What are the best vintage, investment-type players in your opinion?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Let's not go overboard. Yogi had a 59.5 WAR and ranks 6th among catchers. Mantle's WAR is almost double that. Great player, but not IMO somehow criminally undervalued.

[packs]

Yogi has no bearing on the conversation. He wasn't a centerfielder, he didn't switch hit, and he wasn't talked about like the second coming, nor did he have the pressure to be one.

I can't overstate what Mantle was able to do. Rarely does any player live up the hype. Mantle exceeded all hype on the biggest team on earth at the time and was the generational player of his time after stepping into the shoes of the generational player of their time (DiMaggio). People are discounting this fact too much.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

Yogi has no bearing on the conversation. He wasn't a centerfielder, he didn't switch hit, and he wasn't talked about like the second coming, nor did he have the pressure to be one.

I can't overstate what Mantle was able to do. Rarely does any player live up the hype. Mantle exceeded all hype on the biggest team on earth at the time and was the generational player of his time after stepping into the shoes of the generational player of their time (DiMaggio). People are discounting this fact too much.

I think too, as I initially mentioned, that a big part of the Mantle mystique is the "what if" factor -- how much MORE would he have done if he had good legs?

[vintagerookies51]

I don't feel confident in calling anybody but the household names investments. There are plenty of people who are probably undervalued that are just too niche to reach anybody that doesn't get deep into the history of baseball - John Ward, Ed Delahanty, Frank Robinson.

Even the names we think are household ballplayers aren't as well known as we think - it's insane to me over the years how many people couldn't tell me who Mickey Mantle is. But they're known well enough to the public that anybody who gets into collecting old baseball cards usually jumps to the legends - Ruth, Mantle, Robinson, Cobb, Wagner, DiMaggio, Gehrig, Young, Mays, Aaron are guys I would put in the top 10 in no particular order. Players who are arguably just as good or better but aren't as well known I would throw in the next tier - WaJo, Mathewson, Ted Williams, Yogi Berra, Stan Musial, Clemente, Koufax

Huge announcements like the MLB including Negro Leagues stats has possibly inserted guys like Josh Gibson into the mix as well

[Beercan collector]

Originally Posted by vintagerookies51

I don't feel confident in calling anybody but the household names investments. There are plenty of people who are probably undervalued that are just too niche to reach anybody that doesn't get deep into the history of baseball - John Ward, Ed Delahanty, Frank Robinson.

Even the names we think are household ballplayers aren't as well known as we think - it's insane to me over the years how many people couldn't tell me who Mickey Mantle is. But they're known well enough to the public that anybody who gets into collecting old baseball cards usually jumps to the legends - Ruth, Mantle, Robinson, Cobb, Wagner, DiMaggio, Gehrig, Young, Mays, Aaron are guys I would put in the top 10 in no particular order. Players who are arguably just as good or better but aren't as well known I would throw in the next tier - WaJo, Mathewson, Ted Williams, Yogi Berra, Stan Musial, Clemente, Koufax

Huge announcements like the MLB including Negro Leagues stats has possibly inserted guys like Josh Gibson into the mix as well

👍 .. Cy Young t206 portrait will probably always float ..
with the Cy Young Award and what not .. And it’s a good looking card

[Peter_Spaeth]

Good list. I'd put Joe Jackson in and take Berra out. And I probably would add Rose and Ryan from the 60s.

[Fuddjcal]

Very sorry I derailed the discussion. I didn't mean to slander poor Mike Trout, the ChyNA doll. Can we forget that bum now and talk about Mickey again?
Trout has packs to rip so he can add to his 37 M salary for doing absolutely nothing again this year. I can't see where that would cause any animosity.

I'm just curious if it's libel or slander if it's true?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

Very sorry I derailed the discussion. I didn't mean to slander poor Mike Trout, the ChyNA doll. Can we forget that bum now and talk about Mickey again?
Trout has packs to rip so he can add to his 37 M salary for doing absolutely nothing again this year. I can't see where that would cause any animosity.

I'm just curious if it's libel or slander if it's true?

It was a great derailment as we got to see someone be wrong and then argue they were correct. That is always fun. As someone who may or may not have gotten a letter from a lawyer for something they posted on here. I can guarantee the letter from the lawyer used libel and not slander.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

Very sorry I derailed the discussion. I didn't mean to slander poor Mike Trout, the ChyNA doll. Can we forget that bum now and talk about Mickey again?
Trout has packs to rip so he can add to his 37 M salary for doing absolutely nothing again this year. I can't see where that would cause any animosity.

I'm just curious if it's libel or slander if it's true?

No, truth is a defense, but it would be tough to establish here.

[jsfriedm]

Originally Posted by packs

Yogi has no bearing on the conversation. He wasn't a centerfielder, he didn't switch hit, and he wasn't talked about like the second coming, nor did he have the pressure to be one.

I can't overstate what Mantle was able to do. Rarely does any player live up the hype. Mantle exceeded all hype on the biggest team on earth at the time and was the generational player of his time after stepping into the shoes of the generational player of their time (DiMaggio). People are discounting this fact too much.

Whatever you want to say about Mantle, he certainly did not exceed the hype. In his own words in the Ken Burns documentary, "Casey bragged on me so much saying I was going to be the next Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, and Joe DiMaggio all rolled into one, and it just never happened." As great as Mantle was, he certainly fell far short of people's expectations of him, partly because of his injuries, partly because of his alcoholism, and partly just because of his dedication to baseball, or lack thereof. As Mantle once told Bob Costas about Stan Musial, "He was a better player than I was because he was a better man than I was."

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Let's not go overboard. Yogi had a 59.5 WAR and ranks 6th among catchers. Mantle's WAR is almost double that. Great player, but not IMO somehow criminally undervalued.

This is an example of how a player that won 10 World Series, made 15 straight all star games, won 3 mvps and had mvp shares in 14 of his playing years is as overlooked as he is. I guess focus on war predominates. Sad that yogi isn’t appreciated like he should be. Spahn’s whip pales in comparison to x and y too.

[packs]

Originally Posted by Carter08

This is an example of how a player that won 10 World Series, made 15 straight all star games, won 3 mvps and had mvp shares in 14 of his playing years is as overlooked as he is. I guess focus on war predominates. Sad that yogi isn’t appreciated like he should be. Spahn’s whip pales in comparison to x and y too.

Yogi was a catcher. It doesn't make sense to compare his popularity with Mantle, a switch-hitting centerfielder and ultra hyped prospect. It's like saying Pudge should have gotten more attention than Griffey.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

Yogi was a catcher. It doesn't make sense to compare his popularity with Mantle, a switch-hitting centerfielder and ultra hyped prospect. It's like saying Pudge should have gotten more attention than Griffey.

A switch hitting CF who hit tape measure home runs and won triple crowns.