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  #1  
Old 12-24-2023, 10:33 AM
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One mention (mine) of card doctoring and none of shill bidding. Did the hobby get cleaned up and I missed it?
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  #2  
Old 12-24-2023, 11:31 AM
raulus raulus is offline
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
One mention (mine) of card doctoring and none of shill bidding. Did the hobby get cleaned up and I missed it?
Either we all have bigger complaints, or what you’ve always suspected is true.
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  #3  
Old 12-24-2023, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by raulus View Post
Either we all have bigger complaints, or what you’ve always suspected is true.
I guess. Shill bidding once was the hottest topic in the hobby. And to me, revulsion to undisclosed card doctoring is something deeply engrained from day one.
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Four phrases I have coined that sum up today's hobby:
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Stuff trumps all.
The flip is the commoodity.
Animal Farm grading.
Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 12-24-2023 at 12:15 PM.
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  #4  
Old 12-24-2023, 01:52 PM
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For me, it's the price of unopened current product. Hobby boxes that used to be $80-100 with 24+ does are now $300 with 8 packs. With less value in the packs.
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  #5  
Old 12-24-2023, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
I guess. Shill bidding once was the hottest topic in the hobby. And to me, revulsion to undisclosed card doctoring is something deeply engrained from day one.
I think a lot of it has to do with most are just tired of listening/reading all the complaining. Then the big unpopular truth we see ALL the time. The huge eBay seller(s) that shills almost every one of their listings is a friend. So he is considered honest. Then change out shill bidder with card doctor and it is exactly the same. It is a close hobby friend so they are honest as the day is long. I have never understood this but I see it all the time.
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  #6  
Old 12-24-2023, 03:09 PM
raulus raulus is offline
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
I guess. Shill bidding once was the hottest topic in the hobby. And to me, revulsion to undisclosed card doctoring is something deeply engrained from day one.
I certainly don’t want to condone it, but I think it’s just to a point that it seems a hopeless business.

It seems like it’s everywhere. The ability to police it is limited to nonexistent. And for poor slobs like us, if our only recourse is to post about it here, it doesn’t seem to accomplish much.

I suppose the other approach is to stick to beaters with big borders, because the odds are better that they haven’t been doctored. While that’s an attractive option, it doesn’t seem to move the needle with the rest of our world.
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  #7  
Old 12-24-2023, 04:00 PM
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My complaint is that the major auction houses don’t have enough auctions. I recall at least five or six days last year when I awoke to find I had nothing to bid on. Damn inconsiderate of those folks. Hopefully, they can correct that in 2024.
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  #8  
Old 12-24-2023, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by oldjudge View Post
My complaint is that the major auction houses don’t have enough auctions. I recall at least five or six days last year when I awoke to find I had nothing to bid on. Damn inconsiderate of those folks. Hopefully, they can correct that in 2024.
Good one, Jay!!
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  #9  
Old 12-26-2023, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by oldjudge View Post
My complaint is that the major auction houses don’t have enough auctions. I recall at least five or six days last year when I awoke to find I had nothing to bid on. Damn inconsiderate of those folks. Hopefully, they can correct that in 2024.
Mic drop!
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  #10  
Old 12-24-2023, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by raulus View Post
Either we all have bigger complaints, or what you’ve always suspected is true.
LOL (Room full of people who care)
Yeap, the doctoring is all cleaned up. Put a bandage on it, take 2 aspirin, and see me in 3 weeks.
.
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Last edited by Leon; 12-24-2023 at 02:34 PM.
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  #11  
Old 12-24-2023, 03:09 PM
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“Make me an offer.”

Okay, I offer to consider buying your card if you put a price on it.
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  #12  
Old 12-24-2023, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Eric72 View Post
“Make me an offer.”

Okay, I offer to consider buying your card if you put a price on it.
I have never understood why that bothers people. If you know what you want to pay, make an offer, no?
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Four phrases I have coined that sum up today's hobby:
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Stuff trumps all.
The flip is the commoodity.
Animal Farm grading.
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  #13  
Old 12-24-2023, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
I have never understood why that bothers people. If you know what you want to pay, make an offer, no?
In my personal experience, people in the "make me an offer" camp have been laborious to deal with.

Likely a small sample size; however, personal experiences tend to shape one's personal opinions.
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  #14  
Old 12-24-2023, 05:59 PM
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In my personal experience, people in the "make me an offer" camp have been laborious to deal with.

Likely a small sample size; however, personal experiences tend to shape one's personal opinions.
As opposed to someone with an absurdly high price?
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Four phrases I have coined that sum up today's hobby:
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Stuff trumps all.
The flip is the commoodity.
Animal Farm grading.
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  #15  
Old 12-24-2023, 05:17 PM
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Peter--I think the reason is that making the first move conveys information to the other party. If one is willing to sell an item for $X but the potential buyer indicates he is willing to pay $X+ then the seller has been advantaged by not making the first move. The same is obviously true if the seller shows an offer before the buyer has bid.
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  #16  
Old 12-24-2023, 05:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldjudge View Post
Peter--I think the reason is that making the first move conveys information to the other party. If one is willing to sell an item for $X but the potential buyer indicates he is willing to pay $X+ then the seller has been advantaged by not making the first move. The same is obviously true if the seller shows an offer before the buyer has bid.
Well I am assuming Eric or whoever it is, is savvy enough to start with a low offer. If someone has a card I want, I can't imagine passing up a chance just because I'm asked to make the first move.
__________________
Four phrases I have coined that sum up today's hobby:
No consequences.
Stuff trumps all.
The flip is the commoodity.
Animal Farm grading.
Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 12-24-2023 at 05:52 PM.
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  #17  
Old 12-24-2023, 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by oldjudge View Post
Peter--I think the reason is that making the first move conveys information to the other party. If one is willing to sell an item for $X but the potential buyer indicates he is willing to pay $X+ then the seller has been advantaged by not making the first move. The same is obviously true if the seller shows an offer before the buyer has bid.
True, but if no one makes the first move, nothing gets sold.
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  #18  
Old 12-24-2023, 05:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
I have never understood why that bothers people. If you know what you want to pay, make an offer, no?
It bothers me because, if you really want to sell it, put a price on it. I'm not making an offer on anything. If you're trying to sell it, price it. Otherwise you're just trying to get rich.
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  #19  
Old 12-24-2023, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
I have never understood why that bothers people. If you know what you want to pay, make an offer, no?
How many other marketplaces work like that? Not many; not even a few.
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  #20  
Old 12-24-2023, 05:53 PM
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How many other marketplaces work like that? Not many; not even a few.
It's atypical for sure, but so what?
How many other marketplaces have 90 percent of the items priced at levels nobody will pay? Those sellers put a price on their items, does that make people feel better about offering?
__________________
Four phrases I have coined that sum up today's hobby:
No consequences.
Stuff trumps all.
The flip is the commoodity.
Animal Farm grading.
Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 12-24-2023 at 05:57 PM.
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  #21  
Old 12-24-2023, 12:04 PM
RichMcGillicuddy RichMcGillicuddy is offline
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
One mention (mine) of card doctoring and none of shill bidding. Did the hobby get cleaned up and I missed it?
Those topics make people question "Why?" they collect, seem to be worse or more visible than ever, and create rabbit holes of how you combat them (there is no easy way)...
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