OMG PSA slabs blatantly altered Tiger Woods rookie, then it passes ebay program

Tabe · #1 09-01-2022, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

So much for the ebay authenticity program being meaningful, if it doesn't even look at or for obvious altered cards. This card has no perforations it is as obvious a hack job as has ever existed. Look at the top edge lol. BUT the holder isn't tampered, hallelujah.

This is a little like complaining that the guy you hired to paint your house didn't also reupholster your couch. Ebay isn't judging the authenticity of the card, just that the holder itself isn't tampered with.

Of course, you already know this but for some reason you're complaining about Ebay here - who is performing a service for free - instead of PSA, who are the ones who actually screwed up AND charged for it.

G1911 · #2 09-01-2022, 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tabe

This is a little like complaining that the guy you hired to paint your house didn't also reupholster your couch. Ebay isn't judging the authenticity of the card, just that the holder itself isn't tampered with.

Of course, you already know this but for some reason you're complaining about Ebay here - who is performing a service for free - instead of PSA, who are the ones who actually screwed up AND charged for it.

eBay isn�t judging anything. PSA inspects the PSA slab to authenticate the slab while ignoring the card itself. What a useful �service� being provided.

Tabe · #3 09-01-2022, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G1911

eBay isn�t judging anything. PSA inspects the PSA slab to authenticate the slab while ignoring the card itself. What a useful �service� being provided.

Ok, so it's PSA don't the inspection. Distinction without a difference. OP is still complaining about the wrong thing.

Peter_Spaeth · #4 09-01-2022, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tabe

Ok, so it's PSA don't the inspection. Distinction without a difference. OP is still complaining about the wrong thing.

The complaint against PSA here goes without saying, I was making an additional point. But fine, yes obviously PSA effed this up badly in the first place.

G1911 · #5 09-01-2022, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tabe

Ok, so it's PSA don't the inspection. Distinction without a difference. OP is still complaining about the wrong thing.

As the OP was factually correct and you were factually wrong, it seems your complaint was the one �about the wrong thing�. You might not agree with the complaint, but it�s at least valid and not �about the wrong thing�.

Peter_Spaeth · #6 09-01-2022, 07:12 PM

Here's another casualty of the program. Someone I know had several cards he shipped to the authenticator disappear after reaching the Santa Ana post office. He was told a very large bin of cards intended for PSA or whatever pseudonym they use for their address as authenticator was stolen. So that means lots of buyers didn't get their cards at all.

bnorth · #7 09-01-2022, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Here's another casualty of the program. Someone I know had several cards he shipped to the authenticator disappear after reaching the Santa Ana post office. He was told a very large bin of cards intended for PSA or whatever pseudonym they use for their address as authenticator was stolen. So that means lots of buyers didn't get their cards at all.

Who ended up taking the hit on the money?

Peter_Spaeth · #8 09-01-2022, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnorth

Who ended up taking the hit on the money?

In my friend's case, he had an insurance policy against shipping losses. Otherwise I don't know.

Carter08 · #9 09-01-2022, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G1911

As the OP was factually correct and you were factually wrong, it seems your complaint was the one �about the wrong thing�. You might not agree with the complaint, but it�s at least valid and not �about the wrong thing�.

Sigh.

Snapolit1 · #10 09-01-2022, 07:36 PM

Breaking news. . . nothing is perfect and people make mistakes. Film at 11.

G1911 · #11 09-01-2022, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Breaking news. . . nothing is perfect and people make mistakes. Film at 11.

Do you have any example of the good this has done? Has PSA found a single fake PSA slab to remove?

Doesn�t seem like a �nothing is perfect� so much as �this does nothing but delay and possibly lose your item while adding no benefit�.

Carter08 · #12 09-01-2022, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Breaking news. . . nothing is perfect and people make mistakes. Film at 11.

You should think the worst in people to get along here.

Peter_Spaeth · #13 09-01-2022, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Breaking news. . . nothing is perfect and people make mistakes. Film at 11.

Says a man who has never posted a complaint, surely.

Tabe · #14 09-02-2022, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G1911

As the OP was factually correct and you were factually wrong, it seems your complaint was the one “about the wrong thing”. You might not agree with the complaint, but it’s at least valid and not “about the wrong thing”.

And yet, in the post right above your reply, OP agreed with me as factually correct about his post. Go figure.

G1911 · #15 09-02-2022, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tabe

And yet, in the post right above your reply, OP agreed with me as factually correct about his post. Go figure.

eBay is not performing the service you claimed; the seller ships it to PSA who does not look at the card, only the slab, performing the service. This is a fact.

Tabe · #16 09-02-2022, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G1911

eBay is not performing the service you claimed; the seller ships it to PSA who does not look at the card, only the slab, performing the service. This is a fact.

Fair enough, they are providing (while requiring) the service rather than actually performing it. The overall point I was making remains the same.

Snowman · #17 09-02-2022, 12:27 AM

I'm not so sure that it isn't accurately graded to begin with. I've seen multiple cards that typically have perforations get slabbed with numeric grades on them despite being cut with a blade just like this one was. The cards came in sheets that were intended to be removed from those sheets by the owners. Why should it matter whether someone chooses to tear it out by hand along the perforations or with a pair of scissors? I remember collecting these SI cards as a kid. I cut them out with scissors at the age of 7. Does that mean I "altered" my cards? Some of the hobby "rules" just seem completely arbitrary to me. I just don't get it. Surely there are things worth worrying about. I don't understand why this is one of those things.

