OT- RIP Joe Paterno

Wite3 · #1 01-23-2012, 08:37 AM

John et. al.

Being a teacher and working with children for the last 25 years, I was appalled at what went on with Sandusky and Paterno until one of my good friends asked me how I would have handled the situation.

I have made that call a few times in my career and each time it was on suspicion of abuse, not proof. And each time it was VERY difficult. I know teachers and staff that were unable to make the call even to possibly save a child. It is a difficult thing to confront. I am not excusing Paterno's actions at all and he had a responsibility to go further and he failed. But how many of you might have made the same calls in his situation. It is not an easy thing to believe, confront, and then take action against.

Before people roast Paterno, take a second and ask yourself how you would have handled it if a close friend/co-worker was possibly caught hurting a child and how would you handle all the implications to follow.

Joshua

powderfinger · #2 01-23-2012, 09:14 AM

I too am a school teacher. Until very recently, teachers were told not to confront parents, fellow faculty members, etc., they suspected of abuse or neglect. Protocol dictated that if you suspected someone of these transgressions, they should be reported to your supervisor (principle, dean, etc.). That person was to act on that information by taking it to people who make decisions about hiring and firing and who have access to the legal machinery of the institution. This policy was instituted to protect teachers and others from legal action resulting from what might turn out to be false accusations. This is exactly what Paterno did.

Where he failed was in not questioning why Sandusky was still on the sideline with him after he had reported what he knew to his superiors. It's very hard to believe that his actions in what would become a national scandal ended there. Was there no follow up? Didn't anybody get back to him to let him know what any type of investigation determined? Was there even an investigation? Regardless of what his superiors did or didn't do, Paterno had the ultimate responsibility for his program and his staff, and even if Paterno thought a hint of what Sandusky was accused of might be true, Sandusky should have been fired. That was Paterno's failing and his downfall.

Shakespeare, speaking through Mark Anthony in "Julius Caesar" wrote: "The evil that men do lives after them, the good is oft interred with their bones."

Unfortunately, he could have been writing about Joe Paterno.

novakjr · #3 01-23-2012, 09:28 AM

Ray, at that point, Sandusky was not a part of the program. He'd been retired for 3 or 4 years, but was allowed access to all school facilities and given an office as part of his retirement.. Basically, Paterno had no control over the guy. But yes, I understand your sentiment about protocol.

ethicsprof · #4 01-23-2012, 10:37 AM

rest in peace, Joe Paterno.
my sympathy to family and friends.

barry

quinnsryche · #5 01-23-2012, 11:16 AM

Anybody who has anything nice to say about this lowlife scumbag should be forceably raped and see how you like it. I know he didn't do it, but he knew about it and that makes him just as guilty. The university knows it, that's why he was fired. You Paterno backers make me sick. People who put a stupid sport in front of children's safety deserve to burn in hell with Sandusky.

YankeeCollector · #6 01-23-2012, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quinnsryche

Anybody who has anything nice to say about this lowlife scumbag should be forceably raped and see how you like it. I know he didn't do it, but he knew about it and that makes him just as guilty. The university knows it, that's why he was fired. You Paterno backers make me sick. People who put a stupid sport in front of children's safety deserve to burn in hell with Sandusky.

+1

Shoeless Moe · #7 01-23-2012, 02:06 PM

Joe Paterno is a piece of garbage!

Correction.....was

edhans · #8 01-23-2012, 11:22 AM

I can't help but wonder what the conversations between Paterno and Sandusky were like the last nine years; and why he continued to allow his name to be used (as an honorary director) by that foundation for nine years after he was aware of the accusations against Sandusky. And don't ask me to believe that he couldn't have gotten him away from the campus and program if he wanted to. Yes, he was a great coach and mentor to many people, but this episode will forever sully his legacy.

uyu906 · #9 01-23-2012, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by novakjr

Ray, at that point, Sandusky was not a part of the program. He'd been retired for 3 or 4 years, but was allowed access to all school facilities and given an office as part of his retirement.. Basically, Paterno had no control over the guy. But yes, I understand your sentiment about protocol.

I really think this fact has been intentionally overlooked by many, and accidentally overlooked by some. Sandusky had been retired for 3 years when the 2002 stuff took place and when Joe found out about it. Pretty hard to fire someone, or otherwise discipline them, when they no longer work for you. Sandusky deserves every bad thing that can happen to him legally, but the way the media made out that this whole thing was Joe Paterno's fault and tainted his legacy has seemed very unfair to me. And firing a guy over the phone, after 60 some years of working for the same employer, would be a low class move whether we are talking about college football or a steel mill.

edhans · #10 01-23-2012, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Sandusky had been retired for 3 years when the 2002 stuff took place and when Joe found out about it. Pretty hard to fire someone, or otherwise discipline them, when they no longer work for you.

Yet he continued to enjoy access to campus facilities. Surely someone should have seen to it that he be barred from the campus. The inaction by Paterno and others allowed the abuse to continue for several years after the initial discovery.

