I was thinking. and its baffling.

[drc]

What comes to mind is the episode of King of Queens where the retired dad, Arther Spooner (played by Jerry Stiller), was taking a class to become a notary public. The problem was he was easily distracted by surrounding stimuli (sound of a distant dog barking) and was unable to keep his visual attention on a document being signed two feet in front of him. He finally quit, proclaiming that being a notary public is a "young man's game."

[GrayGhost]

REA, thanks for that blog posting. I kind of figured that was the way it has to be looked at in the overall marketplace, and by major auction houses such as yourself. It seems to just boil down to consumer confidence.

I thank everyone who has replied, as I find this a very interesting area. Due to various reasons, I don't collect much, but love the hobby and such, and always keep up with things too. I enjoy the fact that people care enough about the hobby, as I still call it, and boards like this exist. Again, thanks everyone.

Scott.

[GrayGhost]

An interesting case in point is this item currently on ebay, w NO bids, that is "PSA authenticated"? Now, Im far far from knowledgable, but this autograph looks terrible, even if hurried, or am I wrong?

http://cgi.ebay.com/BABE-RUTH-CUT-SI...lenotsupported

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

It may look strikingly different, but it's perfectly legitimate. Just a rushed version.

[GrayGhost]

Thanks for the education.

[Leon]

Thanks to Rob L, from REA, for the nice summarization on autographs and authenticity. kind regards

[wrapperguy]

I sometimes write out over 100 checks in one sitting to my officiating staff. My signature changes dramatically from #1 to #100 as my hand gets tired, time becomes an issue, distractions (a Cub victory), etc. It drastically changes from the first check in the pad (with a backing of 29 other checks) to the last check in pad that has relatively no backing. It seems difficult at the very least to think that anyone can say if a signature is real without witnessing it.

[David Atkatz]

Originally Posted by wrapperguy

I sometimes write out over 100 checks in one sitting to my officiating staff. My signature changes dramatically from #1 to #100 as my hand gets tired, time becomes an issue, distractions (a Cub victory), etc. It drastically changes from the first check in the pad (with a backing of 29 other checks) to the last check in pad that has relatively no backing. It seems difficult at the very least to think that anyone can say if a signature is real without witnessing it.

Although the overall signature may not look the same, there are consistent characteristics that never vary.

It always amuses me that you card guys constantly harp on the "impossibility" of determining an autograph's authenticity, as if the problem exists there and there only.

Every valuable collectible is forged or counterfeited. The skill and resources brought to bear are in direct proportion to the collectible's value.

If you really believe that no extremely high-end card has been successfully counterfeited, you're living in a dreamworld.

[T206Collector]

1. Provenance is so important -- whether it is a signature on a check or you know the guy who got the signature himself, knowing the history of the signature and how and where it was acquired always improves the value of the autograph. Which brings me to my second point:

2. Value -- the market takes provenance (or the lack thereof) and applies a price to it. A ball signed by Ruth with a video of the ball being signed by Ruth is obviously worth more than the same ball without the video. When you buy an autograph in the market, you are paying a price that factors in known provenance. The better the provenance, the higher the value. Take any price I paid for any of my signed T206 cards -- I would have paid more for them if they had a video accompanying them showing the same card being signed by the player.

I don't think it is much a leap of faith if you are buying and selling in the same universe of accepted authenticators. The game changes if PSA/DNA goes out of business as a result of a massive, public fraud. But the same could be said of PSA and the super minty cards that SGC won't cross over. In that sense, I think of autograph collecting and authenticating a lot like I think about super high grade pre-war collecting -- there is always an element of faith/opinion. And as long as the opinions are generally respected by the collectors in that market, then there is no concern over a super drop or loss of value based on that opinion. But one ought to have more than one base covered -- more than one authenticator/grader -- in the event one has a high dollar item that would be worth sh*t if that particular autheticator/grader went AWOL.

A bit rambling, but there you have it....