T206 American Beauty contest....can you confirm these ?

[Comiskey]

Hi Ted

I just took a look at my American beauty backs to no luck. Sorry I couldn't be of more help!

Jeff

[cfc1909]

Ted

not to hijack but I have 3 BroadLeaf 350s to add to your list

Dineen
Fletcher
Mitchell Cin.

These were confirmed by Art M.- Also there was a mention of different shades of Sovereign backs in Arts book but they were not narrowed down to 350/460 series

[rebelsart]

Hi Ted,
I have the following T206 with American beauty 350 subjects, with frame backs from your list:
Anderson, Providence
Schlafly, Newark

Also, the three recent confirmed Broad Leaf 350 cards were:
Mitchell, Cincinnati
Fletcher, New York Nat'l.
Fiene (throwing), Chicago Amer.

Not Dineen as previously posted.

Art M.

[Jacklitsch]

I can confirm a Schlafly American Beauty though I no longer own the card. Here is a page from my T206 collection of many years ago showing the Schlafly. P.S. The assigned grades were from my own personal grading system.

EDIT: Unfortunately I cannot confirm that is a frame back.

[tedzan]

The greater majority of T206 Subjects (186) in the 350 Series have been confirmed with the American Beauty 350-Frame back (ABF).
There are 28 subjects that have yet to be confirmed. There is a 99 % certainty that 17 of these 28 were not printed with the ABF
back due to trades, retirements, or Minor Lge. reassignment....when the ABF cards were being printed (circa Summer of 1910).





List of the 17 - T206's not expected to be found with ABF

G. Brown (Washington)
Byrne
Collins (Minneapolis)
Cross
Dahlen (portrait--Brooklyn)
Demmitt (New York)
Joe Doyle
Elberfeld (portrait--Washington)
Kleinow (catching--New York)
Lundgren (Kansas City)
Mowery
O'Hara (New York)
Puttman
Rhoades (arm extended)
Rossman
Shannon
F. Smith (Chicago--white cap)


List of T206's that are possibly found with ABF back....please respond if you have any of these ?

1.....
2.....Barger
3.....
4.....Doolan (fielding)
5.....Evans
6.....Fiene (throwing)
7.....Gray
8.....Groom
9.....Krause (pitching)
10....Marshall
11....Mattern
12....McLean
13....
14....Warhop


Thanks for your time and effort in tracking down any of these 11 - T206's with the ABF back. Or, try to prove the experts wrong,
by discovering any one of the above 17 "NO-PRINT" Subjects with an ABF back.

Thanks ART M and RAWN and STEVE M

Anderson, Carrigan and Schlafly has been confirmed with ABF backs. I was expecting several more would have been reported by
now. But, this is a good start. After all......
"Who knows what strange combinations lurk in the permutations of THE MONSTER....only THE MONSTER knows"....

There may be as many as 28 American Beauty 350 frame "NO-PRINTS" in this series.


T-Rex TED

[tedzan]

Your excerpt data from your T206 collection, when extrapolated, results in a very significant collection.

I'm curious, how many T206's did you have ?


Looking forward to seeing you in Cleveland in July.

TED Z

[Jacklitsch]

Originally Posted by tedzan

Your excerpt data from your T206 collection, when extrapolated, results in a very significant collection.

I'm curious, how many T206's did you have ?


Looking forward to seeing you in Cleveland in July.

TED Z

Looks to be approximately 2000.

I'm going to miss you guys in Cleveland this year. Oldest son's marriage plans got in the way.

Will see yall in Baltimore!

[sreader3]

Ted wrote:

I agree with you that Byrne, Mowery, and Rossman are unlikely to be found with ABF backs. However, I find it very interesting that all 3 of these guys are in the 1910 COUPON set. In fact, there are several more T206 Subjects that are in this set that have few T206 backs. How do we explain this occurrence ? ?

Ted,

Is it possible that COUPON was released in late 1909/early 1910, near the time when the early 350-only backs (e.g. Pied/SC/Sov 350) were released?

Scot

[tedzan]

I am getting around to the same conclusion as you have suggested...."1910" COUPON may have been a late 1909 issue.
The dates that keep popping up on some of the Subjects in this set are Aug 1909 and Sept 1909. The following events
are coincident with this period in 1909......

8/09....Byrne traded from St L (NL) to Pitt.

8/09....Charles traded from St L (NL) to Cinci.

8/09....Mowery traded from Cinci. to St L (NL)

8/09....Rhoades' career ends

9/09....Rossman's career ends

The 20 Southern Leaguers in the set are all from the 150 Series.

I'm sure I can come up with more facts that will tend to support the theory that this set was really issued in the latter part
of 1909.


TED Z

[cfc1909]

you had a collection of 2000 t206s in grade 4,5,6 & 7? What year was this? can you please give some details?
I would love to hear about this collection.

[Jacklitsch]

Originally Posted by cfc1909

you had a collection of 2000 t206s in grade 4,5,6 & 7? What year was this? can you please give some details?
I would love to hear about this collection.

