Current HOF election results

1952boyntoncollector · #1 01-19-2023, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by abothebear

Maybe you saw plays I didn’t, but I didn’t se him making late jumps and bad reads. I saw the opposite. Edmonds played shallow centerfield on purpose, to shrink the outfield for hitters, having the confidence in his reactions and reads that he could get back on everything over him, which he did.

Disagree, i saw many bad plays and late jumps and bad reads.....some of the best amazing plays were as a result of initial bad read....of course not all the time he was a good to great fielder but i think his highlight reel makes people think he was better than he really was..... how would you compare his arm to Jones

D. Bergin · #2 01-19-2023, 03:20 PM

Yeah, Edmonds falls into the Derek Jeter category. Passes the eye test...looks like a Gold Glover when you watch him everyday. Makes all the plays he's supposed to, and very few mistakes...but the analytics don't like him as much as others. Makes some plays look harder then they should be, and ends up on highlight reels in the process.

Did have some really good years in the field mixed in with some average ones.

That said, dude had an under-rated bat. .903 career OPS and a 132 OPS+.

I'd hypothesize he was kept from HOF consideration by being injured from making too many unnecessary dives in his career, and missing lots of benchmark career numbers. Played a lot of years, but missed a lot of games.

perezfan · #3 01-19-2023, 09:14 PM

As a lifelong Reds fan, I can say without a doubt that Edmonds killed the Reds infinitely more than Andruw.... both with his bat and his glove. We never gave Andruw a second thought, but Edmonds was the Babe Ruth of his time (against the Reds).

That's my incredibly scientific analysis.

lowpopper · #4 01-20-2023, 02:08 AM

so many parrots wow

where are all the highlights of jeter making errors in the big games?

what he booted a ball at camden with a 7 run lead?

he bounced one to first on a partly sunny nick johnson bobblehead day?

you know you got the juice when people find any excuse to hate

haha parrots!

D. Bergin · #5 01-20-2023, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowpopper

so many parrots wow

where are all the highlights of jeter making errors in the big games?

what he booted a ball at camden with a 7 run lead?

he bounced one to first on a partly sunny nick johnson bobblehead day?

you know you got the juice when people find any excuse to hate

haha parrots!

Ummm, I think I'm the only one that mentioned Jeter. I'm a Yankee fan and a huge Jeter fan.

Analytics don't like him defensively, even with all the Gold Gloves. Just like they don't really like Edmonds as much as his reputation says otherwise.

Nothing personal. I thought he was a great Shortstop while I was watching him play. I saw him make several plays I've never seen anyone else make. He passed the eye test with flying colors and I wouldn't have traded him for anybody during his prime with the Yanks.

Hope that clears things up...from someone else who also gets clearly irritated when others say Jeter is super over-rated, or that he was a horrible Shortstop, when he clearly wasn't. He didn't have amazing range for much of his career, but he was very workmanlike and reliable.

I've come to terms with the fact that he maybe didn't deserve all the Gold Gloves he won, but he was a solid Shortstop, whatever the analytics say about him.

G1911 · #6 01-20-2023, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Ummm, I think I'm the only one that mentioned Jeter. I'm a Yankee fan and a huge Jeter fan.

Analytics don't like him defensively, even with all the Gold Gloves. Just like they don't really like Edmonds as much as his reputation says otherwise.

Nothing personal. I thought he was a great Shortstop while I was watching him play. I saw him make several plays I've never seen anyone else make. He passed the eye test with flying colors and I wouldn't have traded him for anybody during his prime with the Yanks.

Hope that clears things up...from someone else who also gets clearly irritated when others say Jeter is super over-rated, or that he was a horrible Shortstop, when he clearly wasn't. He didn't have amazing range for much of his career, but he was very workmanlike and reliable.

I've come to terms with the fact that he maybe didn't deserve all the Gold Gloves he won, but he was a solid Shortstop, whatever the analytics say about him.

Jeter was immensely overrated during his career. Then it became the narrative that Jeter was immensely overrated, which has now made him somewhat underrated because the �correction� has been too extreme. Let�s throw out the eye test and accept the bad defensive analytics. He�s still a shortstop who played 20 years with a .310/.377/.440 slashline. There have been better shortstops, but only a few at most, even if one goes with his worst defensive metrics.

abothebear · #7 01-19-2023, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

Disagree, i saw many bad plays and late jumps and bad reads.....some of the best amazing plays were as a result of initial bad read....of course not all the time he was a good to great fielder but i think his highlight reel makes people think he was better than he really was..... how would you compare his arm to Jones

I didn�t follow Jones much, so I wouldn�t have a useful opinion on comparing him with Jim. My memory of Jones was that everyone as talking about him his first few years, and then he was just kind of around for a while. I�d say that that�s hardly an observation, except I was a fantasy baseball fanatic back in those days (starting around 2002), and I don�t recall ever thinking of Jones as a guy I wanted on my team. So maybe my comment elevates from �hardly an observation� to �unreliable anecdote.� Feel free to pass it along to any HOF voters you think might benefit from it:

1952boyntoncollector · #8 01-20-2023, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by abothebear

I didn’t follow Jones much, so I wouldn’t have a useful opinion on comparing him with Jim. My memory of Jones was that everyone as talking about him his first few years, and then he was just kind of around for a while. I’d say that that’s hardly an observation, except I was a fantasy baseball fanatic back in those days (starting around 2002), and I don’t recall ever thinking of Jones as a guy I wanted on my team. So maybe my comment elevates from “hardly an observation” to “unreliable anecdote.” Feel free to pass it along to any HOF voters you think might benefit from it:

yeah for fantasy NL leagues as the years went on..alwasy not worth drafting because of his batting average etc. He was alwasy drafted with the mid 30 year old players past their prime or always go hurt... today analogy would be brandon belts and evan longorias..back then was like Steve Finely and Luis Gonzalez...

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