Hall of Fame Ballot Announced

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Gorditadogg

He deserves to be in based on his numbers. I just looked at his stats and he had some really good years. His 2002 year was incredible, 23-7 with a 3.23 ERA in 259 innings, and amazingly 316 strikeouts and only 29 walks. Of course he might be in the hall already if he didn't tell the sportswriters not to vote for him.

"I will not participate in the final year of voting. I am requesting to be removed from the ballot," he wrote. "I'll defer to the veterans committee and men whose opinions actually matter and who are in a position to actually judge a player. I don't think I'm a hall of famer as I've often stated but if former players think I am then I'll accept that with honor."

Have a quote for the 9 years before that? Every time Schilling comes up, his tenth year ‘screw it’ is brought up in a vacuum as if the writers just politely respected his wishes all along. The context of how and why that quote was made are never brought up with it.

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by G1911

Have a quote for the 9 years before that? Every time Schilling comes up, his tenth year ‘screw it’ is brought up in a vacuum as if the writers just politely respected his wishes all along. The context of how and why that quote was made are never brought up with it.

Schilling looked sure to get in until the whole "sharing a meme about hanging journalists" thing a few years prior. His vote total still went up every year after that, but I feel like the last year thing didn't really cost him as much as the meme a few years earlier did.

I don't know if that's factual or not, but that's my take. Open to other interpretations.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Mike D.

Schilling looked sure to get in until the whole "sharing a meme about hanging journalists" thing a few years prior. His vote total still went up every year after that, but I feel like the last year thing didn't really cost him as much as the meme a few years earlier did.

I don't know if that's factual or not, but that's my take. Open to other interpretations.

I agree with this, and I think it's what the record suggests is the case. He was unpopular for being outspoken in the opposite direction of the media (some of the claims about his positions are true, and some were just completely false htitpieces. I remember the fake news push that he was a Nazi with a huge collection of nazi memorabilia, as it turned out he collects World War II memorabilia from across the world, as do many people. He was in trouble shortly before this for comparing Islamic extremism to Nazism) and sometimes a dumbass. The meme gave the writers the reason to block an enemy, which they took. His frustration over it and the request sunk his last chance, but it's fairly clear what the actual problem is for at least 9/10 of the saga. I wish I didn't know athletes political views, hot takes, and triggering memes, and they could simply be evaluated on reasonable grounds of actual merit, instead of tribalism.

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by G1911

I agree with this, and I think it's what the record suggests is the case. He was unpopular for being outspoken in the opposite direction of the media (some of the claims about his positions are true, and some were just completely false htitpieces. I remember the fake news push that he was a Nazi with a huge collection of nazi memorabilia, as it turned out he collects World War II memorabilia from across the world, as do many people. He was in trouble shortly before this for comparing Islamic extremism to Nazism) and sometimes a dumbass. The meme gave the writers the reason to block an enemy, which they took. His frustration over it and the request sunk his last chance, but it's fairly clear what the actual problem is for at least 9/10 of the saga. I wish I didn't know athletes political views, hot takes, and triggering memes, and they could simply be evaluated on reasonable grounds of actual merit, instead of tribalism.

Yes, I do miss the "good old days" of Hall of Fame debates, before steroids, politics, crime, gambling, sexual abuse, and all those other nasty things came into the equation.

As we've seen in the threads here, it's hard enough to find consensus on who should be in and out without all those outside variables.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Mike D.

Yes, I do miss the "good old days" of Hall of Fame debates, before steroids, politics, crime, gambling, sexual abuse, and all those other nasty things came into the equation.

As we've seen in the threads here, it's hard enough to find consensus on who should be in and out without all those outside variables.

The stats debate is plenty contentious, has no easy line to draw, and is good fun. I like that debate.

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by G1911

The stats debate is plenty contentious, has no easy line to draw, and is good fun. I like that debate.

Agreed. Cell phones ruined the bar argument, and steroids (and the other stuff) ruined the Hall of Fame argument.

[Gorditadogg]

Originally Posted by G1911

Have a quote for the 9 years before that? Every time Schilling comes up, his tenth year ‘screw it’ is brought up in a vacuum as if the writers just politely respected his wishes all along. The context of how and why that quote was made are never brought up with it.

I thought I was clear with what I said. Schilling's numbers are good enough for the Hall of Fame and if he had kept his mouth shut he probably would have been voted in his last year. He chose to make a statement and blow up the process. Maybe you respect him for that, maybe you don't, but it was his decision.

We know the BBWAA is a fraternity and while many writers are stat-based and analytical, some are not. Players with positive attitudes that are good with interviews have always gotten bonus points for that, and likewise those with sour personalities get deducted for it. Nothing very insightful there, that is just the way it is. Rock Raines had to wait a long time to get in the Hall, Dick Allen is still not in.

My focus when looking at HOF credentials has always been to look at a player's value on the field. But if you are an ambassador to the game, like Ernie Banks maybe, that should count for something too. Certainly Jackie Robinson would deserve his spot in the hall even if he put up Rabbit Maranville numbers.

And on the other side, those who lessen the game by cheating, or otherwise putting the game in a bad light, should have that counted against them. Personally I don't think the controversial things Schilling has said since he retired from baseball should be much of a deduct, but on the other hand they sure don't help.