Heritage Auctions - Boston Garters

[rand1com]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Why is it silly? Powell clearly got screwed from a fairness standpoint and it is something that means a lot to him.

I agree he got screwed but if I was looking to spend $750,000 on something I really, really wanted, I think in the 3 weeks before the end of the auction I would have called my contact at Heritage and questioned how the auction worked and that I wanted a call if my set bid was beaten so I would have a chance to bid again before the auction closed rather than counting on a formatted auction to take care of me.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by rand1com

I agree he got screwed but if I was looking to spend $750,000 on something I really, really wanted, I think in the 3 weeks before the end of the auction I would have called my contact at Heritage and questioned how the auction worked and that I wanted a call if my set bid was beaten so I would have a chance to bid again before the auction closed rather than counting on a formatted auction to take care of me.

Sounds like hindsight. Seems reasonable to assume the biggest auction house on earth would set it up right.

[Powell]

I have bought in auctions for 20 years. I have never called in advance. I trust the website.

[rand1com]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Sounds like hindsight. Seems reasonable to assume the biggest auction house on earth would set it up right.

It was reasonable, just not true.

[Mark17]

A couple years ago when several AH were having "glitches" with their sites going down in the final minutes, I was declared the winning bidder on some items, only to be told later that, because some bidders had been unable to get bids in, the auction would resume the next day. Everyone who thought they had won..... hadn't.

Using Powell's analogy, I was the winning bidder. I had the high bid when time for those lots expired, the site declared the lot closed, and declared me the winner.

Later I found out I wasn't. I realize the circumstances (and dollar amount) are different in this case. I'm just saying, it's not the first time an AH has declared winners and later pulled the proverbial rug out from under them.

[tbob]

Originally Posted by Mark17

A couple years ago when several AH were having "glitches" with their sites going down in the final minutes, I was declared the winning bidder on some items, only to be told later that, because some bidders had been unable to get bids in, the auction would resume the next day. Everyone who thought they had won..... hadn't.

Using Powell's analogy, I was the winning bidder. I had the high bid when time for those lots expired, the site declared the lot closed, and declared me the winner.

Later I found out I wasn't. I realize the circumstances (and dollar amount) are different in this case. I'm just saying, it's not the first time an AH has declared winners and later pulled the proverbial rug out from under them.

Mark, I had the same thing happen to me on several lots. I can’t remember which AH it was but I was not a happy camper 😟

[mordecaibrown]

Using this situation as a reference, then Heritage should reopen these lots for bidding.

The set lot that Powell was bidding on closed - he couldn’t enter any more bids (I feel like this keeps getting lost). So, because of a software “glitch” and everyone NOT being able to bid, the lots should be reopened.

I’m also blown away by the “victim blaming” - Powell should have checked to see that the other lots were still open, etc… and done what? Placed a bid in his closed auction item? I don’t think he (or individual winners) did anything wrong - and blame shouldnt be placed with them. Any vitriol towards them is mind boggling.

And yes, it’s just cards, but I can’t comprehend going to bed and assuming you had won a once in a lifetime set and woken up to this mess.

In my opinion, the solution is to reopen the lots and perform the auction as was intended. Individual versus set competing.

Originally Posted by Mark17

A couple years ago when several AH were having "glitches" with their sites going down in the final minutes, I was declared the winning bidder on some items, only to be told later that, because some bidders had been unable to get bids in, the auction would resume the next day. Everyone who thought they had won..... hadn't.

Using Powell's analogy, I was the winning bidder. I had the high bid when time for those lots expired, the site declared the lot closed, and declared me the winner.

Later I found out I wasn't. I realize the circumstances (and dollar amount) are different in this case. I'm just saying, it's not the first time an AH has declared winners and later pulled the proverbial rug out from under them.

[sonnyu2]

Originally Posted by mordecaibrown

Using this situation as a reference, then Heritage should reopen these lots for bidding.

The set lot that Powell was bidding on closed - he couldn’t enter any more bids (I feel like this keeps getting lost). So, because of a software “glitch” and everyone NOT being able to bid, the lots should be reopened.

I’m also blown away by the “victim blaming” - Powell should have checked to see that the other lots were still open, etc… and done what? Placed a bid in his closed auction item? I don’t think he (or individual winners) did anything wrong - and blame shouldnt be placed with them. Any vitriol towards them is mind boggling.

And yes, it’s just cards, but I can’t comprehend going to bed and assuming you had won a once in a lifetime set and woken up to this mess.

