VCP rant

Exhibitman · #1 10-27-2011, 11:25 AM

I don't know the specifics of your deal but I did a one-day VCP signup recently and I was surprised at how few cards had transacted in the last 2-3 years according to it. I found listing after listing for T, E and W cards that showed no sales for years, in any grade. Seemed inaccurate to me.

Slightly off topic but how do you capture a screen shot like those?

byrone · #2 10-27-2011, 11:31 AM

For easier tracking of Ebay purchases, all you need to do is click "Purchase History", then click "Archive" , and you can bring up all of your purchases for all of 2009, 2010 and the current year.

Comes in handy.

wonkaticket · #3 10-27-2011, 11:37 AM

Use the print screen key on your keyboard, then paste into a photo program or Word etc. Adam.

John

3-2-count · #4 10-27-2011, 11:46 AM

FYI, I cancelled VCP a few weeks ago after being a member for years.
It's just not cost effective anymore for the information you receive imo.

rhettyeakley · #5 10-27-2011, 12:11 PM

I will never understand why BIN's or Best Offers that are accepted are not included. When did the Market price become synonomous with "at auction" only. If you go buy something at Wal-mart for a set price is that not what that item is currently selling for? IMO every transacted card should be included or you are only getting part of the picture. Don't give me that it is easier to manipuate because you can shill an auction just as easy. I have never been a member of VCP and probably never will for the reason stated above.

sycks22 · #6 10-27-2011, 12:19 PM

There are a good amount of auction houses that are not currently updated in VCP: Goodwin, CSA, Baggers, Heritage and more. Going to all the sites that have an area where you can find previous records is almost more useful. I still subscribe to VCP to save some time on the more commonly sold cards (Mantle's, etc) as stated above by someone.

terjung · #7 10-27-2011, 12:26 PM

VCP has been giving diminishing returns to me and I too cancelled my membership after being a firm believer for years. The lack of BIN data, the loss of some auction house data, and the increase in price all contributed to my decision.

In the past, VCP provided a great service to me, but it is no longer is a "must have" for me for a variety of reasons.

kcohen · #8 10-27-2011, 12:37 PM

Someone once told me, and I cannot verify that this in fact the case, that VCP must somehow acquire the rights to mine data and only has the right to certain data. If such is the case, the fact that certain sales are not included is not because they willingly and consciencely exclude them.

Has anyone else ever heard this (other than from me)?

steve B · #9 10-27-2011, 12:31 PM

But you can't shill an auction to a lower price. And that's the bit of price manipulation that would really hurt if all BINs were included. 4-5 fake sales over a couple months to drive the average down, negotiate a couple purchases based on the lower average. Then shill or generate a few more fake sales to raise the average and sell above average since "it's taking off".

Steve B

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhettyeakley

I will never understand why BIN's or Best Offers that are accepted are not included. When did the Market price become synonomous with "at auction" only. If you go buy something at Wal-mart for a set price is that not what that item is currently selling for? IMO every transacted card should be included or you are only getting part of the picture. Don't give me that it is easier to manipuate because you can shill an auction just as easy. I have never been a member of VCP and probably never will for the reason stated above.

ls7plus · #10 10-29-2011, 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhettyeakley

I will never understand why BIN's or Best Offers that are accepted are not included. When did the Market price become synonomous with "at auction" only. If you go buy something at Wal-mart for a set price is that not what that item is currently selling for? IMO every transacted card should be included or you are only getting part of the picture. Don't give me that it is easier to manipuate because you can shill an auction just as easy. I have never been a member of VCP and probably never will for the reason stated above.

+1

Larry

Rich Klein · #11 10-29-2011, 06:59 AM

I could have sworn that Bobby and I discussed that a few years ago and he started putting in BIN"s slightly after our chat. They are sales and for the 99 percent part, legit.

ETopps was another issue; but since Bobby was not covering ETopps, did not affect his service. The ETopps Tony Banks was especially messed up in pricing IIRC.

Rich

#12 10-27-2011, 12:38 PM

VCP records both BIN's and auctions. I use them as well as data I gather from watching sales both here, eBay, and other sources. I believe this was discussed before and it's a keyword issue for the spiders searching out this data via the web. Problem is if you don't do your research dont blame VCP for not doing it for you. I don't agree with the fact I spend X amount every year for me to continually research my cards when I have paid for a service that claims to do it for me but it is what it is. For as little as I use it now I don't think it's worth half of what I pay a yr but before I could cancel renewal I got charged. Oh well there is always next yr. Maybe this thread will light a well needed fire to get the system fixed.

