NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
ebay GSB
T206s on eBay
Babe Ruth Cards on eBay
t206 Ty Cobb on eBay
Ty Cobb Cards on eBay
Lou Gehrig Cards on eBay
Baseball T201-T217 on eBay
Baseball E90-E107 on eBay
T205 Cards on eBay
Baseball Postcards on eBay
Goudey Cards on eBay
Baseball Memorabilia on eBay
Baseball Exhibit Cards on eBay
Baseball Strip Cards on eBay
Baseball Baking Cards on eBay
Sporting News Cards on eBay
Play Ball Cards on eBay
Joe DiMaggio Cards on eBay
Mickey Mantle Cards on eBay
Bowman 1951-1955 on eBay
Football Cards on eBay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 09-17-2023, 07:01 AM
Rhotchkiss's Avatar
Rhotchkiss Rhotchkiss is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 4,651
Default

Cobb - first superstar
Ruth - the ultimate superstar
Jackie - broke color barrier
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 09-17-2023, 04:45 PM
robw1959 robw1959 is offline
Rob
Rob.ert We.ekes
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,651
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss View Post
Cobb - first superstar
Ruth - the ultimate superstar
Jackie - broke color barrier
+1 Hard to argue with that, but it is tempting to put Willie Mays into the mix. Nobody drew fans like Willie, the most exciting player of his generation.

Last edited by robw1959; 09-17-2023 at 04:48 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 09-17-2023, 04:50 PM
BobbyStrawberry's Avatar
BobbyStrawberry BobbyStrawberry is offline
mªttHǝɯ h0uℊℌ
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 3,197
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robw1959 View Post
+1 Hard to argue with that, but it is tempting to put Willie Mays into the mix. Nobody drew fans like Willie, the most exciting player of his generation.
I would argue with it, as King Kelly was the game's first superstar, not Cobb
__________________
_
Successful transactions with: Natswin2019, ParachromBleu, Cmount76, theuclakid, tiger8mush, shammus, jcmtiger, oldjudge, coolshemp, joejo20, Blunder19, ibechillin33, t206kid, helfrich91, Dashcol, philliesfan, alaskapaul3, Natedog, Kris19, frankbmd, tonyo, Baseball Rarities, Thromdog, T2069bk, t206fix, jakebeckleyoldeagleeye, Casey2296, rdeversole, brianp-beme, seablaster, twalk, qed2190, Gorditadogg, LuckyLarry, tlhss, Cory, zizek
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 09-17-2023, 04:55 PM
vthobby vthobby is online now
Mike P.ap
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: VT
Posts: 2,425
Default .......

Gehrig
Jackie
Hodges

You will not find any better gentleman of the diamond.

Ambassadors who embodied the purity of the game and played it the way it was meant to be played.

Matty begs to be on this list so he is tied with Hodges.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 09-17-2023, 05:31 PM
Eric72's Avatar
Eric72 Eric72 is offline
Eric Perry
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Philadelphia Suburbs
Posts: 4,001
Default

Christy Mathewson

Babe Ruth

Jackie Robinson


Babe and Jackie, for obvious reasons. Matty broadened the appeal beyond where it had been; he brought an air of respectability to the baseball player as a professional.
__________________
Eric Perry

Currently collecting:
T206 (136/524)
1956 Topps Baseball (198/342)

"You can observe a lot by just watching."
- Yogi Berra
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09-17-2023, 08:13 PM
Rhotchkiss's Avatar
Rhotchkiss Rhotchkiss is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 4,651
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyStrawberry View Post
I would argue with it, as King Kelly was the game's first superstar, not Cobb
Baseball was a much more popular game when Cobb came along, as a result, I believe his influence was much greater on the general public. Just look at the popularity of baseball cards in 1909-1910 compared to earlier years or the rise of the Sporting Life and other publications that really took off after Kelly was big. Cobb was in every newspaper, he had a nickname, he was in plays, people loved and hated him and showed up in huge numbers when he played to see him or boo him. He held out and negotiated his contract, something nobody ever did before and he made being a "ball player" a more respectable career, whereas before ball players were bums who couldn't get real jobs. And, his face was all over trading tobacco, confectionary, and candy cards.

Maybe Kelley or Anson, or Lajoie or Wagner for that matter, were superstars on the field/to the people who played. To the general public, Cobb was the first superstar baseball player - which to me means he transcended the sport and thus did more for it than anyone prior.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 09-18-2023, 10:07 AM
BobbyStrawberry's Avatar
BobbyStrawberry BobbyStrawberry is offline
mªttHǝɯ h0uℊℌ
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 3,197
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss View Post
Baseball was a much more popular game when Cobb came along, as a result, I believe his influence was much greater on the general public. Just look at the popularity of baseball cards in 1909-1910 compared to earlier years or the rise of the Sporting Life and other publications that really took off after Kelly was big.
Totally fair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss View Post
Cobb was in every newspaper, he had a nickname, he was in plays, people loved and hated him and showed up in huge numbers when he played to see him or boo him.
While Kelly may not have been in as many newspapers, I believe all the rest of this applied to Kelly in his day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss View Post
Maybe Kelley or Anson, or Lajoie or Wagner for that matter, were superstars on the field/to the people who played. To the general public, Cobb was the first superstar baseball player - which to me means he transcended the sport and thus did more for it than anyone prior.
To me, Jim Creighton was the first star player and Kelly the first superstar. That said, I don't fault anyone for putting Cobb on their "3 most important" list. I do believe that there should be a 19th century player on the list though. For me that would be Anson for (both good and bad) reasons others have stated.
__________________
_
Successful transactions with: Natswin2019, ParachromBleu, Cmount76, theuclakid, tiger8mush, shammus, jcmtiger, oldjudge, coolshemp, joejo20, Blunder19, ibechillin33, t206kid, helfrich91, Dashcol, philliesfan, alaskapaul3, Natedog, Kris19, frankbmd, tonyo, Baseball Rarities, Thromdog, T2069bk, t206fix, jakebeckleyoldeagleeye, Casey2296, rdeversole, brianp-beme, seablaster, twalk, qed2190, Gorditadogg, LuckyLarry, tlhss, Cory, zizek
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 09-18-2023, 10:24 AM
packs packs is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 9,259
Default

I would think Cobb's place is earned because there was no one like him until he arrived. Every 19th century player paled in comparison to Ty Cobb. No one had ever considered someone could be as good as Cobb was until you saw Cobb.

