Which pre-war stars could play today?

[DanP]

I had a feeling I would be in the minority, but I didn't think I'd be the only one who felt the old-timers couldn't compete in today's game!

I have an open mind here .. So let me ask these questions:
Why is baseball the only sport where guys from 100 years ago could compete today? All Olympic Sports: No way, Football: No way, Basketball: No way, etc. etc. but Baseball, yes??

Let's say Walter Johnson did throw around 100mph. I don't know of any star pitchers with just a fastball. Why would it be different for him? Yes, he could develop another pitch, but that wasn't the question. We would be taking him from 1910 with what he had then and insert him into the 2011 season.

The old-timers didn't grow up playing organized baseball from the 6 years old. They didn't play 100 games in a single little league season (or even play little league), they didn't play year round in high school and college, they were much smaller and weaker than today's players, they didn't face competition from all over the world, there wasn't anywhere near the financial incentive there is today to become a great player, the hitters didn't have to face relief specialists starting from the 6th inning, the hitters never saw a slider, etc. etc.

I believe some of the pitchers could have done OK, and of course some could have been stars (Feller, Ruth, Grove, Hubbell, etc.) but not many of the hitters.

I believe Babe Ruth probably could have been a great pitcher, but I still believe he would have batted .250 in today's game.

I'm trying to rationalize what I'm missing here!

Dan

[Touch'EmAll]

Tim Lincecum has top form and mechanics - thats how he pitches so well. The form and mechanics enable him to acheive maximum effectiveness for his given body. It would be scary to see Tim Lincecum, same awesome proportional mechanics, but with a bigger body.

When i swim, I swim fast because I have great technique. I am definitely not the most buff guy on the starting blocks. If the really buff guys had the same technique and flexibility as I, then they would record setters.

So the question is: Did Walter Johnson, or other, have form and mechanics comparable to todays pitchers? If so, he would probably do well.

[ElCabron]

Walter Johnson had arms that were like 40 feet long. He'd throw gas in any era. The only thing you're really proving with your arguments is that you're a kick-ass swimmer.

The only real differences would be that Wagner would hit like 40+ homers a year today and Cobb would only see pitches on the outside corner or off the plate since he would never be able to reach them with that goofy grip.

-Ryan

[rhettyeakley]

It's a fallacy to think that we as humans are constantly getting better at everything. All the examples you show are where bigger bodies, strength and new training techniques have completely altered the form of the competition. Baseball has changed to some degree but not to the point that basketball, football, hockey, etc. have changed.

Do you honestly think people 100 years ago were worse at chess, pool/billiards, rifle shooting, etc.? I'd argue that pitching is more similar to these types of activities than trying to compare the game of basketball in 1910 to today's game--they aren't even the same game.

[Mark]

Originally Posted by DanP

The old-timers didn't grow up playing organized baseball from the 6 years old. They didn't play 100 games in a single little league season (or even play little league), they didn't play year round in high school and college, they were much smaller and weaker than today's players, they didn't face competition from all over the world, there wasn't anywhere near the financial incentive there is today to become a great player, the hitters didn't have to face relief specialists starting from the 6th inning, the hitters never saw a slider, etc. etc.
Dan

In fact, back then, kids who played sports played almost nothing BUT baseball spring, summer, and fall. Every small town had its own semi pro or pro team, and many factories and clubs played baseball, too. As for their size and strength, it is a factor in athletics. but not the only factor in the game of baseball. The great players were both great physical specimens (e.g. Wagner and Ruth) and highly skilled baseball players. As for relief pitching, it's a solid point in your favor. Many starters burned out their arms trying to go hard the whole game. But as for the slider, it is more than made up for by the spitball, the emery ball, and the simple fact that they used the same ball for entire games. The old, game used ball is a dirty, rough item.