Veterans Committee 12 finalists

[Griffins]

I find it a travesty that Marvin Miller isn't in yet.
Steinbrenner has no place in the Hall, which means he'll probably be elected.

[prewarsports]

I am sure Steinbrenner and Miller will get in, but when I finally make it back there for a visit and see Steinbrenners plaque, I will point to it and tell my son about what is WRONG with baseball.

[ramram]

Tommy John's gotta get in. Thanks to a surgeon, and maybe a deal with the devil, his name is more famous than all the other guys put together.

Rob M.

[bobbvc]

Miller should be in already and every modern player should have a Buddha style statue of Marv, and rub his belly every time he cashes his paycheck. If any of the others make it, have a hall of really good players and then open a Hall of Fame with 50 players. And to get in, someone else must come out.

[D. Bergin]

I still don't quite get the exclusion attitude.

A good number of the guys on this list are better then many players already in the HOF. Players that have been in the HOF for decades.

It's not like this would be a sudden watering down. It's seems a lot of people want to impose their own strict criteria to an establishment that never held to that criteria to begin with.

Pretty ridiculous calling ballplayers who were Top 5 in their League at their position for the better part of a decade or more as "Just Better Then Average" or "Very Good".

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

I still don't quite get the exclusion attitude.

A good number of the guys on this list are better then many players already in the HOF. Players that have been in the HOF for decades.

It's not like this would be a sudden watering down. It's seems a lot of people want to impose their own strict criteria to an establishment that never held to that criteria to begin with.

Pretty ridiculous calling ballplayers who were Top 5 in their League at their position for the better part of a decade or more as "Just Better Then Average" or "Very Good".

See, now I don't get that idea. To me it is a logical fallacy--the equivalent of telling the traffic cop you should be allowed to speed because everyone else was speeding too. The Veterans' Committee made some highly political, piss poor selections over the years and enshrined some players who were probably not really worthy of the honor. I don't see the logic of making more crappy choices because the VC made crappy choices before. Heck, at this point I would abolish the VC entirely. The idea of the VC was to clear the players from 75 years of baseball history when the HOF started. It's been long enough to clear the backlog of worthy players. All of the guys on this VC list as players had their chances in the regular eligibility votes.

[sayhey24]

Good arguments on both sides.
You can't put every player who's better than Rick Ferrell or Dave Bancroft in the Hall, but you absolutely should give strong consideration to players who are as good or better than a number of other HOFers at their position, and to players who dominated their league at their position for a decade or more.
I grew up watching baseball in the 60s and 70s -- Ron Santo was THE NL third baseman of the era (no offense to the Boyers), just as Brooks was in the AL. Brooks was a little better, but Santo absolutely should be in the Hall (and hopefully will be when they consider his era in the new balloting).
I agree with the previous poster about Garvey being a dominant player during his era -- it's hard to ignore that. Al Oliver on the other hand, had some nice numbers, but was never on the same level as Garvey.
Ted Simmons has hitting stats as a catcher that compare favorably with most other HOF catchers -- if he made it, it certainly wouldn't be watering down the Hall.
Much of this come downs to what each of us believes the HOF should be -- some think it's only for Ruth, Wagner, Hornsby, Dimaggio, Mays, etc. But it's clearly not that. My very unscientific view has always been that if a player was the dominant force at his position in his league for 10-15 years, racking up batting titles, MVPs, All-Star nods and Gold Gloves, he is most likely a Hall of Famer (Gil Hodges, Tony Oliva, Santo, Dale Murphy).

One thing is absolutely certain -- this sure is fun to talk about.

Greg
http://www.baseballbasement.com

[Griffins]

Any opinions on whether Steinbrenners felony convictions should factor into his selection?

[thekingofclout]

Originally Posted by Griffins

I find it a travesty that Marvin Miller isn't in yet.
Steinbrenner has no place in the Hall, which means he'll probably be elected.

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