What is the long-term value of Game-Used cards?

[Rich Klein]

Like I said; I'm literally on both sides of the aisle here ---- more than most of you realize and frankly I'm more aware of the modern card market than I am of the vintage card market many times


A few longer bullet-points: I've posted most of these thoughts one way or the other in the past.

** In 2002, I gave a presentation at the first "Deadball" conference in Hot Springs, Ark. Mike D was not yet part of the group otherwise he would have been part of the "spirited" discussion. We were all expected to bring research topics to the table -- and with my lack of time to prepare -- I went a slightly different way and began a conversation about deadball era BB Cards and why did 1910 seem to be the key year.
During that discussion, I brought up the concept of game-used cards and you have to remember that was the concept of vintage players and game-used was still a reasonably new concept. It was also a good target audience in that none of the other six people there were really active collectors -- except for me having to chase down a Dave Egan card. (You had to be there to understand why).
We basically agreed, that if a player had used hundreds of bats during his career; that cutting up 1-2 of them for cards was not neccessarily a bad idea BUT if you had a situation such as In the Game cutting up the only known pair of Georges Vezina pads then you had a terrrible disservice to history. The middle is broad; but at the time, most of the card companies actually tried to keep track and if they knew it was the only one, they usually passed on cutting.

***** In today's world, collectors expect to get at least one "hit" (which in these terms mean autographs or memorabilia) out of every box. In some products the cards are of vintage players and thus the memorabilia is the same. ****

**** So far, and I would suspect in the future -- autograph cards have and will continue to hold their value better than game-used cards. As always there are exceptions, one of which is the 2001 SP Legendary Cuts Joe Jackson bat card. There will be no more Joe Jackson "game-used' bat cards issued by a licensed manufacturer unless he gets reinstated. Other non-licensced companies can used Shoeless Joe.

***** Sometimes, as has been pointed out, these cards *DO* generate interest in vintage cards and cards and more of these players can be the gateway to vintage cards. The same has been true of the Topps "Million Card Giveaway" which has spurred several people *I* have "spoken to on FB* to start collecting older cards. I know of one collector who now buys 5-10 small lots of pre-1970 cards on EBay each week and I'll bet he goes back into our cards soon


***** And if we want future collectors to have the same love for these old cards that we do, let's not diss them at this point. Just because *I* was able to buy my 1st T-Cards in the mid-1970's for $1-2 each including HOFers -- does not mean the same runs true today -- we have to nurture and realize that today's box dealer may be tomorrow's vintage specialist

**** And I love to point out this story, in my last year at Beckett we had a minor issue with the Almanac in which the 1993 Topps set checklist was missing about 200 cards due to a production error. You know, I swear we had several hundred complaints about that during the year --- and the Almanac was just as much for advanced collectors as basic collectors but if I forgot to put in a Pinkerton checklist, I'd bet I'd get 1-2 complaints during the year.

***** We have to remember, that we are an influential group, but a very small part of the hobby in many many ways

Happy holidays to all

Rich Klein

Regards and happy holidays

Rich

[bbcard1]

Also when there is a crappy local mall show, it gives you something to look at.

[mark evans]

I agree with those who opine that game-used items are not likely to increase in value over time, with the possible exception of scarce vintage items (Cobb signature, Jackson bat). It seems to me that the more GU cards of Jeter and LeBron are produced, the less the value of each one. To cite a 'recent' example, I would be stunned if the high-value LeBron 1/1 rookie that received such public attention would bring anywhere near its original value 10 years down the road.

[hunterdutchess]

I wonder what is next? They are gonna run out of these vintage items some day. I think (and this makes me sick) that they are actually going to take a authentic t206 Wagner or some other rare card and cut it up into little squares and them place them into new product. Just wait and see.

[cdn_collector]

Originally Posted by hunterdutchess

I think (and this makes me sick) that they are actually going to take a authentic t206 Wagner or some other rare card and cut it up into little squares and them place them into new product. Just wait and see.

Imagine that, eh? A series of modern cards that contain T206s. You could own a 'complete' T206 set without even owning a 'complete' T206. Of course, distinguishing between a 'Magie' and a 'Magee' could be tough

I guess when it's all said and done, it's really just a numbers game, though, right? How much does artifact X cost and how much market buzz and product sales can artifact X generate.

Regards,

Richard.

[Al C.risafulli]

This is a prewar board, so it doesn't surprise me to feel a little anti-shiny bias here (and it definitely is here). I detested the relic and bat cards too, until something happened. My son (8 at the time) opened a pack of cards that had a Bobby Thompson bat card in it.

I explained to him who Bobby Thompson was, and his eyes got wide, and he said "and this is his BAT?" He actually gasped.

I thought that was awesome. He has a couple of other game-used cards now, and he collects - both shiny cards and older ones. I gave him his first T206 a few months ago. He loves the hobby. And he loves those game-used cards.

I love this hobby and I love that there are a bunch of grown men and women that I call my friends and share the hobby with - but at the end of the day, this is a kids' hobby, and if carving up some bats will help kids discover the history of the sport - then I'm all for it.

-Al

[thekingofclout]

Originally Posted by Al C.risafulli

This is a prewar board, so it doesn't surprise me to feel a little anti-shiny bias here (and it definitely is here). I detested the relic and bat cards too, until something happened. My son (8 at the time) opened a pack of cards that had a Bobby Thompson bat card in it.

I explained to him who Bobby Thompson was, and his eyes got wide, and he said "and this is his BAT?" He actually gasped.

I thought that was awesome. He has a couple of other game-used cards now, and he collects - both shiny cards and older ones. I gave him his first T206 a few months ago. He loves the hobby. And he loves those game-used cards.

I love this hobby and I love that there are a bunch of grown men and women that I call my friends and share the hobby with - but at the end of the day, this is a kids' hobby, and if carving up some bats will help kids discover the history of the sport - then I'm all for it.

-Al

I completely agree with Al. Also, a lot of people that collect the game-used cards, eventually start to gravitate towards true vintage memorabilia. How can that be bad?

And one more thing, Cooperstown has more memorabilia than they will ever display, so as bad as cutting up these pieces may sound, it's not going to have an negative impact on any of our collections, present or future.