Mission Accomplished.....Piedmont 150 Series

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

The Philly Show came through for me (as always) in my pursuit to "complete"
my run to acquire the 1st Series of T206 cards with only PIEDMONT 150 backs.

This Orange colored (normally Red Chance) was the last card I needed. It's not
as nice as the rest of my 150+ cards in this series; however, I could not pass
up a color error.
Of course I need Wagner, Plank, and Magie; but, I am in no hurry to get them....Ha !
There are very few Wagner's and only one Plank known to have P150 backs. And,
of course the Magie error only exists as a P150.

Speaking about Magee....I have had an awful tough time finding the normal Magee
portrait with a P150 back. I could speculate that there is a "conspiracy" by some to
corner the market on this version.....for whatever reasons ?

I am curious.....How many T206 collectors on this Forum have a Magee (portrait)
with a Piedmont 150 back ?

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Posted By: peter ullman

ted...i used to have one. i carried it around me in my wallet for good luck...but I lost it!

pete in mn

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Posted By: Chris

Congrats Ted! That's a nice accomplishment.

To answer your question -- I had a Magee port that I just sold about a month ago.

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Posted By: Scot Reader

Ted,
Congratulations on completion (or almost) of your Piedmont 150 quest! Magee (Portrait) is pretty tough. While I have no proof, given that this error has been well-known for so many decades it seems possible that dozens or even hundreds may have been lost in misguided attempts to transform them into Magies. I have handled several hundred T206 commons (I'm sure you have handled 100 times as many) but I have never had a Magee (Portrait). The ones in decent shape always seem to sell for more of a premium than I have ever been willing to pay--probably due to a combination of close association with Magie and relative difficulty.
Scot

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Posted By: barry arnold

tRex,

i just saw Mission Impossible 3 and your Mission Accomplished is 100X more exciting!!!!
Congratulations!!!

My Magee is sweet cap methinks.
I'll check for sure later today.

all the best

herbivore barry

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Posted By: J Levine

Congrats on the run..very impressive.

Over the years I have had the "luck" to own several Magee Portraits...a quick inventory showed that out of the 6 I own, only one is Piedmont 150.

Joshua

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Posted By: Martin Neal

Hi Ted,

I have a piedmont 150 series magee. The front is in ex shape but the back has a stamp of an " english bobbie " I have seen others and have tried to buy them before.

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Posted By: T206Collector

...condition T206 cards in my set is the Magee portrait -- it is absolute rubbish. Every time I consider upgrading, the seller finds someone willing to pay as if Mr. Magee were a lesser known Hall of Famer. But, I think there is a scarcity issue as well...

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Scot Reader

What are my chances if I continue to pursue the remaining set with Piedmont only
backs ? At the Philly Show this weekend I sold my Demmitt (St L) & O'Hara (St L),
since we know they only exist with Polar Bear backs. So, is my math correct that
a complete Piedmont "set" consists of 518 cards....or, did I miss something ?

I am near complete with the 48 - So. Leaguers; and, the 48 - 460 only Series (all
with Piedmont backs).

Also, I now have about 160 cards with Piedmont 350 back (Major & Minor Leaguers)
for a grand total of 404 cards or approx. 78 % of this possible "set".

And, should I acquire any remaining Major Leaguers (available in either 350/460
Subjects) as 350's or 460's ? For these particular cards,which of these backs will
make it easier for me ?

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Posted By: Scott Mosley

Hi Ted,

It was great stopping by and saying hello this weekend along with Mike Peich and Tim Newcomb...

I did a quick check and my Magee portrait happens to be a Piedmont 150 as well.

Regards,

Scott

Edited to add congratulations on completing your run of Piedmont 150s!

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Posted By: Lee Behrens

Nice work Ted!!!!!!!

My Magee is a Piedmont 150. The Magee port always seems to command a 30-50% over a regular common from my finddings.

The Lesser Evil Behrens Bros.

Lee

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Posted By: Scot Reader

<< [I]s my math correct that a complete Piedmont "set" consists of 518 cards....or, did I miss something? >>

Excluding J. Doyle (N.Y. Nat'l), Magie, Plank, Wagner (Pittsburg), there are:

9 150-only (probably 7 more = 16)
+ 144 150/350 (probably 7 less = 137)
+ 208 350-only
+ 6 350/460 super prints
+ 55 350/460 regular prints
+ 48 460-only
+ 48 southern leaguers

= 518.

I believe your math is correct, unless you separately count series and factory variations; that is, unless you separately count Piedmont 150 and Piedmont 350 for the 150/350 subjects and separately count Piedmont 350, Piedmont 460/25 and Piedmont 460/42 for the 350/460 subjects.

