graded common in a PSA 5, when I could buy 10+ raw cards for one of the sets I am working on for that same price. I will never have the top rated set on any PSA registry because I won't spend hundreds/thousands of dollars for PSA 9/10 copies of commons. So that isn't a game I am going to play anymore. I just really want to have as many completed vintage sets as possible.

* Last summer, you could grade vintage commons with PSA for $7-8 per card, and it was a no brainer to do that when playing the PSA set registry game. Now, the calculus has certainly changed, and we have no idea what the bulk price will look like when it eventually opens back up. I suspect that when bulk/value re-opens, and the cost is $30+ per card, the price on existing PSA graded vintage commons will increase. At least it certainly should.

* When it comes to the HoF, then my inclination will be to buy a graded copy. Obviously new raw collections are always coming to market, but for me its almost not worth the hassle of trying to buy an EX/EXMINT copy of a Mantle or Mays raw unless the price is a real bargain. May as well just pay the premium to get an already slabbed version.

* I'm not a binders person because I don't trust myself to not mangle the cards when putting them in/taking them out of the pages. Cardsavers and big boxes for raw is fine for me.

* Don't overpay for cards. I know that one is hard to really adhere to in the moment, when you see a card you've been looking for, but really unless you are dealing in really rare cards that almost never come to market, you will see another copy of it. I searched for a few months for a 1953 Topps Jackie Jensen in PSA 5 or higher with decent centering and couldn't find one. When one finally popped up, it was a lot more expensive than I wanted to pay, but I bought it anyway. Then, within 3-4 weeks, 2 more popped up on ebay, with the same general eye appeal, for 30% less than I paid. And I was sad. If you are going to go with raw, you should generally set an upper limit on commons and just refuse to pay more. Another copy will come along, and when you are tackling big sets of 400+ cards, there are always others to grab while waiting for the next one to come along.

Good luck

[egri]

I don’t have a whole lot new to add, but my experience with building my 1953 Topps set has been I prefer them raw. It’s nice to be able to look at them one by one (most are in toploaders) and be able to handle them. If I were doing it over again, I would focus more on the stars first. I kept telling myself that I could get Mantle and Paige later, and now they’re at several multiples of where they were a year and a half ago. On the plus side, I locked down Robinson and Campanella before the run up; I don’t know where I’d be if I had to get them now.

[Mbjerry]

Originally Posted by 53toppscollector

I spent about a year and a half putting together a fully graded near complete (only needed 10 or so cards) 1953 Topps set, everything graded between a 5 and 7. Here are my thoughts:

* If I had to do it again (and I am, actually), I would collect 99% of the set raw. You generally don't have to worry about someone creating a fake copy of Del Rice or Gus Niarhos. The reason I am choosing raw moving forward is that I want to collect so many different sets, especially pre-war tobacco stuff, that for me, it doesn't make financial sense to pay $25-30 for a graded common in a PSA 5, when I could buy 10+ raw cards for one of the sets I am working on for that same price. I will never have the top rated set on any PSA registry because I won't spend hundreds/thousands of dollars for PSA 9/10 copies of commons. So that isn't a game I am going to play anymore. I just really want to have as many completed vintage sets as possible.

* Last summer, you could grade vintage commons with PSA for $7-8 per card, and it was a no brainer to do that when playing the PSA set registry game. Now, the calculus has certainly changed, and we have no idea what the bulk price will look like when it eventually opens back up. I suspect that when bulk/value re-opens, and the cost is $30+ per card, the price on existing PSA graded vintage commons will increase. At least it certainly should.

* When it comes to the HoF, then my inclination will be to buy a graded copy. Obviously new raw collections are always coming to market, but for me its almost not worth the hassle of trying to buy an EX/EXMINT copy of a Mantle or Mays raw unless the price is a real bargain. May as well just pay the premium to get an already slabbed version.

* I'm not a binders person because I don't trust myself to not mangle the cards when putting them in/taking them out of the pages. Cardsavers and big boxes for raw is fine for me.

