Ryan and run support

[Jim65]

Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh

To Jim65-

1) "I just don't believe he's an all time great"

2) TWICE parsing the word "phenomenal"

These are YOUR takes not mine, and they are indefensible.

1. Walter Johnson, Christy Mathewson, Greg Maddux, Tom Seaver, Lefty Grove are All-Time greats, Nolan Ryan is a notch below. Why is that an insult? Thats a pretty good place to be.

2. This point is beyond ridiculous, Calling something phenomenal is an opinion, not a fact. A poster saidI a 112 ERA+ is phenomenal. I disagreed. Hes not wrong, Im not wrong. Its opinion.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Jim65

2. This point is beyond ridiculous, Calling something phenomenal is an opinion, not a fact. A poster saidI a 112 ERA+ is phenomenal. I disagreed. Hes not wrong, Im not wrong. Its opinion.

For the tenth time, this did not happen. I said a 112 ERA+ is phenomenal in the context of one of the longest careers in baseball history. I specified this again and again while you keep alleging I made a different argument. I get it, it’s easier to argue against what you would have preferred I said. Phenomenal is an opinion, we can disagree, but you would seem more reasonable if you stopped lying about what was said.

[Jim65]

Originally Posted by G1911

For the tenth time, this did not happen. I said a 112 ERA+ is phenomenal in the context of one of the longest careers in baseball history. I specified this again and again while you keep alleging I made a different argument. I get it, it’s easier to argue against what you would have preferred I said. Phenomenal is an opinion, we can disagree, but you would seem more reasonable if you stopped lying about what was said.

Nolans ERA+ of 112 is the stat for his entire career. Nolan had 14 seasons when his ERA+ was below 112. You probably think thats phenomenal too, right?

Tommy John basically accomplished the same career stat 26 years and 111 ERA+ and he can't even get in the HOF. Is that phenomenal? Or amazing? Or unheard of?

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Jim65

Nolans ERA+ of 112 is the stat for his entire career. Nolan had 14 seasons when his ERA+ was below 112. You probably think thats phenomenal too, right?

Tommy John basically accomplished the same career stat 26 years and 111 ERA+ and he can't even get in the HOF. Is that phenomenal? Or amazing? Or unheard of?

Yes, he had some years better and some years below his career average. Like literally every single pitcher in baseball history who played more than a year or two. If you rank Ryan by his worst seasons he sucks. No shit.

I already answered paragraph 2 earlier about John. I have no idea why you think “unheard of” is a synonym for “phenomenal”. I already linked you to the dictionary earlier. Literally no player in history had a career that is “unheard of”. This is an absurd red herring.

I get it. Nolan is overrated. I’ve annoyed a few people here saying it too. But I don’t see a reasonable argument that he wasn’t phenomenal. Ripken, Jeter, they are also overrated and had phenomenal careers You haven’t made an argument, you just claim I said things I didn’t say and then say this statement you invented is wrong. We can debate where the boundary should be. We can debate his career. But you just keep making things up and claiming I said things I did not say. It’s a public transcript, we can all read it. Argue on the strength of your own argument instead of inventing arguments to argue against that were not made by anyone.

[jingram058]

How many no-hitters did Ryan throw, 7? Who's next behind him? How many 1-hitters did Ryan throw? I don't know, just asking. My dad, who loved baseball, thought Dizzy Dean (before he had his toe broken by Earl Averill), Sandy Koufax, Bob Feller and Nolan Ryan were the best pitchers he ever saw. That's good enough for me.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by jingram058

How many no-hitters did Ryan throw, 7? Who's next behind him? How many 1-hitters did Ryan throw? I don't know, just asking. My dad, who loved baseball, thought Dizzy Dean (before he had his toe broken by Earl Averill), Sandy Koufax, Bob Feller and Nolan Ryan were the best pitchers he ever saw. That's good enough for me.

Ryan had 7 no-hitters. I looked it up, and there are only 8 active pitchers with 7 or more shutouts for their entire career.

This record is about as unbeatable as Cy Young's 511 Wins now. Pretty sure we'll still have this one in the record book in 2122

[BCauley]

Originally Posted by jingram058

How many no-hitters did Ryan throw, 7? Who's next behind him? How many 1-hitters did Ryan throw? I don't know, just asking.

I actually just saw this somewhere the other day. Found a source after looking again and put the link below.

Koufax is next with 4 no-hitters and four other pitchers have 3 no-hitters (Cy Young, Larry Corcoran, Bob Feller, and Justin Verlander).

For Nolan Ryan and the other question you asked:

7 no-hitters
12 one-hitters
18 two-hitters

https://www.mlb.com/news/nolan-ryan-...tats-and-facts

[ClementeFanOh]

Bill- that's great information, thanks for looking it up. Be ready for some
posters to somehow downplay those results, and insist that Nolan Ryan
"isn't an all-time great". It takes all kinds, I guess... Trent King