<< And, should I acquire any remaining Major Leaguers (available in either 350/460 Subjects) as 350's or 460's ? For these particular cards,which of these backs will make it easier for me ? >>

The 350/460s are about 2X easier to find with the Piedmont 350 back. So finding the 350/460 subjects with Piedmont 350 should generally be easier than finding them with Piedmont 460.

Scot

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Posted By: Brian Weisner

Hi Ted,
Congrats.... Next time you need one common to complete a set email me, I have a nice Magee I would have sent you. I'm now working on a "master set" so I will never finish. Be well Brian

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Posted By: Anonymous

Allright, Ted!
These are all Piedmonts

Oh heck, I thought I had a scan here.
I haven't figured out how to attach the scans.

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Posted By: Rick

does anyone know how many cards would a master set contain?

all possible back variations etc... has anyone ever tried to complete a master set?

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Posted By: Anonymous

I'll try again
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Oh,well
I'll figure it out soon.

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Posted By: Anonymous

Ted,
the 150 series cards are: Cobb bat on shoulder, Chase portrait, Evers portrait, Joss portrait, Tinker hands on knees.

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Posted By: Scot Reader

<< does anyone know how many cards would a master set contain? all possible back variations etc... >>

Based on what is known about which series are available with which backs there are roughly 6,900 theoretical front/back combinations. The number of front/back combinations that exist in fact may be somewhat lower than this.

<< has anyone ever tried to complete a master set? >>

Others on this board claim to know people who have tried (or are trying); I doubt anyone has come close.

Scot

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Scot R.

Thanks for confirming the 518 card count.

Also, thanks for the advice on going after the P350 backs on the cards that
are available either in the 350 or 460 series.

And, I think I have my hands full just acquiring the easy Factory #s; so,
to answer you....I don't think I will be trying for the "esoteric" Factory #s.
But, if I happen to find a card with, say a P460/42 back, then there is "more
joy in Mudville".

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Posted By: Brian Weisner

Hi Scot and Ted,
The quest for the "Master set" of T206's with all the available backs was invented by some of us insane collectors addicted to T206's. It's not enough to finish a set, because then the quest would end and we would have to move on to another set. So somone came up with the bright idea to collect each card with every possible back, which as we know is impossible, because they simply do not exist. Therefore we will continue to enjoy the T206 set until it kills us or we run out of money or both.

I would guess Heitman, Fritsch, Lipset, Martineau, and Mastro have come the closest. But, that's pure speculation. I'm up to 1346 cards, but that's a long..... way from 7000.

PS Be glad, otherwise I'd be competing with you guys on type cards and E cards, and prices would contiue to rise.

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Posted By: Rick

6900

that would be amazing!

good luck on the master set ...a true collector!

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Posted By: Scot Reader

Brian,
1346 is no small feat.
Let us know when you hit the 2000 milestone!
Maybe in 2015?
Scot

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Brian W.

In the 1980's I put together a 521 card set (- Plank & Wagner). I was content
with this for a quite a while.

Then I sold it in 1997. In 2004 I picked up a large lot of T206's and I was on my
way to a 2nd "set" (520 cards this time). This one I "completed" last December.

But, call it an obsession (or certainly an addiction). As soon as I acquired these
520 cards, I then decided to undertake this Piedmont 150 Series challenge. Since
my theory is that the Piedmont's in this series were the very 1st T206's printed.
This is implicit in the Magie (error) card.

So, I broke up this 2nd set and now I am on a grander mission to attain all the
possible 518 cards that have Piedmont backs. And, this 518 card set I will pass
on to my Grandson Ronnie, who is just 20 years old.

Hopefully, Ronnie will continue collecting T206 sets (as a function of the different
backs) and, by the time he reaches my age, he will have acquired enough T206's
to have a "master" set. Time is what it takes to amass almost 7000 cards.

This will be one of my legacies to him.

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Posted By: Chris

Ted,

Should you for any reason need a second grandson, I will be happy to assume that role.

Chris

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Posted By: Brian Weisner

Hi Ted,
I agree, If I were your grandson I would get to 2000 a lot quicker. I'd be happy to get to 3000 by the year 2015, but I doubt it will happen. Whilr evryone agree's there are a lot of T206's in existence, there aren't that many with different backs. Be well Brian

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

BRIAN W.

The way I look at it, depending upon which backs you are collecting, you could be
approx. 1/2 the way there. There are really only 5 backs to consider (Piedmont,
Old Mill, Sovereign, Sweet Caporal, and the tougher El Principe de Gales).... that
is if you want to maintain your sanity. And, I say this because the cards with
these "basic" five Tobacco Adv. are pretty well defined.

These are the only ones that are included in all 3 - Series. Trying to collect "sets"
with any of the other 10 backs will result in "sets" far short of 500+ cards.

Therefore, 5 (basic backs) x 518 (cards) = 2590 cards.

Of course, I would think that you probably have been accumulating most of your
T206 cards in some sort of a random manner. If so, then of course you are not
really 1/2 way to these (5 x 500+) "sets".
However, I thought you might appreciate my observations.

