I'm almost POSITIVE this card features Shoeless Joe...

[CW]

Originally Posted by Matt

A closer parallel would be the "A Great Batsman" card which has Lajoie in the center, but not on the sides. According to the SCD that one carries no premium over a common even though Lajoie is IDed by name on the back.

Originally Posted by Matt

Brett - your off base here - the standard convention for cataloging T202s is based on the end panels and the title of the center panel. Consider the Lajoie I posted about above. He is even mentioned in the text on the back, but that card is not cataloged as Lajoie (cataloged, as are all T202s, by the title, this one is "A Great Batsman"), and is not part of any "Lajoie master set." It's just a T202 that has Lajoie in the center panel with another player; same here. In fact that one has much better credentials then this one for what you are suggesting - the back uses his name and the text on the back focuses on the batter (as opposed to the one in question which focuses on the 3B).

To suggest this card "features" Joe Jax assumes the manufactures intended him to be the centerpiece. Bob's verbiage is much more apt - he is a cameo on this card - the printers of this card wouldn't have cared if Joe Jax or any other player was being thrown out at 3rd.

This has been a fascinating thread, and it has been interesting to watch
it unfold, from Brett's initial discovery, to Greg's excellent detective work
in locating the comparison image, to the overall acceptance by the skeptics
here that it is indeed Shoeless Joe (count me as one initially).

I believe Matt's posts, two of which I quoted above, make some excellent
points as well. I feel that even if the hobby accepts Joe's inclusion on
the center panel as fact (which I believe will eventually happen), you will
not see a big increase in the value of this card. Sure, initially we will see
a spike in ending prices, but overall I don't really think anyone will be getting
rich off the new info about this card and its center panel. The card is starting
off as relatively inexpensive, limiting its "upside" for investors.

As others have said, though, I guess time will tell....

[old-baseball]

[obcmac]

Yeah Kevin...I asked the same question in a different thread. It seems like everybody is tired of talking about it. But I thought that one looked similar...and it has the sock too. I think there should be an honest effort to identify every player pictured in all center panels...not just say that one in Joe Jax, then tire of the conversation.

Mac

[brett]

HOLY CRAP I think you're right!!!! I initially overlooked this one and now that I just went back and looked at this card closer, it definitely appears to be the same player (Shoeless Joe) who's on the "Lord Catches His Man" card with identical facial features, expression, and the tell-tale white wrap on his right ankle only. Now that I just went through all 76 center panel photos in this set with a magnifying glass, these are the only 2 that I believe are Joe Jackson (with the other one already being proven). There are about a dozen or so Cleveland players total on the center panels and most of them can be dismissed because they either mention the specific player's name on the back, are pre-1911 photos in old uniforms from before Shoeless Joe got to Cleveland, or you get a good look at the player's face and can tell that it's clearly NOT Shoeless Joe, or you CAN'T see the player's face whatsoever to get any type of positive ID. You are correct my friend, it looks like you've found the second and last card in the set that can be identified as featuring a young Shoeless Joe Jackson!

[barrysloate]

Does this mean another 500 posts?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Greg, are you undertaking the research again?

[botn]

Well I would hate to annoy Barry and Ted so I will pass the torch.

[Rob D.]

Originally Posted by botn

Well I would hate to annoy Barry and Ted so I will pass the torch.

Just make a post in the "other" Joe Jackson thread and all will be well.

[brett]

Originally Posted by botn

Well I would hate to annoy Barry and Ted so I will pass the torch.

No way buddy... If you try to get out I'm pulling you right back in! I couldn't have done this without you on the first one, and now we need you more than ever.

[brett]

Originally Posted by CW

This has been a fascinating thread, and it has been interesting to watch
it unfold, from Brett's initial discovery, to Greg's excellent detective work
in locating the comparison image, to the overall acceptance by the skeptics
here that it is indeed Shoeless Joe (count me as one initially).

I believe Matt's posts, two of which I quoted above, make some excellent
points as well. I feel that even if the hobby accepts Joe's inclusion on
the center panel as fact (which I believe will eventually happen), you will
not see a big increase in the value of this card. Sure, initially we will see
a spike in ending prices, but overall I don't really think anyone will be getting
rich off the new info about this card and its center panel. The card is starting
off as relatively inexpensive, limiting its "upside" for investors.

As others have said, though, I guess time will tell....

I agree with pretty much everything you said and the collectors will decide what it's worth. Some may feel this card is nothing special, while others believe it's the greatest discovery since sliced bread. Personaly I think it's somewhere in between. While it would be better if he had a side-panel card in this set or a T205 or T206, he doesn't, and so this is all we have of Shoeless Joe in the way of a T card (not to mention the scarcity and ridiculously high prices of his other cards) making me believe that this card will DEFINITELY go up in value and become much more desireable than the common it has been for the last 100 years.

[barrysloate]

If the center panel read "Jackson Out at Third" we would be talking about a very valuable baseball card.

[Sterling Sports Auctions]

Sounds like a photoshop job for Wonka.

[brett]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

If the center panel read "Jackson Out at Third" we would be talking about a very valuable baseball card.

True Barry, but if it said "Jackson Out at Third" we never would have had all this fun!

[brett]

Being as a lot of people were wondering what this discovery would do for the value of the card, the PSA 4 "Lord Carches His Man" card that I put on Ebay last week just sold for $450. I believe that once it becomes commonly known to everybody that this and the "Schaefer on First" card feature Shoeless Joe they'll permanently sell for around $500-$1,000 in EX condition.

[Ladder7]

$450, you done well!

[botn]

It will be interesting to see what this card does over time. PSA 4 commons are normally $80 cards so that is a huge premium, Brett. Not quite a Cobb premium but pretty close.

[brett]

Originally Posted by Ladder7

$450, you done well!

Thanks man. That's why I didn't want to sell it to you or anybody else beforehand because I didn't want to rip anybody off or short-change myself. By the way, I can't believe that my first ever post here ended up being the only one to go over 20,000 views.