Bobby has a great product and it is still fairly new. It takes time and money to make anything work. Also I wonder how many people have ever contacted him in regards to this issue? One complaint every now and then may not have warranted a red flag to be raised and looked at. All we can do is tell him the issues and hope he handles them. I wish him all the best on his business.

glchen · #13 10-27-2011, 01:02 PM

I'm just totally guessing here, and only Bobby can say when/if he decides to chime in, but does VCP get the data based on the listing title or just the item details on ebay? For example, a lot of sellers don't fill in the item details on the listing (which would include manufacturer, card, grade, etc), and perhaps that is why these are not being picked up by VCP. Or not sure if VCP parses in the listing in some other way.

Leon · #14 10-27-2011, 01:24 PM

My little auction company, B & L, used to allow VCP to mine our data. For our last auction Bobby told us there would be a fee to do it so we decided not to. Fewer houses let him use their info anymore. I am not sure of all of the reasoning.

BobbyVCP · #15 10-27-2011, 02:08 PM

Leon lets be fair here the fee was not from VCP it was from Seth the auction software person you use. And all Seth had to do was turn on the code we provided to him years ago when we started, something that takes him less then a minute. Sure we can come in at the end of the auction and scrap all the data and input it in our site. But the thing you are missing and this is the key is by having access to your auction as it starts and entering all your items live it then checks 3469 current members want lists for any items you have and they need. When it finds matches sends a email with link to your auction telling them a card they want is now available for them to bid and win.So by you not wanting to be part of the system and paying Seth his money how many potential buyers did you miss out on? And if those notices went out I think you would find a much better return to your consignors.

Whereas all the people using Bob from Simple there is no fee involved at all.

ZernialFan · #16 10-27-2011, 02:22 PM

Being new, I did not know VCP was owned/supported by someone on the board.
But I do know that the buys were not BIN's. I 99.9% refuse to buy BIN on Ebay because they are generally X2, X3, X4 the going price of the card in the segment of the hobby I collect. I stick to auctions only. If I had known, I would have sent the info to VCP. I still have the info in my file, but do not remember which ones.

Charlie

BobbyVCP · #17 10-27-2011, 01:18 PM

We try our best to capture as much data as we can and there are circumstances where some fall through the cracks. We get notices from members about once a month for something we missed and verify the auction and add it to our system. In this case we had no way of verifying the results. I see that it happened looking at the screen shots he posted which he never sent to me to view. All he sent was a eBay ID that expired and showed me no proof it ever happened.

At the beginning of the year eBay decided to change their API system and of course as we all know about them they failed to tell their licensees about it so there was a time period we where not pulling all the data. Since then we were finally able to implement a workaround in March and the reports of missing transaction dropped dramatically.

We never want to get in a situation where we are posting results without the proof. We have always been here and available for all of our members needs and answer any question or fix any problem that should arise.

vintagetoppsguy · #18 10-27-2011, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobbyVCP

In this case we had no way of verifying the results. I see that it happened looking at the screen shots he posted which he never sent to me to view. All he sent was a eBay ID that expired and showed me no proof it ever happened.

We never want to get in a situation where we are posting results without the proof. We have always been here and available for all of our members needs and answer any question or fix any problem that should arise.

Bobby,

Here was my email to you, word for word:
"I have a 1909 E90-1 American Caramel Eddie Plank SGC 50 (4) that I was considering selling. I went to VCP to look up what I paid for the card, but you guys don't list it. I bought this card on eBay on or around February 8, 2011. I paid $750 for this card and the eBay item number was 200564550761. Can you please tell me why you don't show it in the completed sales history? When I go to sell this card, it will give it more credibility if the card shows up in VCP. I have other information if you need any including screen shots."

I told you that I had screen shots to show the purchase. Did you ask for them? NO! Your reply was simply, "Since the auction is so old we can not verify it."

vintagetoppsguy · #19 10-27-2011, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

I don't know the specifics of your deal but I did a one-day VCP signup recently and I was surprised at how few cards had transacted in the last 2-3 years according to it. I found listing after listing for T, E and W cards that showed no sales for years, in any grade. Seemed inaccurate to me.

