Rod Carew "speaking out - to the commissioner"

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by butchie_t

. Someone puts a shift on, FREAKING LEARN TO HIT THE BALL WHERE THEY AIN’T and quit bitching about the shift……

Do you think no one has ever considered this? Have you ever asked yourself why thousands of high level professional baseball people have never tried what you're suggesting? Or is it possible that maybe they HAVE considered it and know that it either doesn't work or actually benefits the defense?

Hint: it's not that they haven't thought of your suggestion.

[Snapolit1]

More pitches. Less contact. Doesn’t have a damn thing to do with bunting or guys not learning (wrong) baseball strategy.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by Tabe

Do you think no one has ever considered this? Have you ever asked yourself why thousands of high level professional baseball people have never tried what you're suggesting? Or is it possible that maybe they HAVE considered it and know that it either doesn't work or actually benefits the defense?

Hint: it's not that they haven't thought of your suggestion.

sometimes it can take years to implement...launch angles were discussed for 20 years and exit velocities as well...heck even analytics for 50 years...cant just flip a switch

you make more money hitting single into the hole of the defense or make more money hitting 25 homers doing it the other way which may not translate to wins perhaps but will make you more money.....

i dont know which way will lead to wins, but i do think you go to give more time to let it play out.. NBA used to have illegal defense rule with a zone defense and got rid of it..

[butchie_t]

Originally Posted by Tabe

Do you think no one has ever considered this? Have you ever asked yourself why thousands of high level professional baseball people have never tried what you're suggesting? Or is it possible that maybe they HAVE considered it and know that it either doesn't work or actually benefits the defense?

Hint: it's not that they haven't thought of your suggestion.

How much do they get paid to hit a ball?

Hint: More than enough to figure it out and do it.

Butch

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by butchie_t

How much do they get paid to hit a ball?

Hint: More than enough to figure it out and do it.

Butch

I mean this in all seriousness: have you ever given any serious thought to why they don't do what you're suggesting?

[z28jd]

Originally Posted by Tabe

I mean this in all seriousness: have you ever given any serious thought to why they don't do what you're suggesting?

Joey Gallo said he gets paid to hit doubles and homers so he doesn't even try to go the other way. I would say that other players feel the exact same way. He wouldn't even need to learn to go the other way. He could bunt for hits a few times and it will stop. Heck, with how far they play him off of the third base line, he could get some doubles on a good bunt. He could even put the odds in his favor by using a bat with a bigger barrel to bunt. Since he's not swinging it, who cares if it is heavier. If they give you a hit, take it. Make them adjust to you.

The shift is easy to beat if you want to beat it, but current hitters have the caveman mentality of swing hard and hope for the best. As someone who gets paid to watch minor league baseball, I can tell you without a doubt that it's only going to get worse. There are very few hitters with a nice approach at the plate and even less who change their approach in situations, and no one ever has a two-strike approach anymore. That mindset doesn't exist.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by z28jd

Joey Gallo said he gets paid to hit doubles and homers so he doesn't even try to go the other way. I would say that other players feel the exact same way. He wouldn't even need to learn to go the other way. He could bunt for hits a few times and it will stop. Heck, with how far they play him off of the third base line, he could get some doubles on a good bunt. He could even put the odds in his favor by using a bat with a bigger barrel to bunt. Since he's not swinging it, who cares if it is heavier. If they give you a hit, take it. Make them adjust to you.

The shift is easy to beat if you want to beat it, but current hitters have the caveman mentality of swing hard and hope for the best. As someone who gets paid to watch minor league baseball, I can tell you without a doubt that it's only going to get worse. There are very few hitters with a nice approach at the plate and even less who change their approach in situations, and no one ever has a two-strike approach anymore. That mindset doesn't exist.

comes down to owner and payroll, if you willing to pay more money for hitters to beat shift they will, I assume they spending money on how to win games and/or bring people to games.

The NBA used to be not pay three point shooters (and thats all they shoot) who play defense the amount of money they pay now....we will see if beating the shift specialists get more money

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by z28jd

Joey Gallo said he gets paid to hit doubles and homers so he doesn't even try to go the other way. I would say that other players feel the exact same way. He wouldn't even need to learn to go the other way. He could bunt for hits a few times and it will stop. Heck, with how far they play him off of the third base line, he could get some doubles on a good bunt. He could even put the odds in his favor by using a bat with a bigger barrel to bunt. Since he's not swinging it, who cares if it is heavier. If they give you a hit, take it. Make them adjust to you.

