NL wild card

packs · #1 10-10-2022, 08:17 AM

Why would you want your team to have a low payroll? I'll never understand the haters and small market fans. Your owner can spend the same amount of money as every other owner but chooses not to because they don't care about your team.

How can that be a rallying cry for anyone?

gonefishin · #2 10-10-2022, 10:12 AM

Let's Go Padres! Wow - they set a record last night by only allowing 1 hit in a close out game in the play offs.

I would like for all the Mets fans to jump on the bandwagon now and support the Padres please. You can jump off right after they win game 7 of the World Series. Maybe it will be a rematch with the Yankees? Then Boone can check strategy with Buck since they're both in New York. You know, maybe get some tips on when to do an ear check to throw off the pitcher. It's all about strategy at this point, but I didn't see the ear check coming. Classy move for a losing team.

Tip - I did watch Ha Song Kim pull up his pants after sliding into second. Maybe Buck should have asked them to have Kim pull down his pants for a check. That way, Buck could kiss his ass after making a fool of himself.

Go Padres!

1952boyntoncollector · #3 10-10-2022, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gonefishin

Let's Go Padres! Wow - they set a record last night by only allowing 1 hit in a close out game in the play offs.

I would like for all the Mets fans to jump on the bandwagon now and support the Padres please. You can jump off right after they win game 7 of the World Series. Maybe it will be a rematch with the Yankees? Then Boone can check strategy with Buck since they're both in New York. You know, maybe get some tips on when to do an ear check to throw off the pitcher. It's all about strategy at this point, but I didn't see the ear check coming. Classy move for a losing team.

Tip - I did watch Ha Song Kim pull up his pants after sliding into second. Maybe Buck should have asked them to have Kim pull down his pants for a check. That way, Buck could kiss his ass after making a fool of himself.

Go Padres!

Go padres as well

BobC · #4 10-10-2022, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

Why would you want your team to have a low payroll? I'll never understand the haters and small market fans. Your owner can spend the same amount of money as every other owner but chooses not to because they don't care about your team.

How can that be a rallying cry for anyone?

I don't think they really can all spend the same amount. Unlike the NFL, which I believe handles all the TV contracts and deals for the entire league, and then shares the money among all the teams, MLB teams I believe are much more on their own when it comes to TV and contracts. It was Steinbrenner who I believe was the first to really make a big difference when he started putting the Yankees games on their own cable network. Big market teams get bigger paydays because advertisers pay more to advertise in larger markets.

Now of course the owners of smaller market teams could, if they're rich enough, just spend tons of their own money to try and compete more easily against the big market teams, and simply have their franchises operate at a loss every year. But then don't forget, MLB teams are, and always have been, businesses first. And even very rich small market team owners likely can't afford to just keep funding losing businesses year after year after year.

packs · #5 10-10-2022, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobC

I don't think they really can all spend the same amount. Unlike the NFL, which I believe handles all the TV contracts and deals for the entire league, and then shares the money among all the teams, MLB teams I believe are much more on their own when it comes to TV and contracts. It was Steinbrenner who I believe was the first to really make a big difference when he started putting the Yankees games on their own cable network. Big market teams get bigger paydays because advertisers pay more to advertise in larger markets.

Now of course the owners of smaller market teams could, if they're rich enough, just spend tons of their own money to try and compete more easily against the big market teams, and simply have their franchises operate at a loss every year. But then don't forget, MLB teams are, and always have been, businesses first. And even very rich small market team owners likely can't afford to just keep funding losing businesses year after year after year.

Sorry, I don't believe that. Everyone knows a winning product is a valuable product. If an owner wanted to maximize profit they would build a winning team. It worked for the Patriots. It can work for any losing franchise.

But absent owners don't do that because they don't care about the team. They care about maximum profits on minimum budgets and that means operating as cheaply as possible and not really caring about a championship. Look at the Pirates. They've had grievances filed against them twice for not spending their revenue share money on their team. Every team also made 100 million dollars in TV contracts before even selling a ticket this year.

How a fan of a small market team can be both satisfied and wear that as a badge of honor is not something I'll ever understand.

KCRfan1 · #6 10-10-2022, 03:05 PM

I agree PACKS.

A winning team is great for the bottom line.

This is accomplished via FA, assuming the right player / players are available and a fit for the team. In baseball, is the player a fit for the stadium? The player also has to want to play for the team. When Pete Rose became a FA from the Reds, KC made a generous offer and I believe the highest offer. And Pete signed with Philly.

A more cost effective way to build the team is via the draft. If a team has high picks, they cannot whiff those picks. KC cannot develop a pitcher to save their life. Yet they have high pitching draft picks and they are getting rocked in the minors. Perhaps they were poor selections, but it continues to be an issue regardless. This is not lost on those pitchers who have seen former KC arms go elsewhere and experience much better success.

So a combination of smart FA signings with players who want to play for the team AND being able to develop players are essential.

