Ebay tax reporting drops from $20,000 to $600

[Yoda]

With the IRS in seeming disarray and brutally short-staffed, I wonder how much attention will be paid to capital gains on the sale of baseball cards. I have to believe the IRS with be looking hard at Covid relief funds fraud and where that money went. Who knows.

[Dandor]

I used to sell items like old cell phones and other items I sold at a loss on eBay. Like a garage sale. I am not dealing with eBay anymore with the new rules. Proving I paid $200 for a $50 cell phone sale is impossible and with a 1099-k form the effort of dealing with taxes is not worth my time. Selling a few thousand dollars of items at a loss shouldn't involve me starting a business or calling the IRS and saying everything is itemized on a schedule D.

[bnorth]

You guys are looking at this all wrong. This is a government program to get more business for those poor underpaid tax professionals. Just wait till you don't pay a tax professional a few thousand for that $125 of profit you made selling $1000 worth of old no longer wanted junk on eBay and get audited.

It is a win win for everyone.

[Dandor]

Originally Posted by bnorth

You guys are looking at this all wrong. This is a government program to get more business for those poor underpaid tax professionals. Just wait till you don't pay a tax professional a few thousand for that $125 of profit you made selling $1000 worth of old no longer wanted junk on eBay and get audited.

It is a win win for everyone.

No one will get audited for this. The IRS doesn't care about a few thousand dollars. What will happen is people will ignore the 1099-K and the IRS will just send out a bill for what you owe on taxes on the 1099-K without deductions considered. You can then amend your taxes, but that will be an absolute nightmare. This will be an automated process, especially with the insane amount of 1099-K forms from eBay, PayPal, Etsy, etc...

Now the people who should worry are the ones who skirted taxes who fell under the 200 transaction limits! It is just not $20,000 in sales, it is $20,000 AND 200 transactions! You could have sold $750,000 in cards on eBay and not have a 1099-K form. With this information now, the IRS will look at these big individual sellers that receive 1099-K forms in 2023 and could audit them. This could lead to some people facing big legal issues.

I can't wait until 2023! The 1099-K forms will be entertainment to me!

[BobC]

Originally Posted by bnorth

You guys are looking at this all wrong. This is a government program to get more business for those poor underpaid tax professionals. Just wait till you don't pay a tax professional a few thousand for that $125 of profit you made selling $1000 worth of old no longer wanted junk on eBay and get audited.

It is a win win for everyone.

Actually no. Back during the start of Reagan's second term in office they proposed a major tax bill called the Tax Reform Act of 1986. The first time Reagan appeared on TV to talk about it they had a copy of the proposed new law sitting on a small table next the podium, and the damn thing was well over 1,000 pages thick. It was ultimately passed into law as the Tax Reform Act of 1986. They actually had to create and pass this new law to try and correct and make up for some earlier stupid tax legislation that had gotten passed back in '80-'81, not long after Reagan took office. And typical government way of doing things, they went way too far in the other direction to try and fix their earlier screw-ups, and ended up making things possibly more convoluted and worse than before, and literally ravaged the commercial real estate market nationwide for the next four years or so, and directly led to the downfall of numerous savings and loans businesses and other lendors across the country.

After all that, friends and colleagues I knew in the industry, including myself, all started referring to the newly passed law as the All Employment Act for Accountants and Attorneys of 1986. Now that was a government program that created way more work than anyone ever expected! This new crap will be a pain, but not like that was back in the late '80s.

[JustinD]

Originally Posted by Dandor

I used to sell items like old cell phones and other items I sold at a loss on eBay. Like a garage sale. I am not dealing with eBay anymore with the new rules. Proving I paid $200 for a $50 cell phone sale is impossible and with a 1099-k form the effort of dealing with taxes is not worth my time. Selling a few thousand dollars of items at a loss shouldn't involve me starting a business or calling the IRS and saying everything is itemized on a schedule D.

Bingo, Whenever one of these post goes up the antennas start wiggling on all the virtue signalers all at once and they start answering from a tiny perspective of card dealer and refusing to to think of the collector that has 35-40+ years of collection and no records because it was joy, not business or investment.

