My two cents: When a team moves, thats it.

D. Bergin · #1 10-29-2010, 04:31 PM

I learned something new doing some Football research a few weeks ago regarding franchise histories.

The Baltimore Colts originated in the old AAFC (All-American Football Conference) in the late 1940's, led by a young QB named Y.A. Tittle. In 1950 several of the AAFC teams were absorbed by the NFL, including the Colts.

The Colts folded at the end of it's first season in the NFL. The team was disbanded, Y.A. Tittle went and played for the 49'ers.

A few years later a completely new Baltimore Colts franchise was born in the NFL.

I think my biggest shock was discovering about how little I had known about the AAFC, which played just as big a part in the formation of the present NFL, as the AFL would, a couple decades later.

PowderedH2O · #2 10-29-2010, 04:55 PM

Actually, the Twins DO recognize the old Senators. If you look at the Minnesota Twins website and look at the all-time leaders you will see that they list Sam Rice as the all-time hits leader and Walter Johnson as the all-time wins leader, even though neither of these gentlemen ever played a game in Minneapolis. I know a number of Baltimore Colts fans that are just sick when they see Johnny Unitas' number retired in Lucas Oil Field in Indianapolis, a city in which he never played.

triwak · #3 10-29-2010, 05:18 PM

Great topic, M's fan! (Even though you were confused about the Senators' two DIFFERENT franchises). I am a Cardinals fan and have never had this question answered to my satisfaction: Why do the St. Louis Cardinals trace their origins back to ONLY 1892 - the year they joined the NL? I am almost certain, that this was the same franchise that played for 10 years in the American Association during the 1880's, and in fact won 4 straight pennants, under player/mananger Charlie Comiskey. So what if the team changed leagues? Do the current Milwaukee Brewers ignore all their years spent in the AL? Surely not. The 4 additional pennants is significant. The Cardinals could (and should) rightfully claim 21 instead of 17. Actually, I've read one source that says the original St. Louis team that joined the NL in 1876, is in fact the same franchise that later joined the AA, but was forced to leave the NL after the 1877 season, for financial reasons. They barnstormed for a few years before joining the AA. I've always wondered how other teams that played in the AA, handle their histories if they later joined the NL?

bmarlowe1 · #4 10-29-2010, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by triwak

Great topic, M's fan! (Even though you were confused about the Senators' two DIFFERENT franchises). I am a Cardinals fan and have never had this question answered to my satisfaction: Why do the St. Louis Cardinals trace their origins back to ONLY 1892 - the year they joined the NL? I am almost certain, that this was the same franchise that played for 10 years in the American Association during the 1880's, and in fact won 4 straight pennants, under player/mananger Charlie Comiskey. So what if the team changed leagues? Do the current Milwaukee Brewers ignore all their years spent in the AL? Surely not. The 4 additional pennants is significant. The Cardinals could (and should) rightfully claim 21 instead of 17. Actually, I've read one source that says the original St. Louis team that joined the NL in 1876, is in fact the same franchise that later joined the AA, but was forced to leave the NL after the 1877 season, for financial reasons. They barnstormed for a few years before joining the AA. I've always wondered how other teams that played in the AA, handle their histories if they later joined the NL?

Not only pennants, but they could include the 1886 World's Series win. One issue, though, is what happened when the club changed owners and nearly all their players in 1899 (mentioned above).

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