The N332 S.F. Hess project and complete checklist effort

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Any boxer in the Burdick Collection that is listed in my book with an * would be one I verified in person when I was researching at the Met but had not seen 'in the wild' when I compiled the list. That would be Ryan and Taylor on your redline. There may not have been any offered for sale anywhere nor is there an available image, but they definitely exist. The other cards in my checklist that are in the Met's list also exist. I checked my then-existing checklist against what was there.

Just to be clear, red means no picture proof, not a doubt the card exists or a claim it doesn't. I don't doubt any of the Burdick Collection holdings to exist, I just can't show them, which is the proof positive. Many cards that do not exist have been checklisted by people reporting seeing one (T220 silver Goodman, N162 Dunlap variation, T206 Hustlers, maybe the N269 35 Lannon, and so on and so forth), so I like to take the step of full proof and denoting those that cannot be shown positively. Also, I just want to see what photo they used and the card looked like out of nothing but curiosity. Figure the odds aren't insignificant somebody might know someone at the MET that would be willing to put it on the list of things to add to the website as they do with thousands of other cards.

This is the best I could find for the card of Mr. Sparrow Golden, the one I was able to most recently cross off my target list but for which a better image would be desirable. While the photos used are pirated and they haven't aged that well with the massive fading problems, it's a shame most of the subjects are so tough because it's a wonderful chronicle of 1860's-1880's boxing photos.

[th38larg]

Don't mean to muddy the waters on this thread, but I picked this up a couple years ago. Not sure if the fighter has been identified or if this "anonymous" is already part of the checklist in some way. Sorry for the poor photo. My phone's camera is broken.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by th38larg

Don't mean to muddy the waters on this thread, but I picked this up a couple years ago. Not sure if the fighter has been identified or if this "anonymous" is already part of the checklist in some way. Sorry for the poor photo. My phone's camera is broken.

This card is the one previously identified as Jack Fallon, who seems to have been left unnamed on his cards. I will update the checklist to note he is a third anonymous subject. Here's another copy of the card attached.

The other two anonymous subjects are Jack Files (identified finally on this board last year by others) and Frank Slavin, who thankfully is a recognizable face and easier to ID.

Perhaps opening a can of worms, but I am not sure this card actually is Jack Fallon. I can't recall how this one was identified. Also attaching a picture of Jack from outside the cards.

[G1911]

And, I think I have debunked a card on my list of suspicious targets.

This auction has the Jim Kill in PSA's pop report. The auction correctly notes the label is an error and this is Jim Fell. https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...-pr-3865973453

As I cannot find a "Jim Kill" and its only source is the PSA pop report which is an error, the card previously numbered 80 in my list is a false card that cannot reasonably be held to exist and must be removed from the target list. This would knock the list back to 147, with I suspect, some still not known, quite possibly a caption variation or two, and a couple more 'false cards' that needs debunking.

This is a perfect example of why I look for proper, real evidence of a card rather than taking a preceding claim as the proof - honest mistakes are made by all of us (well, PSA more often than most of us ).

[G1911]

And back up to 148 on the suspect list. "John L. Sullivan" vs. "'J.L. Sullivan" with the name in different placements as well.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by G1911

And, I think I have debunked a card on my list of suspicious targets.

This auction has the Jim Kill in PSA's pop report. The auction correctly notes the label is an error and this is Jim Fell. https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...-pr-3865973453

As I cannot find a "Jim Kill" and its only source is the PSA pop report which is an error, the card previously numbered 80 in my list is a false card that cannot reasonably be held to exist and must be removed from the target list. This would knock the list back to 147, with I suspect, some still not known, quite possibly a caption variation or two, and a couple more 'false cards' that needs debunking.

This is a perfect example of why I look for proper, real evidence of a card rather than taking a preceding claim as the proof - honest mistakes are made by all of us (well, PSA more often than most of us ).

Nice catch. I was gonna say "who the hell is Jim Kill?".

[G1911]

Still looking! And, I found a photograph of Mr. Solomon F. Hess in my archives while compiling all my material on the company and cards beyond the checklist of the N332 set. Born on a farm, ran a simple general store with his father, bought the Disbrow company, transformed the firm and ran it until it was finally killed by the monopoly in 1907 with his own death, transformed his family into one of the prominent New York families, outlasted most of the nineteenth century competitors. Not a bad record for a country boy, even if his boxing cards were pirated images that have faded .

[sthoemke]

I can confirm Bibby, Whistler, and Dufur.

wrestlingcardking (aka Rob England) on the boards may have one or more of the cards. He had scans of his SF Hess cards of wrestlers on his myspace photo gallary at one point - not sure if it still exists.