SCOT R.....please check me on these observation.

Although, I am curious.....Brian, did you start this great adventure with some
systematic approach in mind ?

T-Rex Ted

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Posted By: Brian Weisner

Hi Ted,
I bought my first T206 at the "Super Flea" flea market in Grennsboro, NC when I was 8 years old. It was a beautiful green portrait of Ty Cobb in Good condition that cost me my entire bank roll 20 dollars. The dealer wanted 25, but lowered his price to 20 and I've been hooked ever since.
The card has a Piedmont 150 back, and is still in my collection today. In those days I had no idea that the cards came with different backs as Piedmont,Sweet Cap, Old Mill, and Polar Bear were the only ones I had ever seen. When I was about 12 I began buying a few cards from catalogs and someone sent me a copy of Heitman's Monster as a bonus. I didn't think much of it at the time, because it wasn't a card, but found it invaluable many years later. I believe I was about 20 when I completed "my set" minus Wagner, Magie and Doyle(who didn't exist at the time)when I lost interest in cards and focused more on Golf and Girls. Since both cost money, I took a break from collecting and sold off half of my original set, including my Plank(Big Mistake)during my college years.
Then I received the Copeland Collection catalog in the mail, and got hooked again. I saw a beautiful Cobb with a Uzit back, and another with a Carolina Bright, and thought there can't be many of these around, so that's what I wanted to collect.
Ever since I've been tring to collect as many of the tougher backs as possible.
So you are correct to assume that my collecting was more random than directed. I never thought of finishing a set of Piedmont's or Sweet Caps, but bought every Hindu, Carolina Bright, Lenox, Uzit, and Drum that I could find or afford. I am getting close to finishing a set of the poses available with Brown Hindu's, but it was more by accident than a plan. I've really been trying to complete a set minus the big four using only the toughest backs. Since that isn't possible I thought it might be fun to go for a master set and see what happens.
I'm "fixin"(Southern word) to update my T206 inventory this afternoon, and see where I stand with each back.
I look forward to more of your posts and hope to make it to the National or Fort Washington in the next few years where we could meet. Talk to you soon Brian

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Brian W.

A great story.....Thanks for sharing it with us. And, I admire your "prescience"
in acquiring all those scarce Tobacco brand backs in multiples. I wish I had done
that. I was not as smart....as I was content to acquire one copy of each of the
basic 15 backs to go with my T206 set back in the mid-80's. At least the scarce
backs were certainly more affordable then. Now, I need only a BROADLEAF 460
to complete all the possible back permutations (Factory #s, etc.). Would you
have an extra one that you want to part with ?

You have to plan to attend the next Philly Show (in the Fall) and you can count
on having a room reservation at the "Hotel Zanidakis"....if you wish.

T-Rex Ted

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Posted By: Brian Weisner

Hi Ted,
I don't even own a Broadleaf 460 myself at the moment. I sold the 2 I had a year or so ago when people were paying crazy prices for them. I figured I'd pick one up for less, but it hasn't happened yet. If any hit EBAY in the future I'll chat with you before bidding, so we don't kill each other.

I would love to attend the Philly show in the fall if I can fit it into my schedule, and I appreciate your generous offer for a "HOTEL".


Send me the dates, and I'll check it out. Thanks Brian

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Brian W.

The next 2 Philly Shows are usually held on the last weekend of September and
the first weekend of December. However, until the anticipated new location is
announced, I can not tell you the exact dates. As soon as the new location and
the dates are official, I will inform you.

Ted

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

To all you guys who responded to my Magee (portrait - P150) question in
this Thread......if you have an extra Magee (in Vg/Ex, or better) for sale,
please email me at:

ccooney@princeton.edu

Thanks....T-Rex Ted

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Posted By: Brian Weisner

Hi Ted,
My inventory list showed an extra Magee 150 in my collection, but I looked everywhere an was unable to find it. After hours of Searching, I finally realized that the "extra" Magee 150 on my list was really my MAGIE. Funny, I made the same typo on my list as they did on the card. I am still looking for the other upgrades you requested, but don't believe I have dupes of any of them. Sorry, for the mix up, I should have learned to type in 3rd grade instead of letting the pretty girls do it for me.
Talk to you soon. Brian

PS I noticied a couple of nice ones on EBAY this week.

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Brian W

No problem....guy, I gladly take your extra "Magie" card.

I did some research in my 1905 Spalding BB Guide and I found a MAGIE, who
played for Syracuse (the Pennant winning team of the New York State League).
It was the same year Sherry Magee started in the Majors.

So, perhaps this wasn't just a spelling error; but, a player mix-up ?

Just another T206 mystery that deserves some more insight into.

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Posted By: ScottIngold

Wow interesting tidbit.