[Dandor]

Originally Posted by JustinD

Bingo, Whenever one of these post goes up the antennas start wiggling on all the virtue signalers all at once and they start answering from a tiny perspective of card dealer and refusing to to think of the collector that has 35-40+ years of collection and no records because it was joy, not business or investment.

This really just hurts individual states. Tax is collected on these sales in most states, eBay is taxed for profit, and most people that sell spend that money and pay sales tax again on another item. I get that there are people that skirted the rules, but this is just ridiculous at $600.

[Johnny630]

Any electronic payment whether friends and family or goods and services has to be reported as income if it was a sale of a card......has something changed here other than a form. I always report friends and family transactions through PayPal that were card related. Those funds get directly deposit into my checking account. Isn't that an electronic paper trail? Why would I not report this ?? Am I the dummy who shouldn't been reporting this?

[Dandor]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

Any electronic payment whether friends and family or goods and services has to be reported as income if it was a sale of a card......it's never changed. I always report friends and family transactions through paypal that were card related. Those funds get directly deposit the funds into my checking account. Why would I not report this ?? Am the dummy who shouldn't been reporting this?

Of course, this is what you are supposed to do. How did you do this though? Did you file a Schedule D or Schedule C with the IRS? If you did this as a "hobby" you probably did it wrong. There are absolutely no deductions for a hobby, even though people take them. If you bought a card for $500 and sold it for $400, you would need to pay taxes on the $400 even though you sold it at a loss. For people that don't believe me, just wait until 2023 and you get a 1099-K form. Good luck trying make any deductions with the hobby form.

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by Dandor

Of course, this is what you are supposed to do. How did you do this though? Did you file a Schedule D or Schedule C with the IRS? If you did this as a "hobby" you probably did it wrong. There are absolutely no deductions for a hobby, even though people take them. If you bought a card for $500 and sold it for $400, you would need to pay taxes on the $400 even though you sold it at a loss. For people that don't believe me, just wait until 2023 and you get a 1099-K form. Good luck trying make any deductions with the hobby form.

I hire a tax professional. It's worth my piece of mind to hire one and pay him accordingly.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by Dandor

Of course, this is what you are supposed to do. How did you do this though? Did you file a Schedule D or Schedule C with the IRS? If you did this as a "hobby" you probably did it wrong. There are absolutely no deductions for a hobby, even though people take them. If you bought a card for $500 and sold it for $400, you would need to pay taxes on the $400 even though you sold it at a loss. For people that don't believe me, just wait until 2023 and you get a 1099-K form. Good luck trying make any deductions with the hobby form.

I don't even know where to start on this one, as there is much wrong, and I'm tired of typing and missing out on some Call of Duty MWII. Go back and read through my other posts in this thread, and/or do a search for other posts of mine in different threads talking about taxes and implications for people in our hobby. There are many, and they are often detailed and very long. But they are pretty much accurate and informative, at least until they change the laws again, which they are constantly doing.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by Yoda

With the IRS in seeming disarray and brutally short-staffed, I wonder how much attention will be paid to capital gains on the sale of baseball cards. I have to believe the IRS with be looking hard at Covid relief funds fraud and where that money went. Who knows.

John, you're probably more on point with this than you may think. The trick is to not ignore these 1099-K forms people are going to get, and make sure they are properly being reported on their tax returns so that they match up with IRS info, and don't run afoul and get bounced by the IRS' automated system. It likely won't be triggering tons of audits. And for long time collectors who don't have complete and perfect cost basis data, I suggest using your best and most reasonable estimates for costs and basis, and just be sure to start keeping better records going forward.

Now as for specifically looking hardest for covid relief fraud, I think their biggest problem and concern currently is exactly the same as it is for PSA, trying to catch up on their backlog of work. LOL

[FrankWakefield]

My recollection of the 1986 legislation was that it was called The Tax Reform Act of 1986. I think the simplification act was when President Clinton was in office. BobC, does that sound right, or were there multiple 1986 acts, or what??