In my opinion, the solution is to reopen the lots and perform the auction as was intended. Individual versus set competing.

Correct, Heritage could claim "Technical Issues" with the close of the auction and re-open the auction for those lots if they wanted to. Heritage, as well as most other auction houses, reserve the right to re-open lots, cancel sales, cancel bids, etc for just about any reason.

it would not be the first time by any means that an online auction was re-opened for bidding after "ending" due to technical reasons - it happens more often than most realize.

And just to reiterate, an emailed notice of a winning bid is not a guarantee of actually "winning" the item. Emails / Notices can be sent in error for a number of reasons. Especially with all of the ways to bid these days, clerical errors can and will be made by auction personnel when executing bids. And just about all Auction Terms & Conditions protect the auction house from these "errors". In this case, the bidding system just was not set up properly for that type of auction and sent a winning bid notice in error.

Obviously a frustrating situation for all involved with no real way to make everyone happy, but hopefully a big learning experience for Heritage.

[Powell]

I got what I would describe as a “blow off” email from Heritage.
Not even the courtesy of a phone call.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by sonnyu2

Obviously a frustrating situation for all involved with no real way to make everyone happy, but hopefully a big learning experience for Heritage.

And hopefully a lesson for all of us!

In the cold light of day on Monday morning, it seems like the only way to make sure that you win the whole set is to bid like a drunken sailor on all of the individual lots, plus on the lot for the full set.

Because otherwise you're leaving yourself open to a potential that you win the lot for the set, but lose overall.

I do wish Powell the best of luck with his approach and process. Maybe Heritage will decide to attempt to declare that the bidding should be re-opened. But I wouldn't bet on it.

[brunswickreeves]

Originally Posted by mordecaibrown

Using this situation as a reference, then Heritage should reopen these lots for bidding.

The set lot that Powell was bidding on closed - he couldn’t enter any more bids (I feel like this keeps getting lost). So, because of a software “glitch” and everyone NOT being able to bid, the lots should be reopened.

I’m also blown away by the “victim blaming” - Powell should have checked to see that the other lots were still open, etc… and done what? Placed a bid in his closed auction item? I don’t think he (or individual winners) did anything wrong - and blame shouldnt be placed with them. Any vitriol towards them is mind boggling.

And yes, it’s just cards, but I can’t comprehend going to bed and assuming you had won a once in a lifetime set and woken up to this mess.

In my opinion, the solution is to reopen the lots and perform the auction as was intended. Individual versus set competing.

I agree and raised this as an equitable solution under these circumstances early on in this discussion. Nothing can be done to reverse what’s happened in the past. And, choosing a legitimate winner at this point directly screws someone or many someones. Whereas reopening the auction gives everyone a fighting chance and only indirectly screws someone or many someones by virtue of their own underbidding.

Good faith solution is good for business, HA and the consignor make more money, cards go to fully informed and highest bidder.

[pawpawdiv9]

1- Powell bidded on the SET lot and ended just like a normal lot would end.
2. The other single lots kept going as normal and ended like normal.
As reffered by others as 2 separate Heat Races.
3. When the races end, the highest WINS.
OK. so, Powell loses then.

I can see the other aspect, have the lots joined together and closed at 1 time, but it was never disclosed that way. Just that the highest lot(s) won. Right?
(i did not look at the site, just basing on what i read here)

HOWEVER- the case with the winning bidder invoices??
thats the part figuring out, was it a payment due type invoice?
Thinking this invoices/winner should never been sent out,
most people think it says you won the lot, then you won.
Thats why i question, if it asked for payment??

Either way, hate to see the set split up, so beautiful. Be nice to see it displayed too.

[slidekellyslide]

Just absolutely astounding negligence from the largest sports auction house in the world. Powel should have been awarded the win, but I'm assuming at this point since invoices went out that cards may be on their way to individual lot winners already.

I think I would have questioned how things were going to go once I realized that you had to add up the individual lots yourself. How annoying would that be if they were doing this same type of setup with 524 T206 cards? Or a complete 1952 Topps set?

[nolemmings]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Sounds like hindsight. Seems reasonable to assume the biggest auction house on earth would set it up right.

Yes and no. Personally, if it were me, I would have looked immediately at the individual lots once my Full set lot closed and declared me the winner. I would not need to tabulate the totals of all 12 cards, but could see that one or more remained open with clocks still running. This would alert me that something was amiss and I would be on the phone at once.

Sounds like the real loser was the consignor, as some pretty meaningful $$$ were left on the table due the bungling manner that this was set up and explained.