He was simply the best player who ever lived until Ruth hits his prime and there have been very few players of his caliber since.

Last edited by packs; 09-18-2023 at 10:26 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 09-18-2023, 10:38 AM
BobbyStrawberry's Avatar
BobbyStrawberry BobbyStrawberry is offline
mªttHǝɯ h0uℊℌ
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 3,197
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
I would think Cobb's place is earned because there was no one like him until he arrived. Every 19th century player paled in comparison to Ty Cobb. No one had ever considered someone could be as good as Cobb was until you saw Cobb.

He was simply the best player who ever lived until Ruth hits his prime and there have been very few players of his caliber since.
I agree that Cobb is a top 2 player of all time. I guess that's the thing though - "most important" vs. "first superstar" vs. "greatest" are all different questions, to me at least.
__________________
_
Successful transactions with: Natswin2019, ParachromBleu, Cmount76, theuclakid, tiger8mush, shammus, jcmtiger, oldjudge, coolshemp, joejo20, Blunder19, ibechillin33, t206kid, helfrich91, Dashcol, philliesfan, alaskapaul3, Natedog, Kris19, frankbmd, tonyo, Baseball Rarities, Thromdog, T2069bk, t206fix, jakebeckleyoldeagleeye, Casey2296, rdeversole, brianp-beme, seablaster, twalk, qed2190, Gorditadogg, LuckyLarry, tlhss, Cory, zizek
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 09-17-2023, 09:11 PM
bbcard1 bbcard1 is offline
T0dd M@rcum
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Roanoke, VA
Posts: 3,454
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyStrawberry View Post
I would argue with it, as King Kelly was the game's first superstar, not Cobb
I came here to say that, though more in the context of Anson than Cobb. King Kelly was a fasciating player in that he was the first to transcend baseball and be a full blown celebrity.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 09-17-2023, 10:07 PM
robw1959 robw1959 is offline
Rob
Rob.ert We.ekes
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,651
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbcard1 View Post
I came here to say that, though more in the context of Anson than Cobb. King Kelly was a fasciating player in that he was the first to transcend baseball and be a full blown celebrity.
However, Anson was a renown racist and an influential one who probably was the MLB figure most responsible for delaying integration until Jackie Robinson finally broke that barrier.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 09-17-2023, 10:25 PM
Casey2296's Avatar
Casey2296 Casey2296 is offline
Is Mudville so bad?
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: West Coast
Posts: 5,577
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robw1959 View Post
However, Anson was a renown racist and an influential one who probably was the MLB figure most responsible for delaying integration until Jackie Robinson finally broke that barrier.
I think racism in baseball has been addressed, the more relevant question is how we avoid creeps like Wander Franco from having sex with minors.
__________________
Phil Lewis


https://www.flickr.com/photos/183872512@N04/
-
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 09-17-2023, 10:57 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is offline
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 34,048
Default

I would have to list six. The first answer to almost any baseball question is Ruth. Jackie, for obvious reasons. Cobb, for obvious reasons. One not mentioned, yet, or not mentioned much, Mantle.. The personification of baseball in one of its greatest decades. An American folk hero. Clemente. Not the first Latin player, but the first great one. And finally, same concept, Ichiro.
__________________
Net 54-- the discussion board where people resent discussions.

My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at
https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 09-17-2023, 11:02 PM
oldjudge's Avatar
oldjudge oldjudge is offline
j'a'y mi.ll.e.r
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The Bronx
Posts: 5,858
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Casey2296 View Post
I think racism in baseball has been addressed, the more relevant question is how we avoid creeps like Wander Franco from having sex with minors.
To me that’s like saying: “We’ve discussed that already but wasn’t John Wilkes Booth a hell of an actor”?
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 10-09-2023, 05:44 AM
LEHR's Avatar
LEHR LEHR is offline
Paul Lehr
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Utah/Indiana
Posts: 782
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss View Post
Cobb - first superstar
Ruth - the ultimate superstar
Jackie - broke color barrier
It's hard to argue with that list, although my similar list that first came to mind was:

Cobb
Ruth
Clemente
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-09-2023, 02:57 PM
quinnsryche's Avatar
quinnsryche quinnsryche is online now
Tony Quinn
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Punta Gorda. FL
Posts: 7,878
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rhotchkiss View Post
cobb - first superstar
ruth - the ultimate superstar
jackie - broke color barrier
101%
__________________
I Remember Now.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-09-2023, 06:45 PM
Rare Stuff Rare Stuff is offline
member
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Florida
Posts: 42
Default

King Kelly
Ty Cobb
Babe Ruth
Reply With Quote
Reply




Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
When Did RC Become Most Important? todeen Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 71 10-02-2022 08:09 PM
What stats most important for HOF? insidethewrapper Watercooler Talk- ALL sports talk 20 01-25-2020 11:56 AM
Really important Off topic Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 22 07-25-2008 02:21 PM
Jay Miller....need to ask you important ? Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 0 05-21-2006 10:46 AM
IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 18 04-02-2006 06:49 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:09 PM.


ebay GSB