Probstein video about trimmed cards

[Snowman]

Why would anyone expect a consignment company to grade the grading companies? His stance is the most obvious stance that any business would take. If PSA or SGC slabbed it, then he'll list it. Seems like a no brainer. There are millions of trimmed cards in this hobby. Good luck tracking them all down.

[Johnny630]

Market Moving Guys Don't Care once in a PSA holder with a number grade it's gravy train baby!!!

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Why would anyone expect a consignment company to grade the grading companies? His stance is the most obvious stance that any business would take. If PSA or SGC slabbed it, then he'll list it. Seems like a no brainer. There are millions of trimmed cards in this hobby. Good luck tracking them all down.

I couldn't agree more about there being millions of trimmed cards already graded with many more being graded daily. I also can't imagine a business turning down cash by not listing graded cards.

[Leon]

Unfortunate, but true. That is why I mostly collect cards, with big borders, that probably aren't trimmed...

Originally Posted by Snowman

Why would anyone expect a consignment company to grade the grading companies? His stance is the most obvious stance that any business would take. If PSA or SGC slabbed it, then he'll list it. Seems like a no brainer. There are millions of trimmed cards in this hobby. Good luck tracking them all down.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Is it as fun as his Mastro interview video?

[raulus]

I suspect it’s the brazenness as much as anything that is so appalling. It’s one thing to admit that it’s an issue that can’t really be solved with our current methods, and it’s another thing to suggest that you don’t give a hoot.

[refz]

It all boils down to the Almighty Dollar end of story. I’m so sick of seeing this guy in the headlines. If you think he’s shady stay away, if you like him go give him a hug.

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by raulus

I suspect it’s the brazenness as much as anything that is so appalling. It’s one thing to admit that it’s an issue that can’t really be solved with our current methods, and it’s another thing to suggest that you don’t give a hoot.

Agreed, the hubris is at an all time high. Scary

[Fred]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Why would anyone expect a consignment company to grade the grading companies? His stance is the most obvious stance that any business would take. If PSA or SGC slabbed it, then he'll list it. Seems like a no brainer. There are millions of trimmed cards in this hobby. Good luck tracking them all down.

Yup

Originally Posted by Johnny630

Market Moving Guys Don't Care once in a PSA holder with a number grade it's gravy train baby!!!

Yup

Originally Posted by bnorth

I couldn't agree more about there being millions of trimmed cards already graded with many more being graded daily. I also can't imagine a business turning down cash by not listing graded cards.

Yup

I don't agree with his point of view but I can see where where he's coming from. My take is that at least you know where he stands and that you can surmise he won't provide a refund on a holdered/slabbed card (with a numerical grade) that a buyer suspects is trimmed or altered. However, I would guess he might consider a refund, or some other course of action, if the buyer is a whale of a customer that he depends on to fatten his wallet.

I see this as his way of putting it out there. It's kind of hard to blame him because he's a business man offering a service for which people will willingly accept mediocrity.

I've purchased from him before and will continue to do so if the card is something I want and through my observation doesn't appear to be altered (or would be willing to accept the card as such).

I don't think that a few collectors boycotting his auctions is going to make a difference. Sadly, this seems to be the collecting world we live in. This is one of those lines that is very blurred.

The only way a difference will be made is if the TPGs are somehow made accountable and we know that isn't going to happen.

PSA8 Wagner T206.jpg

[Peter_Spaeth]

No different than most auction houses. The flip sanitizes all, and card doctors have triumphed. So it goes. The unholy alliance goes on.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

No different than most auction houses. The flip sanitizes all, and card doctors have triumphed. So it goes. The unholy alliance goes on.

It's a tough spot. How much time can an auction company afford to spend to redo the job that the TPG was supposed to do with the added handicap of trying to do it through the slab?

That being said there's a difference between missing a problem and being complicit in one.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

It's a tough spot. How much time can an auction company afford to spend to redo the job that the TPG was supposed to do with the added handicap of trying to do it through the slab?

That being said there's a difference between missing a problem and being complicit in one.

I know you don't do it, but most of them knowingly take consignments from known card doctors. You don't need to examine the cards that carefully to know the score.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I know you don't do it, but most of them knowingly take consignments from known card doctors. You don't need to examine the cards that carefully to know the score.

I think Rick addressed that issue fairly well when he emphasized them as being "alleged" trimmers. Just because some intentionally anonymous guy on the internet found some before and after pics of a card sold by XYZ123 that was purchased 3 years prior by VCP masked ID **Z doesn't mean that Joe the Plumber is a card trimmer. And just because some fraudster that has a YouTube channel where he calls people out and publishes a "secret list from an insider" doesn't many anyone, let alone everyone, on that list is also a card trimmer.

I'm not saying that all those accused are innocent. Surely, some are not. But it shouldn't be Probstein's job to hold a trial on every hobbyist that gets blasted by hobby clowns on social media. And it wouldn't even do anything anyway. If someone were banned from consigning cards with Probstein, they'd just have their spouse, brother, weed dealer, brother, sister, or pastor send it in for them.

[Leon]

I agree with most of this. However, those before and after pictures are almost universally real and show fraud. I wouldn't discount their chain of custody.
Part of the problem is the apathy about it in the industry, as you also seem to be that way. And I get it....But we can't just ignore all of the fraud because it's ubiquitous.

Originally Posted by Snowman

I think Rick addressed that issue fairly well when he emphasized them as being "alleged" trimmers. Just because some intentionally anonymous guy on the internet found some before and after pics of a card sold by XYZ123 that was purchased 3 years prior by VCP masked ID **Z doesn't mean that Joe the Plumber is a card trimmer. And just because some fraudster that has a YouTube channel where he calls people out and publishes a "secret list from an insider" doesn't many anyone, let alone everyone, on that list is also a card trimmer.

I'm not saying that all those accused are innocent. Surely, some are not. But it shouldn't be Probstein's job to hold a trial on every hobbyist that gets blasted by hobby clowns on social media. And it wouldn't even do anything anyway. If someone were banned from consigning cards with Probstein, they'd just have their spouse, brother, weed dealer, brother, sister, or pastor send it in for them.

[parkplace33]

Originally Posted by Snowman

I think Rick addressed that issue fairly well when he emphasized them as being "alleged" trimmers. Just because some intentionally anonymous guy on the internet found some before and after pics of a card sold by XYZ123 that was purchased 3 years prior by VCP masked ID **Z doesn't mean that Joe the Plumber is a card trimmer. And just because some fraudster that has a YouTube channel where he calls people out and publishes a "secret list from an insider" doesn't many anyone, let alone everyone, on that list is also a card trimmer.

I'm not saying that all those accused are innocent. Surely, some are not. But it shouldn't be Probstein's job to hold a trial on every hobbyist that gets blasted by hobby clowns on social media. And it wouldn't even do anything anyway. If someone were banned from consigning cards with Probstein, they'd just have their spouse, brother, weed dealer, brother, sister, or pastor send it in for them.

This 100 percent. You may not like it, but people have accepted it.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Snowman

But it shouldn't be Probstein's job to hold a trial on every hobbyist that gets blasted by hobby clowns on social media. them.

While I appreciate the thought, as it is something that obviously concerns me too, the idea that the card doctors are worthy of defense and those who are trying to expose them are described as hobby clowns is somewhat interesting.