Some of these cards don't trade very often and it's important to capture every public sale (that is their business). If it were a '56 Mantle or some card like that that trades several times a month, it wouldn't be as big a deal to miss a transaction every now and then because it would still equal out. However, it's frustrating knowing they are missing cards like the ones I've mentioned.

Bosox Blair · #20 10-28-2011, 03:31 AM

BTW sport, don't get all agitated when people don't agree that your four little BIN transactions somehow make a valuable business into "a joke".

You couldn't care less about my views...guess that makes us even.

But here's a free business tip for you - if you think BIN results are so valuable, go ahead and set up a business accurately tracking BINs and sit back and wait for subscribers to line up with money in hand...and wait...and wait...

vintagetoppsguy · #21 10-28-2011, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bosox Blair

BTW sport, don't get all agitated when people don't agree that your four little BIN transactions somehow make a valuable business into "a joke".

Sport? My four little BINs? Don't insult me, douchebag. VCP is in the business is capturing eBay sales - BINs or auction formats.

****************************************

Leon,

If this a-hole wants to continue this arguement, he should put his full name in his post.

Leon · #22 10-28-2011, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Sport? My four little BINs? Don't insult me, douchebag. VCP is in the business is capturing eBay sales - BINs or auction formats.

****************************************

Leon,

If this a-hole wants to continue this arguement, he should put his full name in his post.

It is a board rule that if you are going to argue with someone or say anything derogatory about a company or person then your name does need to be out here. You are arguing with B.lair C.urtis.

Bosox Blair · #23 10-28-2011, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Sport? My four little BINs? Don't insult me, douchebag. VCP is in the business is capturing eBay sales - BINs or auction formats.

****************************************

Leon,

If this a-hole wants to continue this arguement, he should put his full name in his post.

You have shown yourself to be exactly what you are. I don't stoop to namecalling.

You would never do this to my face - believe me.

Happy collecting, David James.

Blair Curtis

vintagetoppsguy · #24 10-28-2011, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bosox Blair

You have shown yourself to be exactly what you are. I don't stoop to namecalling.

You would never do this to my face - believe me.

Happy collecting, David James.

Blair Curtis

No, you didn't stoop to namecalling, you stooped to insults. So, I guess it's okay to insult, but not to call names? Whatever! And who says I wouldn't do it to your face? Why don't you PM me and maybe we can make arrangments to meet and see whether or not I would do it to your face.

Edited to add the following:

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3-2-count

That being said the name calling you've received in this thread by the other N54 member is totally uncalled for and unacceptable. I don't go for that crap either.

Tony, I have had pleasant dealings with you in the past and I certainly repsect you, but come on. Are you telling me that it's acceptable for him to hurl inuslts at me, but it's unacceptable for me to call him names? Seriously?

smtjoy · #25 10-28-2011, 02:17 PM

Not to get too technical but the initial 4 cards you have listed, look hard at how they were listed and how VCP parses them. From what I have seen in the past with auctions of mine that dont make it into VCP, a lot of times I had issues with my title.

I can see on your E90 Lajoie its condition is listed as SGC 3, I would bet this might have been kicked out because the program does not know if its really a 40 or a 30?. Also it does not list a E90-1, E90-2 or E90-3 so it didnt know the proper set. On the T206 McGraw you purchased the variation is listed as "CAP PORTRAIT"- PSA list them as - "Portrait No Cap" or "Portrait With Cap" no way to tell from your description which it is so I bet the software rightly rejected because of this. It looks like the T-206 Keeler was listed as BATTING and the listing needed to be "With Bat".

These might seem like little things but they are big issues for a program trying to understand a data feed. I am sure Bobby can tell you more of how this is handled but I would bet a large number of the auctions missing have these issues. Just look at how many auctions sometimes list the card as an SGC 50/ PSA 4 to try and market to those who collect both even thou the card is only an SGC 50.

I also think that some kind of time limit on relisted them is fair and should happen as someone could in theory photoshop the paypal printout and say what they want for price and email it in when they want to sell and accept what you are saying as fact. VCP can no longer look it up in ebay to verify it.

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