Were the T210's actually a 1910 issue or were they issued in 1911?

Pat R · #1 11-05-2021, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldeboo

Interesting, thanks for sharing.

So if the all 48 subjects group from T206 was shipping mid March 1910, that aligns well with the Old Mill ads that mention "baseball pictures" in early March 1910 and can be seen through mid August 1910. That ad seems to vanish, then reappears only a few weeks later down in Texas with a mention of "Texas League baseball pictures." The earlier "baseball pictures" ad seems to never surface again, and the "Texas League baseball pictures" are promoted heavily from early September 1910 through early December 1910.

Ads for Piedmont "baseball pictures" begin to surface in the southern states in late February 1910 and are heavy through September 1910. The same ad pops up less frequently through November 1910. The Piedmont "baseball pictures" were still being promoted while the Old Mill "baseball pictures" were replaced by the "Texas League baseball pictures."

My theory would be that T210 was regionally distributed with a heavy focus on that three month window in late 1910. T210 very well may have been distributed well into 1911 until stock vanished. If T210 was being distributed regionally, it makes sense that it would have been distributed around the same time. Did a series or two fall outside of that window? Maybe...

Looking at the possibility of regional distribution for T210 makes even more sense when you look at the leagues and locations compared to pop reports. Having less known examples of cards from places like rural Kentucky and West Virginia adds up. There is a pretty solid correlation there I believe.

That add actually ran until September 29 1910 the ledger page says that they discontinued packing them in December 1910 the ads and the ledger pages coincide with the Texas League ads and pretty close to the baseball pictures ad. So they were distributing the old mill T206's until the end of 1910 if the T210's were distributed in 1910 they would of been competing with the T206's for distribution in the Old Mill packs.

Many of the Southern League players in the T206 set are depicted on their teams from the prior year.

oldeboo · #2 11-05-2021, 10:19 PM

Even if that's the case, the "Texas League baseball pictures" ad stood alone for all of October, November, and into December. You believe the "Texas League baseball pictures" is in reference to 6 Texas League players in T206 as opposed to the 95 card(I believe) T210 series 3 that featured only Texas League players?

Is it known that only those 6 players were distributed in Texas? Or would your odds be 6/48(12.5%) to get a Texas League card? Why the sudden need to switch from "baseball pictures" to "Texas League baseball pictures" in the middle or end of an advertising campaign to highlight 6 cards only in Texas?

Edit to add: I found that September 28 "baseball pictures" ad now. So we have "baseball pictures" from early March 1910 through late September 1910 and "Texas League baseball pictures" from early September 1910 through early December 1910. The questions above still remain.

Pat R · #3 11-05-2021, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldeboo

Even if that's the case, the "Texas League baseball pictures" ad stood alone for all of October, November, and into December. You believe the "Texas League baseball pictures" is in reference to 6 Texas League players in T206 as opposed to the 95 card(I believe) T210 series 3 that featured only Texas League players?

Is it known that only those 6 players were distributed in Texas? Or would your odds be 6/48(12.5%) to get a Texas League card? Why the sudden need to switch from "baseball pictures" to "Texas League baseball pictures" in the middle or end of an advertising campaign to highlight 6 cards only in Texas?

Edit to add: I found that September 28 "baseball pictures" ad now. So we have "baseball pictures" from early March 1910 through late September 1910 and "Texas League baseball pictures" from early September 1910 through early December 1910. The questions above still remain.

I don't have an answer if only Texas League players were distributed in Texas Trey but there were 26 different style ads and both the baseball player an Texas League ads were the same except the wording and both ads show t206 cards.

Here's a picture of one pair and a thread I started on them.
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https://www.net54baseball.com/showth...light=Old+Mill

I'm not saying this is definitive proof that the T210's were distributed in 1911 but I try to keep an open mind when doing research. On more than one occasion dates that started out as estimates and eventually were taken as facts have been proven incorrect and I think the newspaper articles and the known dates of the Old Mill distribution of the T206's is enough evidence to question the dates on the T210's.

oldeboo · #4 11-06-2021, 12:11 AM

I completely agree about having an open mind. Raise questions and try to figure them out is the best we can do. In my opinion, I just see more evidence towards T210 being a mostly 1910 distribution and I think there is a good chance the "Texas League baseball players" is a solid clue.

Thanks for sharing that link. There seems to be something interesting going on, especially with the Texas League P350s.

I know one thing with absolute certainty. I would have been completely pissed off if I was told I was getting Texas League cards and then there were only 6 of them and I only had a 12.5% chance of getting one. I would have been switching brands.

Since this is essentially an Old Mill discussion, and these nuggets of information are intertwined, do you have an opinion on the third version of that Old Mill ad from Hawaii? Maybe there are other locations, but haven't seen them. I'm sure you're aware of this version. I believe it ran for a decent amount of time in the summer of 1911. It removes the mention of baseball pictures, but still shows T206 inside an Old Mill pack. A case of false advertising or do you think it's connected to something? One of the regular OM print runs maybe?

Steve D · #5 11-06-2021, 03:57 AM

Here's a previous thread about T210s that might provide some help/insight:

https://www.net54baseball.com/showth...=t210+cy+young

Steve

oldeboo · #6 11-06-2021, 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve D

Here's a previous thread about T210s that might provide some help/insight:

https://www.net54baseball.com/showth...=t210+cy+young

Steve

Nice thread with some solid information.

To expand on your post a tad, here is a clipping that discusses the Virginia Valley League photographs.

Pat R · #7 11-06-2021, 08:07 AM

We just have different opinions on what the evidence is telling us Trey no problem there.

Awhile back I asked about the Cabinets mentioned on the Old Mill ledger pageI think you could send in for them or the way it reads they were also in the cartons.

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I just found this newspaper clip and to me it suggest there was enough interest in the cabinets to inspire them to start making the T210's.

December 12 1910 Greenville News
The_Greenville_News_Mon__Dec_12__1910_.jpg

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