Lorewalker · #18 09-02-2022, 01:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowman

I'm not so sure that it isn't accurately graded to begin with. I've seen multiple cards that typically have perforations get slabbed with numeric grades on them despite being cut with a blade just like this one was. The cards came in sheets that were intended to be removed from those sheets by the owners. Why should it matter whether someone chooses to tear it out by hand along the perforations or with a pair of scissors? I remember collecting these SI cards as a kid. I cut them out with scissors at the age of 7. Does that mean I "altered" my cards? Some of the hobby "rules" just seem completely arbitrary to me. I just don't get it. Surely there are things worth worrying about. I don't understand why this is one of those things.

Why am I not shocked you would cut out a perforated card that is meant to be removed by hand?

Peter_Spaeth · #19 09-02-2022, 08:51 AM

[QUOTE=Snowman;2259601]I'm not so sure that it isn't accurately graded to begin with. I've seen multiple cards that typically have perforations get slabbed with numeric grades on them despite being cut with a blade just like this one was. The cards came in sheets that were intended to be removed from those sheets by the owners. Why should it matter whether someone chooses to tear it out by hand along the perforations or with a pair of scissors? I remember collecting these SI cards as a kid. I cut them out with scissors at the age of 7. Does that mean I "altered" my cards? Some of the hobby "rules" just seem completely arbitrary to me. I just don't get it. Surely there are things worth worrying about. I don't understand why this is one of those things.[/QUOTEI

It isn't like Bazookas where there is a dotted line meant to be cut. There are perforations and obviously they are meant to be separated by hand, tearing along the perfs. I think it's that simple.

bnorth · #20 09-01-2022, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tabe

This is a little like complaining that the guy you hired to paint your house didn't also reupholster your couch. Ebay isn't judging the authenticity of the card, just that the holder itself isn't tampered with.

Of course, you already know this but for some reason you're complaining about Ebay here - who is performing a service for free - instead of PSA, who are the ones who actually screwed up AND charged for it.

If ypu collect PSA graded cards you need to blame it on eBay, bad eBay.

I have never understood the hate for a FREE eBay program that helps people.

ullmandds · #21 09-01-2022, 07:48 AM

this is all PSA imo...not ebay.

JustinD · #22 09-01-2022, 09:15 AM

In agreement that this one falls on PSA for 80% as I think that eBay is likely to always fall on the side of the grader so they don't create a back and forth with grading companies. I also think if they are too scared to question the grading for legal reasons, packaging should be very clearly labeled on all documentation that the card is not observed and we have only certified that the slab is untampered, that to me is the other 20%.

The other even more annoying problem to me is the sellers language:

"1996 S.I For Kids Tiger Woods Series 3 #536 Mint 9 and has already been Authenticated by PSA and Ebay which is Ebay's new policy. They work with PSA and several other graders on guaranteed certification before your card is shipped"

Everything this clown said is bulls**t. Ebay/CSG did not authenticate the card and that stupid package means jack. They also do not work with the other grading companies in any way to certify a graded card. I doubt they would even walk over to the other room to talk to a CSG grader if a CSG slab comes in. My fear was people would start using this program as an actual grading program and it should not be.

Peter_Spaeth · #23 09-01-2022, 09:58 AM

This is what someone sees unless they read the fine print. Deceptive IMO.

Authenticity Guarantee
This item is verified by an authenticator before delivery

Peter_Spaeth · #24 09-01-2022, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustinD

In agreement that this one falls on PSA for 80% as I think that eBay is likely to always fall on the side of the grader so they don't create a back and forth with grading companies. I also think if they are too scared to question the grading for legal reasons, packaging should be very clearly labeled on all documentation that the card is not observed and we have only certified that the slab is untampered, that to me is the other 20%.

The other even more annoying problem to me is the sellers language:

"1996 S.I For Kids Tiger Woods Series 3 #536 Mint 9 and has already been Authenticated by PSA and Ebay which is Ebay's new policy. They work with PSA and several other graders on guaranteed certification before your card is shipped"

Everything this clown said is bulls**t. Ebay/CSG did not authenticate the card and that stupid package means jack. They also do not work with the other grading companies in any way to certify a graded card. I doubt they would even walk over to the other room to talk to a CSG grader if a CSG slab comes in. My fear was people would start using this program as an actual grading program and it should not be.

After I wrote him he changed it to this. Not much better.
Ebay co-ordinates with PSA and several other graders on authenication before your card is shipped.

More importantly, he claims it came off the sheet like this. RIGHT.

Yoda · #25 09-01-2022, 02:06 PM

I wonder how many tampered with slabs has Ebay outed? Not many, I suspect.
This whole program is confusing and markedly slows delivery of our cards.

JimmyC · #26 09-01-2022, 02:14 PM

I've used PSA to slab a few tickets - and that's for protection - nothing else.....couldn't give a hoot about the grade they assigned to my tickets....

I've never - and will never send a card in for grading.....I am mostly a raw guy, but will buy some PSA slabbed cards IF - I LIKE THE CARD.....I've seen so many EX 5s that look no better than VG....Seen 8s that look like EX cards....and on and on...

I once bought a game used Ernie Banks bat back around 2005....The bat was absolutely killer.....When I received the bat from the auction company, there was a letter from PSA authenticating the signature on the bat......Problem was, there was no signature on the bat.....the bat was never signed.....

The Authentication program is worthless IMHO....As Yoda says, it just slows down the delivery.....

Buy the card.....don't buy the grade.....

Peter_Spaeth · #27 09-01-2022, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yoda

I wonder how many tampered with slabs has Ebay outed? Not many, I suspect.
This whole program is confusing and markedly slows delivery of our cards.

Yes, there is a whole new rhythm now to the timing of buying ebay cards. And honestly based on one amazing experience I had and have discussed before, I'm skeptical PSA could even spot a well done fake slab, at least the lower level people they doubtless have assigned to reviewing the hundreds of ebay cards coming in daily.

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