* Don't overpay for cards. I know that one is hard to really adhere to in the moment, when you see a card you've been looking for, but really unless you are dealing in really rare cards that almost never come to market, you will see another copy of it. I searched for a few months for a 1953 Topps Jackie Jensen in PSA 5 or higher with decent centering and couldn't find one. When one finally popped up, it was a lot more expensive than I wanted to pay, but I bought it anyway. Then, within 3-4 weeks, 2 more popped up on ebay, with the same general eye appeal, for 30% less than I paid. And I was sad. If you are going to go with raw, you should generally set an upper limit on commons and just refuse to pay more. Another copy will come along, and when you are tackling big sets of 400+ cards, there are always others to grab while waiting for the next one to come along.

Good luck

Thank you for the time you took to write this. I think I am going with the recommendation for HOFers in graded and the rest raw.

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[Cmvorce]

I don't really have much new to add but will share my personal experiences in case any of it is of value.

When I started to build my 52 Topps set (minus Mantle) I knew I wanted to keep them in a binder for easy and pleasant viewing. I find that I never look at my slabbed cards but I look at and enjoy my binder sets all the time. Just the habits I have formed. You'll have to decide what is best for you.

Anyway, my plan was to buy the vast majority of 52s raw and then the premium cards I would buy graded for a little extra peace of mind, and then break them out and add to my binder. Agree with others that there are several reputable dealers who you can feel confident in buying raw. (I mostly used battersbox, tonyetrade, and kit young. Also, several members on these boards).

In theory, that plan seemed good - I hate missing cards in my binders - just an OCD thing of mine, and this was several years ago, so the cost of even the premium cards wasn't yet out of this world (PSA 1.5 Mays for $450; PSA 2 Jackie for $800 - remember those days?!). So I felt comfortable cracking them all.

I bring this up just to caution you about cracking slabs. Fast forward to today and even though I love the 52 set in a binder, I am not comfortable keeping the Jackie and Willie in the pages, so I have pulled them out and keep them in recessed screwdowns. At some point I will resubmit to PSA. I regret cracking those two out.

As time went on, and the value of certain graded cards increased, I found that I wasn't comfortable cracking more and more cards from the 52 set. I kept Campanella, Pee Wee Reese, Eddie Mathews, and a few other HOFers and high numbers in their slabs. What I am probably going to do is buy reprints of these cards to add to my binder so I don't have all those unsightly blank spaces.

I guess where I am now, is that I have set an unofficial personal threshold for slabbed / raw that I follow as best as possible, knowing I have to be flexible when the opportunity for a good deal arises. For instance, my 52 Wilhelm was purchased raw and is in the binder, while my 52 Robin Roberts is graded, even though the Wilhelm is more valuable.

At the end of the day I guess it depends on your collecting goals. I will be leaving my collection to my wife and/or kids and realize that it will most likely be much easier for my daughters to sell high value cards that are graded than if they were raw.

I feel like I'm talking in circles now, but the essence of it all is to store and display in the way that will give you the most enjoyment, and help you meet your collecting goals. If you do go the binder route, I highly recommend the lighthouse binders with slipcases that are available on Amazon. They are more expensive, but very solid structure, and the slipcase not only keeps dust off, but allows you to store with the ring on top and pages dangling to guards against bending / folding. I've been very pleased.

[mikemb]

I too keep my sets in binders with just about all the cards raw.

The small amount of cards in a set that are graded are either on display or in the 4 pocket pages.

Mike

[ASF123]

I bring this up just to caution you about cracking slabs. Fast forward to today and even though I love the 52 set in a binder, I am not comfortable keeping the Jackie and Willie in the pages, so I have pulled them out and keep them in recessed screwdowns. At some point I will resubmit to PSA. I regret cracking those two out.

I'm not sure I would resubmit if I were you. At the rate PSA is going, both cards would probably get about a -5.5.

[Cmvorce]

Originally Posted by ASF123

I'm not sure I would resubmit if I were you. At the rate PSA is going, both cards would probably get about a -5.5.

lol so true!!

[Mbjerry]

Originally Posted by Cmvorce

I don't really have much new to add but will share my personal experiences in case any of it is of value.



When I started to build my 52 Topps set (minus Mantle) I knew I wanted to keep them in a binder for easy and pleasant viewing. I find that I never look at my slabbed cards but I look at and enjoy my binder sets all the time. Just the habits I have formed. You'll have to decide what is best for you.



Anyway, my plan was to buy the vast majority of 52s raw and then the premium cards I would buy graded for a little extra peace of mind, and then break them out and add to my binder. Agree with others that there are several reputable dealers who you can feel confident in buying raw. (I mostly used battersbox, tonyetrade, and kit young. Also, several members on these boards).



