Every slabbed card has a story, don't it?

[skelly423]

G1911 said it perfectly. It's all about money, and pretending it's anything else is obtuse. Sellers who alter cards (for the pedantic I use the term to include trimming, coloring, soaking or cleaning) NEVER disclose they've altered a card because they know it will crater the resale value. If it's really immaterial, it would be a matter-of-fact detail in the description.

You can rationalize it a hundred different ways, but until I meet a seller who actually discloses their alterations (still waiting), you can't convince me it's anything other than financially motivated deception.

Peter_Spaeth, it's getting awful crowded on this island. I'm starting to think we might be the ones on the mainland.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by skelly423

G1911 said it perfectly. It's all about money, and pretending it's anything else is obtuse. Sellers who alter cards (for the pedantic I use the term to include trimming, coloring, soaking or cleaning) NEVER disclose they've altered a card because they know it will crater the resale value. If it's really immaterial, it would be a matter-of-fact detail in the description.

You can rationalize it a hundred different ways, but until I meet a seller who actually discloses their alterations (still waiting), you can't convince me it's anything other than financially motivated deception.

Peter_Spaeth, it's getting awful crowded on this island. I'm starting to think we might be the ones on the mainland.

For some people, I have no doubt that it's all about money. But for others, it's definitely not. But even for those who are trying to profit from it, what difference does it make? Incentives are irrelevant. The only thing that matters is whether or not what they're doing is OK. And like it or not, the grading companies all allow you to clean your cards. They always have, and always will. Again, trimming, recoloring, that's something else. But Kurt doesn't do that stuff.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by Snowman

For some people, I have no doubt that it's all about money. But for others, it's definitely not. But even for those who are trying to profit from it, what difference does it make? Incentives are irrelevant. The only thing that matters is whether or not what they're doing is OK. And like it or not, the grading companies all allow you to clean your cards. They always have, and always will. Again, trimming, recoloring, that's something else. But Kurt doesn't do that stuff.

There are many videos on Kurt’s YouTube channel where he uses his wizard water to not just “clean” but to also remove scratches, dents, and creases.


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[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

There are many videos on Kurt’s YouTube channel where he uses his wizard water to not just “clean” but to also remove scratches, dents, and creases.


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And Kurt's videos are not continuous so who knows if he is doing other things when the camera is not taking the video. I am not saying he is but seems highly questionable the results he gets by spraying some unknown substance on a card, placing it under weight and having flaws vanish.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

There are many videos on Kurt’s YouTube channel where he uses his wizard water to not just “clean” but to also remove scratches, dents, and creases.


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It's all good!! But God forbid it gets disclosed.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It's all good!! But God forbid it gets disclosed.

There’s no need to disclose; it’s like popping out a dent on your Civic.


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[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

There’s no need to disclose; it’s like popping out a dent on your Civic.


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Yes, used car buyers definitely value originality. LOL. That analogy showed a true lack of understanding of the ethos of card collecting, at least as it used to be.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Yes, used car buyers definitely value originality. LOL. That analogy showed a true lack of understanding of the ethos of card collecting, at least as it used to be.

+1

All we need now is Car(d)fax.


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[G1911]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Yes, used car buyers definitely value originality. LOL. That analogy showed a true lack of understanding of the ethos of card collecting, at least as it used to be.

As it still is. It's a vocal minority trying to justify their fraud. Even this thread's transcript only shows like 2-3 folks actually arguing against disclosure.

Votes in favor of non-disclosure are up, but it does not appear to be anything approaching a majority, though unlike some here I can't pretend to speak for everyone else. Blowout is dominated by the new guys and even that place was very much against the massive fraud and non-disclosures. It's small circles of scammers in which this is a majority view.

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It's all good!! But God forbid it gets disclosed.

But a heck of a lot of effort is being made to explain why disclosing is justified. Such BS.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It's all good!! But God forbid it gets disclosed.

Just read through the comments on this page. It should be quite clear why most people have no interest in disclosing this stuff. You have to have rhino skin to come on here and discuss this stuff openly. Most people don't have it.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Just read through the comments on this page. It should be quite clear why most people have no interest in disclosing this stuff. You have to have rhino skin to come on here and discuss this stuff openly. Most people don't have it.

And yet, alterations need not be disclosed because nobody cares. Strange how these can both be true!

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by G1911

And yet, alterations need not be disclosed because nobody cares. Strange how these can both be true!

As I've mentioned numerous times, I disclose alterations. I also disclose hidden flaws that are not alterations (something very few people in this hobby do). Here are just a handful of random listings I've sold where you can see these disclosures listed in the title (and which are again mentioned in the descriptions).