[BobC]

Originally Posted by FrankWakefield

My recollection of the 1986 legislation was that it was called The Tax Reform Act of 1986. I think the simplification act was when President Clinton was in office. BobC, does that sound right, or were there multiple 1986 acts, or what??

Ha ha, you might be right Frank, it's getting late and I'm getting old. My point was still valid regarding all the work it created and what we were calling it. I may have to go back and amend my post. Thanks.

[FrankWakefield]

I had a tax professor who left the classroom for a couple of weeks to go to DC to help with the Tax Reform Act of 1986. And when that Act became law it set things in motion that culminated in the greatest loss of life of Americans ever, occurring on April 15, 1987.

Just over 5 million Americans vanished. Before the Tax Reform Act of 1986, someone filing a 1040 just listed a number for minor children in the household. But the TRA of 86 placed a requirement of listing a minor child's SS# on the new returns. Taking into consideration that 17 year olds from the previous year would have turned 18, and subtracting out newborn children for that tax year, the returns filed in 1987 showed that there were just over 5 million kids who were claimed as dependents the previous year and who should be showing up on the 1987 returns for tax year 1986, but no one claimed them. Those kids vanished.

In the old days newborns didn't get a SS# application sent in as part of being in the hospital. I didn't. A few years after my (younger) brother was born, I recall Dad showing me that a SS card had arrived in the mail for me. Mom and Dad applied for both of us. Dad kept up with the cards, I was maybe 8 or 9, and if I'd gotten it then I'd have lost it. My brother and I have consecutive SS#s. About 30 years later my twins are born, the hospital is getting info for SS applications, and when their cards arrive their numbers are quite different. My old card has a line on it on the front, "not to be used for identification purposes," which greatly amuses me because that's exactly how it's used and they no longer put that on the cards.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by FrankWakefield

I had a tax professor who left the classroom for a couple of weeks to go to DC to help with the Tax Reform Act of 1986. And when that Act became law it set things in motion that culminated in the greatest loss of life of Americans ever, occurring on April 15, 1987.

Just over 5 million Americans vanished. Before the Tax Reform Act of 1986, someone filing a 1040 just listed a number for minor children in the household. But the TRA of 86 placed a requirement of listing a minor child's SS# on the new returns. Taking into consideration that 17 year olds from the previous year would have turned 18, and subtracting out newborn children for that tax year, the returns filed in 1987 showed that there were just over 5 million kids who were claimed as dependents the previous year and who should be showing up on the 1987 returns for tax year 1986, but no one claimed them. Those kids vanished.

In the old days newborns didn't get a SS# application sent in as part of being in the hospital. I didn't. A few years after my (younger) brother was born, I recall Dad showing me that a SS card had arrived in the mail for me. Mom and Dad applied for both of us. Dad kept up with the cards, I was maybe 8 or 9, and if I'd gotten it then I'd have lost it. My brother and I have consecutive SS#s. About 30 years later my twins are born, the hospital is getting info for SS applications, and when their cards arrive their numbers are quite different. My old card has a line on it on the front, "not to be used for identification purposes," which greatly amuses me because that's exactly how it's used and they no longer put that on the cards.

I remember those days Frank, forgot about that sudden loss of kids being claimed as dependents. That was another crazy result from that 1986 tax act being passed. Nowadays a baby doesn't leave the hospital without a social security number at least being applied for.

Do you remember the phase-in/phase-out of certain deductions created by the Reform Act, or the impact the brand new Passive Loss Rule had on the nation's economy? Ugh!!! People often look back at how after the 2008 mortgage loan debacle the government stepped in to save businesses and our economy, and may think of that as the first time our government has had to cross the line and directly take over and deal with private businesses like that, at least since the Great Depression. They may have forgotten what happened after the Tax Reform Act of 1986 was passed and the feds had to form the Resolution Trust Corporation to deal with the aftermath of that legislation.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by BobC

I remember those days Frank, forgot about that sudden loss of kids being claimed as dependents. That was another crazy result from that 1986 tax act being passed. Nowadays a baby doesn't leave the hospital without a social security number at least being applied for.

.........

Are social security applications available on the Rio Grande?