In theory, that plan seemed good - I hate missing cards in my binders - just an OCD thing of mine, and this was several years ago, so the cost of even the premium cards wasn't yet out of this world (PSA 1.5 Mays for $450; PSA 2 Jackie for $800 - remember those days?!). So I felt comfortable cracking them all.



I bring this up just to caution you about cracking slabs. Fast forward to today and even though I love the 52 set in a binder, I am not comfortable keeping the Jackie and Willie in the pages, so I have pulled them out and keep them in recessed screwdowns. At some point I will resubmit to PSA. I regret cracking those two out.



As time went on, and the value of certain graded cards increased, I found that I wasn't comfortable cracking more and more cards from the 52 set. I kept Campanella, Pee Wee Reese, Eddie Mathews, and a few other HOFers and high numbers in their slabs. What I am probably going to do is buy reprints of these cards to add to my binder so I don't have all those unsightly blank spaces.



I guess where I am now, is that I have set an unofficial personal threshold for slabbed / raw that I follow as best as possible, knowing I have to be flexible when the opportunity for a good deal arises. For instance, my 52 Wilhelm was purchased raw and is in the binder, while my 52 Robin Roberts is graded, even though the Wilhelm is more valuable.



At the end of the day I guess it depends on your collecting goals. I will be leaving my collection to my wife and/or kids and realize that it will most likely be much easier for my daughters to sell high value cards that are graded than if they were raw.



I feel like I'm talking in circles now, but the essence of it all is to store and display in the way that will give you the most enjoyment, and help you meet your collecting goals. If you do go the binder route, I highly recommend the lighthouse binders with slipcases that are available on Amazon. They are more expensive, but very solid structure, and the slipcase not only keeps dust off, but allows you to store with the ring on top and pages dangling to guards against bending / folding. I've been very pleased.

Man that looks amazing! I love that binder. I've got about 30 cards so far, all graded. What do you think about me cracking out the commons? I'm gonna keep the two HOFers I have graded. I like the idea of filling the holes with replicas!

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[Cmvorce]

Originally Posted by Mbjerry

Man that looks amazing! I love that binder. I've got about 30 cards so far, all graded. What do you think about me cracking out the commons? I'm gonna keep the two HOFers I have graded. I like the idea of filling the holes with replicas!

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I would crack the commons and keep the top tier HOFers in slabs.

[jayshum]

Originally Posted by Cmvorce

I feel like I'm talking in circles now, but the essence of it all is to store and display in the way that will give you the most enjoyment, and help you meet your collecting goals. If you do go the binder route, I highly recommend the lighthouse binders with slipcases that are available on Amazon. They are more expensive, but very solid structure, and the slipcase not only keeps dust off, but allows you to store with the ring on top and pages dangling to guards against bending / folding. I've been very pleased.

Those are nice looking binders, but they are definitely expensive. About how many 8 or 9 pocket sheets can you put into one them?

[Cmvorce]

Originally Posted by jayshum

Those are nice looking binders, but they are definitely expensive. About how many 8 or 9 pocket sheets can you put into one them?

I have 51 8-pocket pages fitting comfortably (I don’t have all the high numbers yet so about 8-9 pages are relatively empty).

[bobsbbcards]

When I feel like flipping through an album, I don't even have to leave my couch.

1956 Topps Album

[Mbjerry]

Originally Posted by bobsbbcards

When I feel like flipping through an album, I don't even have to leave my couch.



1956 Topps Album

Wow... That is incredible

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[jayshum]

Originally Posted by bobsbbcards

When I feel like flipping through an album, I don't even have to leave my couch.

1956 Topps Album

Bob, it looks like your 56 set is just as nice as your 52 set.

[YazFenway08]

I used to see ultra pro (I think) 4 pocket pages that had “compartments” or recessed slots for graded cards….they would snap in. Seemed a better option than the regular 4 pocket pages. Did they stop making these? Any other options that folks here like? I see options on eBay but not sure they are reputable.

Also not sure if those are “universal”…they seem geared only to PSA amd not the other TPGs.

I collect vintage sets the way other have posted…nice raw commons and typically the top 8-12 cards in each set graded. I think a regular binder should be big enough to house the raw commons in regular ultra pro sheets and 2-3 of those “snap-tight” graded sheets…if I can ever find good ones