Going through the 40 some odd pages that represented my T206 efforts of yore brings back many fond memories. Like the time I traded a 53 Bowman color set to this guy in Virginia for some 700+ T206's to the time I purchased all four Cobbs from Lew, all ex or better, for about $2,500 to buying my St. Louis Demmitt (or was it O'Hara) at a Gloria Rothstein White Plaines show from Barry (though he doesn't remember) in the early 80's.

The heyday of my T206 collecting ran from about 1981 to 1988. I was kind of obsessed. I stored my 1500+ duplicates in those little glassine envelopes that stamp collectors use. I think I learned that from either Lew or Barry.

Don't be confused by the assigned grades. None of my cards were professionally graded and I had my own grading system where a "1" was mint, "2" near mint, etc. My set -4 averaged Ex+

By the late 90's around the time that ebay started my interest had started to wane and I started selling the cards. While I don't think it was a T206 this is my very first feedback on ebay:

"Accurate grading, fast delievery, what more could you want!! sb1 ( 4797) Feb-14-98 16:17"

Thanks Scott!

Well that's the short version. I'm down to about 100 now, all SGC graded.

[tedzan]

Thanks for sharing your T206 story with us.
And, DITTO....to what you said......
"The heyday of my T206 collecting ran from about 1981 to 1988."

That's the same time frame when I started collecting T206's. As you well know, it was a great time to be collecting them.

However, after amassing 1000's of T206's and a near complete 521-card set, it was not enough. I had become obsessed
with them. As is obvious, since I've never stopped collecting them.

Best regards,

TED Z

[tedzan]

The greater majority of T206 Subjects (187) in the 350 Series have been confirmed with the American Beauty 350-Frame back (ABF).
There are 27 subjects that have yet to be confirmed. There is a 99 % certainty that 17 of these 27 were not printed with the ABF
back due to trades, retirements, or Minor Lge. reassignment....when the ABF cards were being printed (circa Summer of 1910).





List of the 17 - T206's not expected to be found with ABF

G. Brown (Washington)
Byrne
Collins (Minneapolis)
Cross
Dahlen (portrait--Brooklyn)
Demmitt (New York)
Joe Doyle
Elberfeld (portrait--Washington)
Kleinow (catching--New York)
Lundgren (Kansas City)
Mowery
O'Hara (New York)
Puttman
Rhoades (arm extended)
Rossman
Shannon
F. Smith (Chicago--white cap)


List of T206's that are possibly found with ABF back....please respond if you have any of these ?

1.....
2.....Barger
3.....
4.....Doolan (fielding)
5.....Evans
6.....Fiene (throwing)
7.....Gray
8.....Groom
9.....Krause (pitching)
10....Marshall
11....Mattern
12....McLean
13....
14....

Thanks to an avid reader of Net54 for confirming Warhop with an ABF back.

And, thanks for your time and effort in tracking down any of these 10 remaining T206's with the ABF back.
Or, try to prove the experts wrong, by discovering any one of the above 17 "NO-PRINT" Subjects with an ABF back.

I was expecting several more by now that would have been reported.....but, this is still a good start. After all........

"Who knows what strange combinations lurk in the permutations of THE MONSTER" ?

....only THE MONSTER's SHADOW knows....

Perhaps, there may be as many as 27 American Beauty 350 frame "NO-PRINTS" in this series ? ?


T-Rex TED

[tedzan]

The greater majority of T206 Subjects (189) in the 350 Series have been confirmed with the American Beauty 350-Frame back (ABF).
There are 25 subjects that have yet to be confirmed. There is a 99 % certainty that 17 of these 25 were not printed with the ABF
back due to trades, retirements, or Minor Lge. reassignment....when the ABF cards were being printed (circa Summer of 1910).





List of the 17 - T206's not expected to be found with ABF

G. Brown (Washington)
Byrne
Collins (Minneapolis)
Cross
Dahlen (portrait--Brooklyn)
Demmitt (New York)
Joe Doyle
Elberfeld (portrait--Washington)
Kleinow (catching--New York)
Lundgren (Kansas City)
Mowery
O'Hara (New York)
Puttman
Rhoades (arm extended)
Rossman
Shannon
F. Smith (Chicago--white cap)


List of T206's that are possibly found with ABF back....please respond if you have any of these ?

1.....
2.....Barger
3.....
4.....Doolan (fielding)
5.....Evans
6.....Fiene (throwing)
7.....Gray
8.....Groom
9.....
10....
11....Mattern
12....McLean
13....
14....

Doc Marshall and Krause (pitching) have been the most recent confirmed T206's with the ABF back.

Thanks to every one for your time and effort in tracking down any of these 8 remaining T206's with the ABF back.
Or, try to prove the experts wrong....by finding any one of the above 17 "NO-PRINT" Subjects with an ABF back.

It's a slow process; but, we are making progress, chipping away at the "unknowns". Can we find a few more ? ?
After all........
"Who knows what strange combinations lurk in the permutations of THE MONSTER" ?

....only THE MONSTER's SHADOW knows....

And perhaps, there may just be as many as 25 American Beauty 350 frame "NO-PRINTS" in this series ?


T-Rex TED