Theft at Philly Show

[ClementeFanOh]

PeterSpaeth and G1911-

Thanks once again for proving my point. I'll stick to facts here (tough for
both of you, I get it):

1) Peter- You tell me to "go #!*& myself", yet I'm the one with the problem.
Where exactly do you come from, anyway? (Don't answer, it's rhetorical).

2) G1911- You exceed even your depths of stupidity. I don't believe you and
your buddy Peter are conspiring against me- I think you are both
egomaniacs. By the way, I did NOT "endorse bringing a gun out at
shows". For someone who pretends to be the ultimate rationalist, such a
blatant lie seems indefensible at this point. You are quite literally making
things up to defame me. My memory isn't what it used to be, but even I
can scroll up, partner.

3) G1911- I hope like heck you mistyped above and that you own M80
fireworks, not an M4. Yep, I've decided to believe that just for peace
of mind.

4) Adam did nothing wrong- he just bit into your inexhaustible desire to
turn the thread to what YOU want to discuss, rather than the poster.
Are the rest of us in any danger of either of you contributing a useful
idea of how to minimize thefts at shows? Or are you stuck in an endless
Moebius strip of inane chatter? I'm just a guy who dislikes hearing about
these high dollar heists and would like to discuss ways to stop them.

I'm done, please continue this 2-person episode of Short Attention Span
Theater. It won't entertain anyone else, but that hasn't stopped you before.

Trent King

[G1911]

Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh

PeterSpaeth and G1911-

Thanks once again for proving my point. I'll stick to facts here (tough for
both of you, I get it):

1) Peter- You tell me to "go #!*& myself", yet I'm the one with the problem.
Where exactly do you come from, anyway? (Don't answer, it's rhetorical).

2) G1911- You exceed even your depths of stupidity. I don't believe you and
your buddy Peter are conspiring against me- I think you are both
egomaniacs. By the way, I did NOT "endorse bringing a gun out at
shows". For someone who pretends to be the ultimate rationalist, such a
blatant lie seems indefensible at this point. You are quite literally making
things up to defame me. My memory isn't what it used to be, but even I
can scroll up, partner.

3) G1911- I hope like heck you mistyped above and that you own M80
fireworks, not an M4. Yep, I've decided to believe that just for peace
of mind.

4) Adam did nothing wrong- he just bit into your inexhaustible desire to
turn the thread to what YOU want to discuss, rather than the poster.
Are the rest of us in any danger of either of you contributing a useful
idea of how to minimize thefts at shows? Or are you stuck in an endless
Moebius strip of inane chatter? I'm just a guy who dislikes hearing about
these high dollar heists and would like to discuss ways to stop them.

I'm done, please continue this 2-person episode of Short Attention Span
Theater. It won't entertain anyone else, but that hasn't stopped you before.

Trent King

2) - It is in the transcript, you fucking idiot. When you were informed that a thief cannot be deterred by a gun they don't know exists, you advocated open carrying at card shows before being unable to defend this dumbass idea. You are in the transcript having a meltdown because you are the only one who wants to show off guns at card shows like a god damn lunatic lol. The transcript of your repeated batshit crazy affinity to look for violent solutions defames you.

3) - Yes, it's the guy who is *against violence* that you are raging at in your second Net54 meltdown for endorsing non-violence that is the danger.

4) - Do you have any useful ideas or only the fantasies of a 12 year old COD player? So far your idea here is showing off guns, lying and screeching.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Right, you did not endorse bringing out a gun at shows.

3) Again, the mere presence of a weapon might well persuade a bad guy
to try someone else. "An armed society is a polite society".

And when you were asked to explain how a concealed weapon could deter anyone, you made clear you were talking about open carry.

3) If you really need to be told how a presence of a weapon- concealed or
not- may deter a person with criminal intent, you don't belong in this
chat. (Maybe start with a Google search for "open carry", if you can
manage it).

But we're the ones who are confused.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Will never understand Americans and their passion for guns. No need to explain or defend your views because it's all so foreign to a lot of us who live in countries without this culture.

Anyway, here's a great song from my country about guns which has nothing to do with the conversation here, but good music is good music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xH8RoAPKoWk

[MikeGarcia]

.. I MADE POPCORN :

[notfast]

Every thread about a theft results in ClementeFanOh telling everyone why his opinion is right and everyone else’s is wrong. It’s funny.

Also, lots of people conceal carry at card shows. Like A LOT. Especially in PA.

[ClementeFanOh]

Notfast has joined this miserable little battle. If ever I doubted my stance
in this matter, that doubt is now removed... And for the record, Notsmart,
I haven't claimed that I'm right and everyone else is wrong- that's just more
hyperbole from a tired mind. I have made the point that changes need to
happen at shows to make it harder on thieves, and suggested multiple
changes myself. Predictably, one segment started a 2nd Amendment debate
and ignored the actual thrust of the original post. I hardly think I'm right all
the time; however, I am capable of staying on point. How about you?

Trent King

[Exhibitman]

Trent: no hyperbole or sounding off to hear myself think, just throwing some cold water on the Clint Eastwood control fantasies about guns.

Most people are not capable of handling a gun in a stressful situation, let alone in a crowd. They are not trained and have no experience. The few times I've brandished my gun for self-defense reasons at home I've been scared crapless and not sure if I could have hit the side of a barn cleanly had the sight of a big-ass gun not scared off the miscreants. I was not in a crowd, either. Armed in public in a crowd is not a place for amateurs. If shows allow arms, I am far more afraid of some yahoo with a handgun firing wildly into the crowd than I am of anyone stealing cards at a card show.

The laws on the line between self-defense and criminally culpable homicide are very fine and nuanced, again not a place for amateurs to play sheriff. We covered it in law school and just scraped the surface. Most of the popular 'knowledge' about it is folktales. As someone else noted, you can't just shoot someone who stole something, nor are the 'stand your ground' laws in the states that have them as absolute as the fantasists claim.

Now, taking on the topic of show security: I have promoted shows, set up at them, and attended them for nearly 50 years. I was asked into a group that wanted to run shows in LA and I opted not to join because of my concerns about security. It is just a matter of time before the sneak thievery and car break-ins move to armed robbery of dealers or the Los Angeles specialty, the smash and grab flash mob robbery. I do not wish to be on the liability end of any of that.

Most shows I have set up at since COVID have been in municipal facilities patrolled actively by local PD. I think that is the best way to keep the crime to a minimum, visible and active law enforcement presence. If I wanted to promote a show again, it would only be in a facility where I could get police stationed inside and I would also insist on hiring off-duty police officers for additional security.

I completely agree that show attendees and dealers will have to consider paying for security to be part of their future ticket prices and overhead expenses. There is just too much money sloshing around shows to count on amateurs to deter the crime.

[notfast]

Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh

Notfast has joined this miserable little battle. If ever I doubted my stance
in this matter, that doubt is now removed... And for the record, Notsmart,
I haven't claimed that I'm right and everyone else is wrong- that's just more
hyperbole from a tired mind. I have made the point that changes need to
happen at shows to make it harder on thieves, and suggested multiple
changes myself. Predictably, one segment started a 2nd Amendment debate
and ignored the actual thrust of the original post. I hardly think I'm right all
the time; however, I am capable of staying on point. How about you?

Trent King

Do you attend shows?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by MikeGarcia

.. I MADE POPCORN :

Sadly no popcorn because of health issues but I am on my 3rd bag of Pork Rinds because this thread delivers.

I have no real ideas besides stop using cash but we all know the reason that isn't happening. I am kinda amazed with all the cards being shown off on here over the years that a few members haven't had their houses broken into.