Ted Williams, Joe DiMaggio

gonzo · #1 11-13-2025, 10:22 AM

I think a lot of it is that they missed key sets. DiMaggio�s career fell right between the Goudeys and 1952 Topps. And Williams missed 1952 Topps and a couple of the other 50s Topps sets. So they don�t have what would have been headline cards in �52 Topps. And as cool as some of the �40s and late �30s issues are to us, they don�t have the mass appeal of �52 Topps.

packs · #2 11-13-2025, 10:37 AM

It really is a shame DiMaggio wasn't in the 49, 50 or 51 Bowman sets. Imagine the cards.

DeanH3 · #3 11-13-2025, 11:02 AM

I've wondered if Williams would have stuck around if he had not missed all that time. He could have been close enough to the all-time home run record that maybe he sticks it out a year or two more. He wasn't really struggling when retired.

Fred · #4 11-13-2025, 10:43 AM

I look at Ted Williams and think, wow, what he could have done if the military service didn't interrupt his career. He'd have had 3K hits, 2K runs and RBIs. Who knows if he'd had a third or fourth triple crown.

Not saying Joe was a slouch. But he was a Yankee and received a lot of props for a career on great Yankee teams and all those WS championships. Now, here's where people are going to say I'm just stupid. I think Joe was a better overall offensive player than (get ready for this), the Mick.

Good points about both missing the 52T set, but I've never looked at players based on what sets they were in. Joe did make the 38 Goudey set, but ok, it's not the prettiest set.

Peter_Spaeth · #5 11-13-2025, 10:51 AM

Both upper tier in my mind.

Mandatory reading.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1...-bid-kid-adieu

perezfan · #6 11-13-2025, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Both upper tier in my mind.

Mandatory reading.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1...-bid-kid-adieu

Agree. Both are absolutely top-tier. Ted missed so much time to military service (prime years) that he likely would've reached 700 HRs in addition to the other incredible milestones listed above.

Rhotchkiss · #7 11-13-2025, 03:24 PM

The OP says �under appreciated in the hobby.� I take this to mean value. Assuming that�s the topic, I agree that they are (certainly) a tier below the ultimates. I also agree that�s partly bc of the timing of their careers and their non-inclusion in one or more of the hobby�s ultimate sets.

That said, between the two, I would put my money on Joe D over Ted because (1) he was a Yankee, (2) he has the consecutive hit game record that will never be beat, (3) he is a prominent lyric in a major Simon and Garfunkel song, and (4) he was married to Marilyn Monroe. In other words, there are real and meaningful reasons greater than their baseball career to remember Joe over Ted.

robw1959 · #8 11-13-2025, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

The OP says “under appreciated in the hobby.” I take this to mean value. Assuming that’s the topic, I agree that they are (certainly) a tier below the ultimates. I also agree that’s partly bc of the timing of their careers and their non-inclusion in one or more of the hobby’s ultimate sets.

That said, between the two, I would put my money on Joe D over Ted because (1) he was a Yankee, (2) he has the consecutive hit game record that will never be beat, (3) he is a prominent lyric in a major Simon and Garfunkel song, and (4) he was married to Marilyn Monroe. In other words, there are real and meaningful reasons greater than their baseball career to remember Joe over Ted.

Perhaps societally Joe does get a cultural nod, but those cultural points aren't good enough reasons to value him or prefer him as a player over Ted Williams. Nobody ever had the hand and eye coordination of Ted. For example, he was such a great fighter pilot that the military recalled him for both WWII AND the Korean War. Despite protesting the "unfairness" of it, Ted served admirably on the front lines in both, refusing the possibility of just being a USO show military baseball player that was a privilege afforded to some other MLB players during that time. That plus having a greater career OPS than everybody else other than Babe Ruth seals the deal for me.

DeanH3 · #9 11-13-2025, 07:08 PM

If he had been sitting at 691 HR’s he very well could have stuck around and possibly passed Ruth who was only at 715. How would he have been looked at if Aaron had passed Ted Williams record instead of Babe Ruth? Interesting to ponder.

Vintageclout · #10 11-15-2025, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

The OP says “under appreciated in the hobby.” I take this to mean value. Assuming that’s the topic, I agree that they are (certainly) a tier below the ultimates. I also agree that’s partly bc of the timing of their careers and their non-inclusion in one or more of the hobby’s ultimate sets.

