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  #1  
Old 03-15-2023, 02:22 AM
G1911 G1911 is online now
Gr.eg McCl.@y
 
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This leaves D353. D353 is identical to E229, except for the different back. Attached is an example, E229 on the left and D353 on the right. These Koester Bread cards are more difficult than E229, which I wouldn't call easy.

Koester's cards must be:
1) Again, one of the previous deductions is wrong or

2) The cards are not from 1910-1911 but a few years later, a reprinting after the fall of the tobacco monopoly, like T214, T215, etc. by which time whatever agreement they had had with Duke wasn't an issue, or

3) Koester's was owned by an ATC owned firm or

4) The cards are a pirated issue, and somehow someone else stole the images and made cards with them.

I can find numerous ads and records of Koesters Bread in Baltimore in the mid teens and the early 1920's (they issued base ball pictures in 1921), they seem to have continued on for decades after this. According to a coupon they were founded in 1886. Not finding much in the 1910-1911 period yet.
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File Type: jpeg Homade-Bread-3988948821.jpeg (194.0 KB, 230 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0396.jpg (111.0 KB, 228 views)
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  #2  
Old 03-15-2023, 06:16 AM
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Pat R Pat R is offline
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I haven't found anything on the D353's but here's a June 1916 ad for D1 cards and albums.

D1 Koester Bread Album adThe_Evening_Sun_Mon__Jun_12__1916_.jpg
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  #3  
Old 03-16-2023, 03:05 PM
G1911 G1911 is online now
Gr.eg McCl.@y
 
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While flipping through my cards this morning, it occurs that another deduction can be made.

The attached Coburn (scan stolen from previous owner) is from the proofing stage or a scrapped sheet. It is from very, very early in white border production, if it is not from the proofing stage. We know this because of the man at left. In the silver series, the man is fully drawn. Coburn is one of two cards with artistic changes; a small minority of Coburn's in early white border production (Mecca factory 649 only - Tolstoi was likely printed at some remove from the Mecca run; it was issued in March of 1911) have the man at left as a blue silhouette, like it is here on this card.

The upside down wrong back features Gans. An upside down wrong back isn't random. For it to happen, the sheet must be put in upside down, which means that the card on the front will dictate what card constitutes the wrong back that is upside down. A card on the left edge of the sheet won't have an upside down wrong back of a card from the middle of the sheet; it will be the card in the corresponding slot on the right side of the sheet.

Now that we know 92% of the sheet layout, we can see if this early white border production matches the silver sheet. It should be noted that, while I am quite confident I have the panels arranged correctly, it is possible final production was different. This is not the only T220 Silver proof sheet that would have been run; we can be sure it wasn't the last as they haven't tested the backs, the silver borders, and they corrected the error on Willie Beecher's card before they started actual production. The production sheet is probably the same layout, as it would take labor to 0 gain to redesign it, but this is a deduction and not a proven 100% fact. Some changes are very possible to have been made shortly after production began. Whether Corbett and Donovan were removed and replaced on the sheet with other cards (almost certainly not full panels of 8 DP'd), left as blanks, or printed and manually cut out/removed is a mystery to me.

Coburn is in the middle rows on the left edge. Gans is on the middle rows on the right edge. This sheet layout matches this upside wrong back (the only one I am aware of in this set) from the white borders. It is of course possible that this is mere coincidence, but it is statistically unlikely. The white borders were very probably produced using this same layout, on 2 sheets of 25 with the second sheet featuring the 25 new pictures and art style that was not present in the original wave. Wave printing and issue seems to have been how a lot of 50 card series were done; usually not so obvious because 1) they didn't change the borders and 2) we don't have uncut sheets of them but their are hints in how certain backs are only available in half of a series sometimes.
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File Type: jpg IMG_0167.jpg (197.9 KB, 225 views)
File Type: jpg T220 ungraded Coburn printer freak.jpg (95.0 KB, 223 views)
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  #4  
Old 03-27-2023, 09:01 PM
G1911 G1911 is online now
Gr.eg McCl.@y
 
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National Licorice, after the breakup of the ATC, ended up going into the tobacco business themselves directly. This ad is from 1924.
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File Type: jpg 1924 - Cigarettes? .jpg (68.1 KB, 213 views)
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  #5  
Old 03-29-2023, 08:11 AM
steve B steve B is offline
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At a penny a pack I suspect those are candy cigarettes.
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  #6  
Old 03-29-2023, 12:10 PM
G1911 G1911 is online now
Gr.eg McCl.@y
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve B View Post
At a penny a pack I suspect those are candy cigarettes.
That makes more sense. I didn’t know candy cigarettes was a thing until right now
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  #7  
Old 04-05-2023, 10:55 AM
steve B steve B is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G1911 View Post
That makes more sense. I didn’t know candy cigarettes was a thing until right now
Well, they were, were sort of popular in the 70's, but basically got put out of production because the were "teaching kids to smoke"
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