Pro franchises are very valuable. I am surprised that more owners aren't involved or current on the state of that asset.

packs · #7 10-10-2022, 03:08 PM

It's about WANTING to win. There is no way you'll ever convince me the owner of the Pirates wants to win. How could you? But then if by some miracle the Pirates do find themselves in a World Series, all of their fans will want to pat themselves on the back for backing the small guy.

But you aren't backing the small guy. You're backing the guy who could care less.

BobC · #8 10-10-2022, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

Sorry, I don't believe that. Everyone knows a winning product is a valuable product. If an owner wanted to maximize profit they would build a winning team. It worked for the Patriots. It can work for any losing franchise.

But absent owners don't do that because they don't care about the team. They care about maximum profits on minimum budgets and that means operating as cheaply as possible and not really caring about a championship. Look at the Pirates. They've had grievances filed against them twice for not spending their revenue share money on their team. Every team also made 100 million dollars in TV contracts before even selling a ticket this year.

How a fan of a small market team can be both satisfied and wear that as a badge of honor is not something I'll ever understand.

Don't entirely disagree, but have you ever been involved with a sale of a business, any business? If a small market team owner generates losses from the business year after year, even if the result is a winning team, those recurring losses will normally drive the business' value down, not up. Do you know what EBITDA is and how most businesses are valued and sold using some multiple of that factor?

Also, I fully realize there is a revenue sharing aspect when it comes to TV/cable revenue, like with the MLB network. But there are also then local broadcast rights, and an even bigger exception to that revenue sharing concept as I understand it if the baseball team itself also owns a share/interest in the TV/cable network that handles a team's local broadcasting. For example, my understanding is the Red Sox own something like 80% of the company they have contracted with to provide local broadcasts of their games. So, if after receiving and accounting for the normal revenue they got for their local broadcast rights, let's say the company doing the broadcasting ended up making $100M for the year. That means the Red Sox have an additional $80M of revenue that doesn't get counted towards any revenue sharing, that they can potentially spend on players.

You are correct though in that ALL baseball teams are businesses, and the only thing that ALL of them have in common is that ALL any of the owners possibly truly care about is making money, first and foremost. The fact is that some teams, mostly all from the bigger market teams, end up getting so much more revenue than their smaller market brethren that those big market team owners can almost indiscriminately spend as much as they want to lure away the top talent in free agency. Those big market team owners don't really care so much about the fans either. They know they can outspend the other team owners, thereby having the winning bragging rights they can then lord over the other owners, AND still make a sh@tload of money doing it. And don't kid yourself, the bigger market team owners do want to win to not necessarily make the fans happy, but likely more so to keep the viewing numbers up so they can show those figures to advertisers, and charge them even more money.

packs · #9 10-10-2022, 07:33 PM

Let’s be real. We’re not talking about a general store and we’re not talking about an owner just trying to keep the lights on. Every team has billions of dollars behind it. But not every owner wants to win.

clydepepper · #10 10-10-2022, 09:07 PM

Meanwhile, the Braves keep locking up their talent long-term...Strider today...

I don't know why they haven't gotten Dansby signed...starting to worry.

He's been Mr. Clutch lately.

...oh, I'm sorry...this was the wild card thread...oops. (snicker; chuckle)

.

BobC · #11 10-10-2022, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

Let�s be real. We�re not talking about a general store and we�re not talking about an owner just trying to keep the lights on. Every team has billions of dollars behind it. But not every owner wants to win.

Believe what you like, but when it comes to business, regardless of it being a general store or a baseball team, they do all tend to follow a similar pattern and treatment, whether you can admit that or not.

packs · #12 10-11-2022, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobC

Believe what you like, but when it comes to business, regardless of it being a general store or a baseball team, they do all tend to follow a similar pattern and treatment, whether you can admit that or not.

You can see it playing out though. The A’s, Rays, Pirates and Marlins all had grievances filed against them for not reinvesting the revenue sharing money into their team. Those owners don’t want to win. It has nothing to do with market.

The Warriors were a dead franchise going nowhere. They have always played in the Bay Area. The same market as the A’s. Now the Warriors are NBA royalty and Steph Curry is one of the most recognizable faces in the NBA. How did that happen? They started winning in the same market they’ve always been in.

Shoeless Moe · #13 10-10-2022, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

Why would you want your team to have a low payroll? I'll never understand the haters and small market fans. Your owner can spend the same amount of money as every other owner but chooses not to because they don't care about your team.

How can that be a rallying cry for anyone?

See the problem with New Yorkers, such as yourself, is you were spoiled all those years when New York spent more than anyone and bought several WS. Now that the playing field has been closed, you can't win.

Gonna be fun watching Francona pitch around Judge and letting that cast of misfits try to win.

