Has anyone here tackled the 1952 Topps set?

ALR-bishop · #1 09-12-2009, 10:11 AM

I collect this set. I have the basic set of 407, plus 1-80 in both red and black back, plus the two black back versions of Sain and Page ( 3 variations in all). Also have the two variation of Mantle, Robinson and Thompson ( stiches on the back, and in the case of Mantle front differences as well) and the 3 variations of Campos ( regular, black star, and missing border).

I gave some thought to trying to do the grey back variations ( Canadians), but gave up in despair. Also have an unopened pack. It has always amazed me how many vitual unkowns are in the set, I assume as a result of the Topps/Bowman contract battles

Doug · #2 09-12-2009, 02:55 PM

Do you have a scan of the Campos with the missing border? I've never seen one.

toppcat · #3 09-12-2009, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug

Do you have a scan of the Campos with the missing border? I've never seen one.

I wasn't aware of the Campos lacking border-it it a print freak or a true variation? Also not aware of a 2nd star variation. Others not mentioned here that I have seen talked or written about (I don't own any) are shown below. Please confirm these as they are from various written sources, not scans.

42 Ketrow (BB) red or peach background.
43 Scarborough (BB) red or peach background
55 Boone (BB) Light Green or Dark Green background
55 Boone (RB) Light Green or Dark Green background
60 Wehmeier (BB) Yellow/Red or Orange/Red background
88 Feller Hazy or Clear background (this one I have seen)

What is in the PSA Super Set of 545 that brings the count so high?

Doug · #4 09-12-2009, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toppcat

What is in the PSA Super Set of 545 that brings the count so high?

Here's a checklist stating that it's a work in progress as new variations are graded: http://www.psacard.com/SetRegistry/S...on.aspx?c=6796

ALR-bishop · #5 09-12-2009, 07:56 PM

Dave...Is not the 545 figure inflated by the Canadians being added to the Registry master set ?

You know me and scans, Dave ( bishop). I can send you a color copy of the 3d Campos and you can post it. It is a print defect as opposed to a true variation, which I equate with an intentional change, like the 59 Spahn or option/trade changes ( but in my view the Herrer and Bakep are just print defects too, and maybe the Campos black star , although Levi disagrees with me on that). I have seen more than one of the Campos missing border cards on ebay, so it is not unique

I think I can send you color copies of some of the other front variations you asked about within the 1 to 80 group too if you want to see them.

Doug · #6 09-13-2009, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toppcat

I wasn't aware of the Campos lacking border-it it a print freak or a true variation? Also not aware of a 2nd star variation. Others not mentioned here that I have seen talked or written about (I don't own any) are shown below. Please confirm these as they are from various written sources, not scans.

42 Ketrow (BB) red or peach background.
43 Scarborough (BB) red or peach background
55 Boone (BB) Light Green or Dark Green background
55 Boone (RB) Light Green or Dark Green background
60 Wehmeier (BB) Yellow/Red or Orange/Red background
88 Feller Hazy or Clear background (this one I have seen)

What is in the PSA Super Set of 545 that brings the count so high?

The PSA list doesn't even have the six cards listed above or the Mantle, Robinson, and Thomson double prints with the stitching reversed so adding them would bring the total to 554. They also don't list the "Herrer", "Bakep", or Campos (missing border) variations/printing errors that have been mentioned in the last post which would now give us 557 and counting?

Also did anyone figure out what the other possible "black star" card is?

ALR-bishop · #7 09-13-2009, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug

The PSA list doesn't even have the six cards listed above or the Mantle, Robinson, and Thomson double prints with the stitching reversed so adding them would bring the total to 554. They also don't list the "Herrer", "Bakep", or Campos (missing border) variations/printing errors that have been mentioned in the last post which would now give us 557 and counting?

Also did anyone figure out what the other possible "black star" card is?

Sorry...the Herrer is 58 and Bakep is 57. They were just examples of printing defects treated like a variation. I do have the extra Campos, but it is clearly a print defect, although not an isolated one since I have seen it 3 times now. Not sure about the Mantle, Thompson and Robinson-- print defect or variation ?---and why is the stiching on the ball on the back reversed on those 3 ? There are actually noticeable and documented front differences on the 2 different Mantles, which I have, but I would guess they will never add a second Mantle to the Master set list given the cost involved, and, if not, the Thompson and Robinson will not likely be added either.

toppcat · #8 09-13-2009, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ALR

There are actually noticeable and documented front differences on the 2 different Mantles, which I have, but I would guess they will never add a second Mmantle to the Master set list given the cost involved, and if not, the Thompson and Robinson will not likely be added either.

I wonder if that is why the Super Set designation was given. I'm not a registry guy so that's just a WAG as I don't recall that type of designation before. As for the 545 in that set, I am not really sure Al-there doesn't seem to be master # for each and my take on the 500 card Master set is that it doesn't not have the gray backs, but then the 545 figure seems too low a there a 60 gray backs.

Too bad Dick Gilkeson isn't here!

Doug · #9 09-13-2009, 01:51 PM

I'm not a registry guy either so I don't get all of this master set/super set stuff. I would just call cards 1-407 the set and leave it at that. All of these variations/print errors would just be just that IMO as opposed to being part of some kind of invented "super set".

ALR-bishop · #10 09-13-2009, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toppcat

I wasn't aware of the Campos lacking border-it it a print freak or a true variation? Also not aware of a 2nd star variation. Others not mentioned here that I have seen talked or written about (I don't own any) are shown below. Please confirm these as they are from various written sources, not scans.

42 Ketrow (BB) red or peach background.
43 Scarborough (BB) red or peach background
55 Boone (BB) Light Green or Dark Green background
55 Boone (RB) Light Green or Dark Green background
60 Wehmeier (BB) Yellow/Red or Orange/Red background
88 Feller Hazy or Clear background (this one I have seen)

What is in the PSA Super Set of 545 that brings the count so high?

David---I have these except the Scarborough

ncinin · #11 09-13-2009, 10:05 PM

I noticed this card in a collection I picked up awhile back. You can see that part of the top/left border is missing. I kept it in case it became a desirable variation at some point in the future.

Doug · #12 09-13-2009, 11:11 PM

Thanks for posting that scan, I had never seen one before. How does it relate to the black star variation in terms of rarity and value?

ALR-bishop · #13 09-14-2009, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug

Thanks for posting that scan, I had never seen one before. How does it relate to the black star variation in terms of rarity and value?

That is what I have. When I got mine on ebay I think I paid over $ 100 for the card, which was in slightly better condition than the one in the scan . The seller listed it as a variation and there were other bidders but the fact it is not listed like the black star makes it less marketable. Because it is a front variation it is easier to spot if it shows up on ebay by accident, but I think it is pretty rare from my experience.

If you do an ebay search now for a 1959 Topps Ramos, you will find a print defect unlisted variation offered for $ 2500 ( it is a PSA 9 ). That card has sold in Ex + conditon for .99 cents recently. If it ever get listed, the value would go up I think . Same with the border defect Campos, but in the case of the Campos I think the value could be significant because of the value taken on by the black star already

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