That said, between the two, I would put my money on Joe D over Ted because (1) he was a Yankee, (2) he has the consecutive hit game record that will never be beat, (3) he is a prominent lyric in a major Simon and Garfunkel song, and (4) he was married to Marilyn Monroe. In other words, there are real and meaningful reasons greater than their baseball career to remember Joe over Ted.

Great points Ryan, but you’re missing one piece of significant history. Ted Williams was a true war hero, shooting down 16 enemy aircraft in the Korean War. Add the fact he still arguably stands as baseball’s greatest all-time hitter and you can literally flip a coin between the two.

Mark17 · #11 11-16-2025, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vintageclout

Great points Ryan, but you�re missing one piece of significant history. Ted Williams was a true war hero, shooting down 16 enemy aircraft in the Korean War. Add the fact he still arguably stands as baseball�s greatest all-time hitter and you can literally flip a coin between the two.

Ted was also a world-class fisherman. Not saying that means much regarding card value or in any other way, but it highlights the fact that when Ted focused on something, be it hitting a baseball, flying airplanes, or outwitting fish, he made himself one of the best in the world at it.

GasHouseGang · #12 11-17-2025, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vintageclout

Great points Ryan, but you’re missing one piece of significant history. Ted Williams was a true war hero, shooting down 16 enemy aircraft in the Korean War. Add the fact he still arguably stands as baseball’s greatest all-time hitter and you can literally flip a coin between the two.

Not to diminish anything Ted Williams did during his military career, but all the on-line sources I looked up said, "Ted Williams shot down four enemy aircraft during the Korean War. He was officially credited with three kills during his service, but a fourth was only confirmed later when Russian records were declassified."

rats60 · #13 11-13-2025, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Both upper tier in my mind.

Mandatory reading.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1...-bid-kid-adieu

I agree. I value my 1941 Play Ball set with Williams and DiMaggio as much as my t206 and 1933 Goudey sets.

I think DiMaggio is hurt more than Williams by missing the 3 seasons due to WWII. Williams gets credit for the time he missed because he played longer than DiMaggio (17 seasons + 2 partial seasons to Joe's 13) and came close to milestones (521 HRs, 2654 hits, 1798 runs, 1839 RBIs). However, what is Joe's legacy if he plays those season and ends up with 11 Championships (most all time) and 4 or 5 MVPs? Joe was considered to better player at the time because he excelled in all phases of the game while Ted was clearly the better hitter. Today it seems like Joe is forgotten by a lot of people.

DiMaggio is also treated poorly by advanced metrics. DiMaggio hit . 325/.398/.579/.977 vs Mantle . 298/.421/.557/.977. You would think that the guy who hit for more power with a higher average would be more valued, but Mantle is credited with an OPS+ of 172 while DiMaggio only 155. So while Mantle took advantage of the short porch in RF at Yankee Stadium, DiMaggio lost hits and HRs in Yankee Stadium's spacious LF. That is ignored by OPS+ and WAR.

Peter_Spaeth · #14 11-13-2025, 03:18 PM

The Richard Ben Cramer biography of DiMaggio did his reputation no favors either.

Then again, no one was singing Ted, Ted Williams, we want you on our side. Or, where have you gone, Ted Williams?

REG1976 · #15 11-13-2025, 03:27 PM

1941 56 Game Hitting Streak

MVSNYC · #16 11-13-2025, 03:57 PM

Great point about neither of them being in some of the more "major" sets- 33 Goudey, 52 Topps, etc.

I'm with Ryan, I'll take Joe D...

9x World Series Champion, 3x MVP...Cool name. Marilyn Monroe.

Leon · #17 11-13-2025, 04:22 PM

One of my fave BST pick ups..

Jobu · #18 11-13-2025, 04:31 PM

I've always thought that Williams doesn't get his due - either in the hobby or overall.

I crunched some numbers on the time he missed for his war service - where he didn't have a cushy gig, he was actually flying planes instead of entertaining troops. For his two tours, I took the season before the tour and after the tour and averaged the stats, including the games played, and then added those stats to his career totals. And note, the missing seasons from the 1950s assume a reasonable number of games played for a guy who was getting a bit older but still had a lot left in the tank. If we assume would have played closer to 150 games those two years, these totals would have been a bit higher.

The career ranks listed below are based on current totals. If we look at the leaders at the time he retired, he would have been #2 in HR and #1 in hits in addition to still being #1 in all of these other stats. In other words, Ted would definitely be held in much higher regard today and for the last 70 years.

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