If the Indians don't bounce the Yankees you can bet your ass the Astros will. How bad are Yankee fans rooting for Seattle, you know you are admit it. It's alright to be scared of the Astros, you should be!

packs · #14 10-10-2022, 03:17 PM

[QUOTE=Shoeless Moe;2272155]See the problem with New Yorkers, such as yourself, is you were spoiled all those years when New York spent more than anyone and bought several WS. Now that the playing field has been closed, you can't win.

Gonna be fun watching Francona pitch around Judge and letting that cast of misfits try to win.

If the Indians don't bounce the Yankees you can bet your ass the Astros will. How bad are Yankee fans rooting for Seattle, you know you are admit it. It's alright to be scared of the Astros, you should be![/]

The Yankees Core Four teams were made up of the Core Four, players drafted by the Yankees and developed by the Yankees. Bernie Williams played his entire career with the Yankees. They were further strengthened by great trades that didn't cost any money. If you forgot, Paul O'Neill came to the Yankees by way of Roberto Kelly. The Yankees traded two minor leaguers and Marty Janzen for David Cone. Tino Martinez? Traded to the Yankees for Russ Davis and Sterling Hitchcock. Joe Girardi? Even he was traded to the Yankees for Mike DeJean. Knoblauch? Traded to the Yankees. Tim Raines? Traded to the Yankees.

In fact, thinking back on those teams the two biggest free agent signings I remember everyone making a big deal about were Hidecki Irabu (4 years / 12.8 million) and Orlando Hernandez (four years / 6 million dollars).

KCRfan1 · #15 10-10-2022, 03:32 PM

I LOVED George Steinbrenner.

The man was passionate about winning and a great evaluator of talent in players that others overlooked.

Nettles taylor made for Yankee Stadium. Chambliss just consistently good, never a league leader, but a LEADER on the team. Rivers, again made for the massive OF in Yankee Stadium and the need for speed to cover ground. Pesky table setter at the plate for the rest of the team. Piniella, another professional bat in the lineup or off the bench.

This is sorely missing now, the ability to evaluate talent and intrinsic value to the team. It's not all about the big names but how the pieces of the puzzle fit together.

Shoeless Moe · #16 10-10-2022, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

The Yankees Core Four teams were made up of the Core Four, players drafted by the Yankees and developed by the Yankees. Bernie Williams played his entire career with the Yankees. They were further strengthened by great trades that didn't cost any money. If you forgot, Paul O'Neill came to the Yankees by way of Roberto Kelly. The Yankees traded two minor leaguers and Marty Janzen for David Cone. Tino Martinez? Traded to the Yankees for Russ Davis and Sterling Hitchcock. Joe Girardi? Even he was traded to the Yankees for Mike DeJean. Knoblauch? Traded to the Yankees. Tim Raines? Traded to the Yankees.

In fact, thinking back on those teams the two biggest free agent signings I remember everyone making a big deal about were Hidecki Irabu (4 years / 12.8 million) and Orlando Hernandez (four years / 6 million dollars).

Let's just see about that, from 1996 to 2009 they won 5 WS, and were THEE TOP PAYROLL 4 of those 5, and 2nd once. This is out of 30 each year mind you and were almost always double the payroll of more than half the teams of any given season.

Shoeless Moe · #17 10-10-2022, 04:59 PM

I also find it interesting that Yankee Fans, several on here, say Judge is the new single season MLB HR champ.

Refuse to acknowledge the real single season champ, Bonds.

Yet Yankee fans sure arn't giving back any of their WS trophies, yet their teams were littered with Steroid guys like Arod, Clemens, Pettitte, Knoblauch, Giambi, etc etc.

Nice double standard Yankee fans.

Such morons.

packs · #18 10-10-2022, 05:02 PM

The trades happened and the players who were the core on those teams were home grown players. Payroll does not dispute that.

1952boyntoncollector · #19 10-11-2022, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe

I also find it interesting that Yankee Fans, several on here, say Judge is the new single season MLB HR champ.

Refuse to acknowledge the real single season champ, Bonds.

Yet Yankee fans sure arn't giving back any of their WS trophies, yet their teams were littered with Steroid guys like Arod, Clemens, Pettitte, Knoblauch, Giambi, etc etc.

Nice double standard Yankee fans.

Such morons.

who would be taking back their WS trophies and what team should they go too. Bonds I agree is the single season champ

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
SOLD! 1991 WILD CARD NFL Set NRMT!	GoldenAge50s	Everything Else, Football, Non-Sports etc.. B/S/T	0	03-27-2022 07:16 AM
AL Wild Card Scenarios	Peter_Spaeth	Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions	135	10-18-2021 07:14 AM
FS: Wild Bill Donovan (Portrait) PSA 5 EPDG (Wild colors and freaky registration)	CMIZ5290	T206 cards B/S/T	22	06-03-2020 05:39 PM
1991 Wild Card Stripe	Promethius88	Football Cards Forum	9	09-18-2019 12:12 AM
I hate the wild card game ....	Mountaineer1999	Watercooler Talk- ALL sports talk	13	10-12-2015 08:20 PM