The Future of Type I Photos

BioCRN · #1 05-08-2024, 12:17 PM

One thing that seemingly hasn't happened yet is insiders making their way into news storage facilities and looting them like rare books/maps/etc and libraries.

It's hard to know how many are out there waiting to be "leaked" from their storage or newspapers/media figuring out those old photos are a hot revenue stream.

jacksons · #2 05-08-2024, 12:29 PM

Photos have always been more about the story to me than anything else. As a collectible, it marries so many elements together, each of which is compelling: subject, event, photographer, location, etc. This makes photos unique. I worry that they�re being treated as commodities in the collecting marketplace currently, being flipped by dealers to capitalize on their popularity, driven mainly by �Type�. Seasoned collectors that appreciate the story will always hold photos in higher regard though. Many of them are museum pieces, one of a handful known to exist. I hope they continue to be treated that way.

Hankphenom · #3 05-08-2024, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BioCRN

One thing that seemingly hasn't happened yet is insiders making their way into news storage facilities and looting them like rare books/maps/etc and libraries. It's hard to know how many are out there waiting to be "leaked" from their storage or newspapers/media figuring out those old photos are a hot revenue stream.

I'm sure that's been going on for years. About 15 years ago, a notorious hobby figure named John Rogers set about buying all of the old newspaper photo archives he could get his hands on, and he got a lot by offering the owners significant money for something they had come to perceive as worth little and in fact costing them in storage space. Rogers was buying and selling thousands of photos a years for several years until he got busted for fraud in not paying his obligations and other nefarious activities. I don't know what happened to the photos he had when his operation went down.

Swadewade51 · #4 05-08-2024, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

I'm sure that's been going on for years. About 15 years ago, a notorious hobby figure named John Rogers set about buying all of the old newspaper photo archives he could get his hands on

+1 yea this is one of the early topics of Jim Chapman's book. I'm fairly certain Rhys from RMY also had/has a partnership with Historic Images (https://historicimages.com/) and gets early looks into press collections.

Many news prints have been destroyed over time as companies went under, storage became to expensive, and the digital world expanded.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

Exhibitman · #5 05-08-2024, 01:20 PM

I think good photos have a bright future but meh photos are going to fall back. The main difference is that composition and quality of the image are big factors in desirability. A card is the same image, differentiated on condition. A photo has an aesthetic that depends on a variety of factors: subject, quality, composition, story. Here is a favorite of mine, the Cubs on Catalina Island for spring training, Gabby Hartnett at the front, walking along the harbor at Avalon imitating The Seven Dwarves doing Hi Ho It's Off To Work We Go from Snow White. It has everything I could want: good subject, solid composition, nice quality, and an instantly understood, whimsical story.

Or this one of Satchel Paige warming up:

I like a sharp, iconic portrait too, like this June 21, 1935 Joe Louis:

prewarsports · #6 05-08-2024, 01:21 PM

I will add a couple thoughts with quite a bit of experience. When I started RMY Auctions in 2013, everyone thought that photographs would never be a stand-alone hobby, but just things to throw into major auctions at the end. Now everyone has a photo division, but all they are doing is recycling many of the same images that have been sold and resold numerous times, because nothing new is really hitting the market. Photos were not worth much ten years ago and newspapers were calling to try and dump their photographs. We would go into basements and haul out dusty boxes of photographs just so that newspapers could clear out space in warehouses. Everything was "fresh to the market." In ten years the ENTIRE landscape has shifted. Newspapers and archives not only are holding onto their images, but treating them like gold and re-evaluating them as substantial assets, getting appraisals in the tens of millions of dollars. Most of the newspapers in the country are now part of large groups under a corporate entity. Rather than sell, most are being donated to museums for HUGE tax write offs, or scanned and organized in secure facilities. "The good old days" of ten years ago are a distant memory and we will never go back there again. Very few new archives will ever hit the market.

Bicem · #7 05-08-2024, 01:46 PM

Great insight Rhys.

I collected postcards when no one really cared about them and they could be had for a fraction of what cards were going for. I feel like I'm currently at the exact same place with significant photographs.

Ruth final Yankees game...

Aquarian Sports Cards · #8 05-08-2024, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prewarsports

I will add a couple thoughts with quite a bit of experience. When I started RMY Auctions in 2013, everyone thought that photographs would never be a stand-alone hobby, but just things to throw into major auctions at the end. Now everyone has a photo division, but all they are doing is recycling many of the same images that have been sold and resold numerous times, because nothing new is really hitting the market. Photos were not worth much ten years ago and newspapers were calling to try and dump their photographs. We would go into basements and haul out dusty boxes of photographs just so that newspapers could clear out space in warehouses. Everything was "fresh to the market." In ten years the ENTIRE landscape has shifted. Newspapers and archives not only are holding onto their images, but treating them like gold and re-evaluating them as substantial assets, getting appraisals in the tens of millions of dollars. Most of the newspapers in the country are now part of large groups under a corporate entity. Rather than sell, most are being donated to museums for HUGE tax write offs, or scanned and organized in secure facilities. "The good old days" of ten years ago are a distant memory and we will never go back there again. Very few new archives will ever hit the market.

Oh I don't know, something new pops up every now and then

aljurgela · #9 05-08-2024, 02:03 PM

From his native island

Bicem · #10 05-08-2024, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aljurgela

From his native island

Didn't know Beckett used PSA's type system.

hcv123 · #11 05-08-2024, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aljurgela

From his native island

Great photo!

Exhibitman · #12 05-08-2024, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prewarsports

"The good old days" of ten years ago are a distant memory and we will never go back there again. Very few new archives will ever hit the market.

So true. You got in early and smart, Rhys. Did you have any idea what gold you were mining at the time?

One qualifier: there are lots of private 'archives' out there. For example, sports writers in the analog days had files of photos that they got from their jobs and those files come up for sale in flea markets, paper fairs, antique shows, etc. Most of it is dross but one can run across a vein of gold now and then. This 1969 Simpson premium came out of one such archive last month:

This Ali photo came from one I found at an antique show years ago:

jacksons · #13 05-08-2024, 01:17 PM

All laid out here�

https://defector.com/he-said-he-was-...of-memorabilia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

I'm sure that's been going on for years. About 15 years ago, a notorious hobby figure named John Rogers set about buying all of the old newspaper photo archives he could get his hands on, and he got a lot by offering the owners significant money for something they had come to perceive as worth little and in fact costing them in storage space. Rogers was buying and selling thousands of photos a years for several years until he got busted for fraud in not paying his obligations and other nefarious activities. I don't know what happened to the photos he had when his operation went down.

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