Question on Authentic grades at SGC

[skelly423]

Is the Authentic designation ever used for unaltered original cards (ie. can I submit a card and request that it not be graded, that it just receive an A designation)? I'm looking at a few SGC cards and can't see anything obviously wrong with any of them, and I'm wondering if this is a possibility.

Thanks in advance.

[vthobby]

I do find it very interesting that SGC on their very own grading explanation page of all the grades (well not all) lol refuses to list the "A" nor do they explain it. Not right in my opinion.

I've found cards that were clearly unaltered and maybe severely miscut that have gotten the "A" grade.

This is their incomplete grading page:

https://www.gosgc.com/card-grading/submissions

For all that SGC does well and correctly (and its alot of things), this is an area they have been lax in explaining.

mike

[bobbyw8469]

"A" is supposed to mean cards that have an issue. Maybe trimming?? Maybe color touch?? I do know this. I have had SGC "A" cards receive a number grade from another grading company.

[nineunder71]

Here’s an example Mike

This is SGC A

Sean,
I don’t think so to answer your question. Usually either a believed slight trim, hand-cut, a mis-cut, or alteration like color added etc are usually the culprit when it looks too good to be true.

I don’t mind the mis-cuts or the hand-cuts graded A by SGC at all. I actually love the few Cycle 350 Hand-cut SGC A’s that I have, and nothing wrong except the wavy borders.

Also, I have submitted a lot of unaltered low grade T206s, and I almost always get 1’s.

If its A, something is perceived by the grader to be not number grade worthy.

[skelly423]

Thanks for the comments so far. Does anyone know if I can submit a card to SGC and specifically request an A grade, or is that grade reserved for cards with some flaw/defect/alteration?

[BobC]

Interesting question. I know that when it comes to grading the S74-1 white version silks that were originally issued with a paper/cardboard backing attached, SGC will only give a silk without the backing an "A" grade, despite how nice or rough the actual silk is.

Have pondered if this isn't actually a great idea. Also wondered if this wouldn't also make sense for grading other issues that are also not always seen/sold in complete and original form. Like items that were originally issued with tabs attached (Redman Tobacco, Zeenuts, etc.). Giving such cards with the tabs removed only an "A" grade would definitely let a collector know it was not as originally issued.

[gonefishin]

It's my understanding that an "A" grade would be assigned if the card is in such poor condition that a numerical grade can't be assigned.

Attached is a card that I knew would only receive an "A" grade, which I was hoping for. I cut this card from the box myself in 62/63, and am leaving it with my daughter when I'm gone. I just got it graded to protect the card.

[JollyElm]

I forwarded your question to the rep I've been talking with at SGC recently. Here's his reply:

"In general, cards can receive the authentic ("A") designation for a variety of reasons such as a failure to meet our minimum sizing requirement, the cards may have come miscut from the manufacturer, or the cards may show one or more signs of being altered and therefore, are no longer in their original state. There are also instances in which customers request their cards to be encapsulated as “authentic” even if they qualify for a numeric grade.
You can request for a card to be authenticated only. Just click on the A only option when you enter the card in your GoSGC order portal.

We take requests like this very seriously. I'll pass it on to my management team for consideration."

(That last part is in reference to the site not listing 'A' as one of its grades.)

[skelly423]

Originally Posted by JollyElm

I forwarded your question to the rep I've been talking with at SGC recently. Here's his reply:

"There are also instances in which customers request their cards to be encapsulated as “authentic” even if they qualify for a numeric grade.
You can request for a card to be authenticated only. Just click on the A only option when you enter the card in your GoSGC order portal."

.)

Thank you, that’s exactly what I was looking for

[bcbgcbrcb]

Requesting an A grade might be unusual in the vintage card world but I believe that it is extremely common in the modern and ultra-modern card world. I see countless auto/relic cards every week which have received the authentic designation for the card and either Authentic for the auto or a numerical grade for the auto. Zero chance that all of these modern and ultra-modern cards have been altered to cause the A card grade, it’s strictly at the option of the submitter who knows the card is not going to grade high due to surface issues, dinged corner, etc. and doesn’t want to present the card for sale in a 4/5/6/7 holder and rather have it say A and shrouded in mystery as to why.

[steve B]

If you check the "don't slab as A" option or however it's worded now, you used to get a slip with comments explaining why.

Most I've had rejected would easily fit on the flip if they really wanted to. And if they did I'd have them slabbed. But they won't, so....

This is all factory, but the top and bottom cuts are very rough. Probably done shortly before the cutter blade got sharpened. They're more crushed than cut.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by steve B

If you check the "don't slab as A" option or however it's worded now, you used to get a slip with comments explaining why.

Most I've had rejected would easily fit on the flip if they really wanted to. And if they did I'd have them slabbed. But they won't, so....

This is all factory, but the top and bottom cuts are very rough. Probably done shortly before the cutter blade got sharpened. They're more crushed than cut.

Now that is sad. You would think that if anything, such a rough cut would actually be positive evidence that the card was as originally cut at the factory, and more original than ever. A card doctor, or someone else trying to trim a card today, would in all likelihood not have intentionally created such a rough edge. Also, shouldn't the TPGs be able to closely examine the edges to determine if there was normal, visible aging, and not what appears to be recently cut edges? Card production, modern versus vintage, has clearly incurred huge changes to the production processes. You would obviously never expect to see such a rough edge on a modern card. Vintage cards, especially when talking 100+ old, that is an entirely different story. To me this displays a possible lack of training on the part of TPG graders, or perhaps a potential laziness to do a little more work to satisfy the authenticity or unaltered status of older vintage cards. But they kept the money you gave them, didn't they?

Let that, along with contingent fees where TPGs charge based on the value of the cards they're grading, or that owners/employees of TPGs have their own cards graded there, speak for itself in regards to the TPG industry as a whole, and their honesty, reliability, and transparency.