2022 Baseball Hall of Fame - tracker

Bigdaddy · #1 01-25-2022, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HOF Auto Rookies

No chance Aaron is better than Bonds. Not even close. It's more than stats.

You're right, it's more than stats. Let's revisit how Barry's ignorance/arrogance lost the NLCS to the Braves in 1992, by not being able to throw out Sid Bream, the slowest runner in the history of runners, at home on a base hit. And this was before the 'roid usage in SF. From Wikipedia (with references):

"On the third pitch, with Belinda behind, 2-0, Cabrera ripped a foul line drive to left field. After the play, Van Slyke and Bonds got into a brief argument as Van Slyke signaled to the left fielder to move in so he could cut off a potential single and keep the runners from scoring; Bonds gave Van Slyke the finger and refused to move.[16][23][24] Sure enough, Cabrera again lined a pitch to left that dropped in front of Bonds for a hit.[25] Justice scored from third easily, which tied the game.[16][21][24] Bonds came up with the ball, but was out of position and had to throw across his body.[24][25] Third base coach Jimy Williams spotted this as Bream, running on five-times surgically repaired knees and thus, one of the slowest baserunners in the league, got to him at third. Williams decided to wave Bream in, thinking the off balance throw might not reach catcher Mike LaValliere in time for him to tag the slow-footed first baseman. Bonds' throw was indeed offline, which caused LaValliere to move to his right to field the ball just before Bream got to the plate. The extra motion allowed Bream to slide in ahead of LaValliere's tag, and the Braves won, 3–2.[16]"

Barry did things at the plate that I've never seen anyone else do. But Barry always put Barry first, and in a team game, that doesn't fly. And I don't know how stats measure that. So you are right, his measure is beyond stats.

Peter_Spaeth · #2 01-25-2022, 11:05 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgjIVvEQo_o

Look to me like the ball wasn't hit in front of Bonds but well to his left.

HOF Auto Rookies · #3 01-26-2022, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgjIVvEQo_o

Look to me like the ball wasn't hit in front of Bonds but well to his left.

Yep. Not even CLOSE. He's well out of the frame and runs quite a bit. If he played in, that ball goes to the wall and he has no chance to cut it off like he barely did.

HOF Auto Rookies · #4 01-26-2022, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigdaddy

You're right, it's more than stats. Let's revisit how Barry's ignorance/arrogance lost the NLCS to the Braves in 1992, by not being able to throw out Sid Bream, the slowest runner in the history of runners, at home on a base hit. And this was before the 'roid usage in SF. From Wikipedia (with references):

"On the third pitch, with Belinda behind, 2-0, Cabrera ripped a foul line drive to left field. After the play, Van Slyke and Bonds got into a brief argument as Van Slyke signaled to the left fielder to move in so he could cut off a potential single and keep the runners from scoring; Bonds gave Van Slyke the finger and refused to move.[16][23][24] Sure enough, Cabrera again lined a pitch to left that dropped in front of Bonds for a hit.[25] Justice scored from third easily, which tied the game.[16][21][24] Bonds came up with the ball, but was out of position and had to throw across his body.[24][25] Third base coach Jimy Williams spotted this as Bream, running on five-times surgically repaired knees and thus, one of the slowest baserunners in the league, got to him at third. Williams decided to wave Bream in, thinking the off balance throw might not reach catcher Mike LaValliere in time for him to tag the slow-footed first baseman. Bonds' throw was indeed offline, which caused LaValliere to move to his right to field the ball just before Bream got to the plate. The extra motion allowed Bream to slide in ahead of LaValliere's tag, and the Braves won, 3�2.[16]"

Barry did things at the plate that I've never seen anyone else do. But Barry always put Barry first, and in a team game, that doesn't fly. And I don't know how stats measure that. So you are right, his measure is beyond stats.

If Bonds had played in that ball probably goes to the wall. Ball was hit WELL to his left (heck, you can see how long it takes him to get into frame). We all know Bonds is a dick. But this play is a bad example because the outcome most likely is the same, a run scored. But, let's not forget to give props to Bream who had a great jump as well off the bat and no hesitation rounding third. He ran the bases perfectly for someone like him.

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