ROGER MARIS vs AARON JUDGE

[gonefishin]

I agree with everything that was said. Let's take a quick look at Roger's accomplishments and question should he be in the Hall of Fame. If you look at some of the recent inductees, such as Ted Simmons (no offense), it makes one question why?

x7 All Star
x3 World Series Championship Teams
x2 AL MVP
x1 Home Run Leader
x2 RBI Leader
.260 Batting Average
275 Home Runs
850 RBIs

In addition, he was a gentleman representative of the game, put up with a lot of bull shit, and sold a hell of a lot of tickets.

There are definitely a lot of players in the Hall that have accomplished less.

[Seven]

Originally Posted by gonefishin

I agree with everything that was said. Let's take a quick look at Roger's accomplishments and question should he be in the Hall of Fame. If you look at some of the recent inductees, such as Ted Simmons (no offense), it makes one question why?

x7 All Star
x3 World Series Championship Teams
x2 AL MVP
x1 Home Run Leader
x2 RBI Leader
.260 Batting Average
275 Home Runs
850 RBIs

In addition, he was a gentleman representative of the game, put up with a lot of bull shit, and sold a hell of a lot of tickets.

There are definitely a lot of players in the Hall that have accomplished less.

I don't disagree, he's certainly accomplished more than some Hall of Fame guys, I'm traditionally a "Small Hall" believer. I think it should be much more exclusive than it actually is. That ship sailed though once the cronyism of the original veterans committee started to occur.

[packs]

I think there's already a kind of precedent for his inclusion.

Hack Wilson is a HOFer. He had an out of this world season when he drove in 191 runs. Otherwise he played more incomplete seasons than complete ones and lingered around for 4 more seasons after his monster year. I don't think there is an argument to made for his HOF status without his world beater season.

Was Maris' 1961 all that different? Hitting 61 home runs was a huge deal then and remains a huge deal now. Maris did it.

This is not to say that I think Maris and Wilson have all that much in common from a numbers perspective. But I believe the magnitude of each of their signature seasons is equal. They did finish their careers with roughly the same WAR, though Wilson has better counting stats.

Wilson had another career year just prior to his 191 rbi season. Maris won the MVP in 1960 before his 61 season. There are some parallels there.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by Seven

I don't disagree, he's certainly accomplished more than some Hall of Fame guys, I'm traditionally a "Small Hall" believer. I think it should be much more exclusive than it actually is. That ship sailed though once the cronyism of the original veterans committee started to occur.

Nothing wrong with being in the top TWO Percent of the top level in the world, but he, just like many others constantly discussed, is not in the ONE percent.


IMO- the constant disclaimer.
.

[G1911]

Maris would be elected basically entirely on the strength of his home run hitting. Of which he has 275. We would need to elect a couple hundred more guys before it's watered down this far.

Hack Wilson was a mistake and his closest comparison in the Hall.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by G1911

Maris would be elected basically entirely on the strength of his home run hitting. Of which he has 275. We would need to elect a couple hundred more guys before it's watered down this far.

Hack Wilson was a mistake and his closest comparison in the Hall.

He should not even be mentioned in a HOF discussion, really. Not to take away from the record or his other few nice years.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by G1911

Maris would be elected basically entirely on the strength of his home run hitting. Of which he has 275. We would need to elect a couple hundred more guys before it's watered down this far.

Hack Wilson was a mistake and his closest comparison in the Hall.

Hack Wilson hit . 307/.395/.545 OPS+ 144
Roger Maris hit . 260/.345/.476 OPS+ 127

The comparison isn't close other than they each played only 12 seasons.

[packs]

There are similarities between their careers. I brought up Wilson because I don't think he's in the HOF without his monster record setting season. I would put Maris in for the same reason.

I don't think either had the career that would otherwise make them candidates. But one did get enshrined.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

There are similarities between their careers. I brought up Wilson because I don't think he's in the HOF without his monster record setting season. I would put Maris in for the same reason.

I don't think either had the career that would otherwise make them candidates. But one did get enshrined.

Would you put Denny McLain in?