The shift is easy to beat if you want to beat it, but current hitters have the caveman mentality of swing hard and hope for the best. As someone who gets paid to watch minor league baseball, I can tell you without a doubt that it's only going to get worse. There are very few hitters with a nice approach at the plate and even less who change their approach in situations, and no one ever has a two-strike approach anymore. That mindset doesn't exist.

My guess is most teams have hired a literal genius to crunch the numbers and attempt what you’re suggesting and the analytics based on thousands and thousands of outcomes has said the team is better off not doing it. I like Buck as Manager on the Mets because he’s a bit old school but even he is doing math on games. If you toss the math aside over the course of the season that could hurt a little.

[z28jd]

Originally Posted by Carter08

My guess is most teams have hired a literal genius to crunch the numbers and attempt what you’re suggesting and the analytics based on thousands and thousands of outcomes has said the team is better off not doing it. I like Buck as Manager on the Mets because he’s a bit old school but even he is doing math on games. If you toss the math aside over the course of the season that could hurt a little.

Well it is the teams that buy all in to the launch angles and exit velocities and that gets passed down to the scouts and who they look for, so of course players are going to cater to what gets them noticed, it would be dumb not to. That doesn't mean that beating the shift isn't simple, and there's no way to know what teams would then do if someone who hits homers just decided to bunt down the third base line all of the time with no one within 75 feet of the line until they adjusted to him.

Joey Gallo doesn't have to be pathetic at baseball. He chooses to be that way. He also doesn't have to whine about something he controls, but he does that too. I have no problem with the shifts at all. If someone has a major flaw, exploit it, don't cater to him. They don't let pitchers who throw 89 MPH get closer to that plate to pitch. They have to find ways to get outs.

[Snapolit1]

How come football players from the 1960s and 70s don't whine about how the game is played very differently today than when they played? Never once heard Len Dawson dumping on Patrick Mahomes for the way he plays. ("Mahomes has to learn how to run a real offense. Throwing 50 passes in the Super Bowl is not how you do it. I threw 17! Players today lack the fundamentals.")

How come no one ever complains that football teams have like 19 coaches on the side lines staring at computer data to determine what plans to run? No one bemoans analytics ruining football.

How come football announcers who are former football players don't spend all game shitting on how the game is played today like John Smoltz and many others? People like Romo actaully seem to enjoy watching the game.

How come?

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by z28jd

Joey Gallo said he gets paid to hit doubles and homers so he doesn't even try to go the other way. I would say that other players feel the exact same way. He wouldn't even need to learn to go the other way. He could bunt for hits a few times and it will stop. Heck, with how far they play him off of the third base line, he could get some doubles on a good bunt. He could even put the odds in his favor by using a bat with a bigger barrel to bunt. Since he's not swinging it, who cares if it is heavier. If they give you a hit, take it. Make them adjust to you.

The shift is easy to beat if you want to beat it, but current hitters have the caveman mentality of swing hard and hope for the best. As someone who gets paid to watch minor league baseball, I can tell you without a doubt that it's only going to get worse. There are very few hitters with a nice approach at the plate and even less who change their approach in situations, and no one ever has a two-strike approach anymore. That mindset doesn't exist.

So, if it's "easy", why is NO ONE doing it? Does every single player, coach, manager, and GM hate success? Every. Single. One?

It's a win for the defense if Joey Gallo tries to bunt. It's really that simple.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Tabe

I mean this in all seriousness: have you ever given any serious thought to why they don't do what you're suggesting?

Don't tell that to Wally Moon. In 1958 Moon had an OPS+ of 84 with the Cardinals. In the off-season he was traded to the Dodgers. With the help of Stan Musial, he adjusted his stance to hit to the opposite field to take advantage of the short left field in the LA Coliseum. From 1959-1961 he had an OPS+ of 129, 123, 142. In the LA Coliseum his OPS was .993, on the road .797. When the Dodgers moved to Chavez Ravine, Moon had OPS+ of 83, 117, 74, 69 and had an OPS of .585 at home.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by rats60

Don't tell that to Wally Moon. In 1958 Moon had an OPS+ of 84 with the Cardinals. In the off-season he was traded to the Dodgers. With the help of Stan Musial, he adjusted his stance to hit to the opposite field to take advantage of the short left field in the LA Coliseum. From 1959-1961 he had an OPS+ of 129, 123, 142. In the LA Coliseum his OPS was .993, on the road .797. When the Dodgers moved to Chavez Ravine, Moon had OPS+ of 83, 117, 74, 69 and had an OPS of .585 at home.

Wally wasn't hitting against relievers throwing 100 with command.