YankeeCollector · #11 01-23-2012, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by uyu906

I really think this fact has been intentionally overlooked by many, and accidentally overlooked by some. Sandusky had been retired for 3 years when the 2002 stuff took place and when Joe found out about it. Pretty hard to fire someone, or otherwise discipline them, when they no longer work for you. Sandusky deserves every bad thing that can happen to him legally, but the way the media made out that this whole thing was Joe Paterno's fault and tainted his legacy has seemed very unfair to me. And firing a guy over the phone, after 60 some years of working for the same employer, would be a low class move whether we are talking about college football or a steel mill.

Firing someone who sodomized children??? It doesnt matter if he worked there at all or not, he was very visible on campus and had access to all of the facilities. Paterno should have immediately banned him from Penn State forever and reported him to the Police!!! You dont only lose your job for heinous sex crimes vs children, you go to jail!!!! As far as Im concerned, I dont care how many buildings or wings he contributed to the University! He had a chance to make a difference and he chose protecting his friend, the university and most of all the football program over protecting 10 yr old boys from single parent homes!!!

novakjr · #12 01-23-2012, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YankeeCollector

Firing someone who sodomized children??? It doesnt matter if he worked there at all or not, he was very visible on campus and had access to all of the facilities. Paterno should have immediately banned him from Penn State forever and reported him to the Police!!! You dont only lose your job for heinous sex crimes vs children, you go to jail!!!! As far as Im concerned, I dont care how many buildings or wings he contributed to the University! He had a chance to make a difference and he chose protecting his friend, the university and most of all the football program over protecting 10 yr old boys from single parent homes!!!

From what I heard, they had almost no personal relationship, and that it was strictly professional. I really don't think that he was trying to cover for his friend as many seem to imply. Was he wrong? In a way yes, for not doing more. Was anything intentional? I really don't believe that.

glynparson · #13 01-23-2012, 02:28 PM

According to many reports Paterno did turn him into campus police. Couple this with the fact that McQueary admits he did not tell joe all the facts and I feel he got a raw deal. The university more than Paterno seems at fault for the coverup. And if you think Im a Paterno apologist you obviously dont know me.

sbfinley · #14 01-23-2012, 02:31 PM

Tony and Jim,

In an alternate universe his reporting of the issue to his superiors might not have fallen through the cracks and Sandusky's horrors might have been stopped. It is not within the realm of possibility to believe that Paterno could have done nothing more than what he did and the and this sad story could have been brought to a grinding halt. Unfortunately it didn't and if you want to vilify him as an enabler or for not shouting what he heard from the rooftops you have that right. But some of us have chose to remember him for the immense good he did in his life and we too have that right. I completely understand that this is a firestorm topic and people's opinions on his legacy are already etched in stone, but the opening statement of your post is unnecessary.

Runscott · #15 01-23-2012, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbfinley

Tony and Jim,

In an alternate universe his reporting of the issue to his superiors might not have fallen through the cracks and Sandusky's horrors might have been stopped. It is not within the realm of possibility to believe that Paterno could have done nothing more than what he did and the and this sad story could have been brought to a grinding halt. Unfortunately it didn't and if you want to vilify him as an enabler or for not shouting what he heard from the rooftops you have that right. But some of us have chose to remember him for the immense good he did in his life and we too have that right. I completely understand that this is a firestorm topic and people's opinions on his legacy are already etched in stone, but the opening statement of your post is unnecessary.

Uh oh. Steve, bend over - we have a line forming at Tony's request. Could you stop by Rite-Aid and pick up some vaseline? I'm thinking this is going to hurt.

Wahoowa · #16 01-23-2012, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbfinley

Tony and Jim,

In an alternate universe his reporting of the issue to his superiors might not have fallen through the cracks and Sandusky's horrors might have been stopped. It is not within the realm of possibility to believe that Paterno could have done nothing more than what he did and the and this sad story could have been brought to a grinding halt. Unfortunately it didn't and if you want to vilify him as an enabler or for not shouting what he heard from the rooftops you have that right. But some of us have chose to remember him for the immense good he did in his life and we too have that right. I completely understand that this is a firestorm topic and people's opinions on his legacy are already etched in stone, but the opening statement of your post is unnecessary.

Well said. RIP JoePa.

Runscott · #17 01-23-2012, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wite3

John et. al.

Being a teacher and working with children for the last 25 years, I was appalled at what went on with Sandusky and Paterno until one of my good friends asked me how I would have handled the situation.

I have made that call a few times in my career and each time it was on suspicion of abuse, not proof. And each time it was VERY difficult. I know teachers and staff that were unable to make the call even to possibly save a child. It is a difficult thing to confront. I am not excusing Paterno's actions at all and he had a responsibility to go further and he failed. But how many of you might have made the same calls in his situation. It is not an easy thing to believe, confront, and then take action against.

Before people roast Paterno, take a second and ask yourself how you would have handled it if a close friend/co-worker was possibly caught hurting a child and how would you handle all the implications to follow.

Joshua

Well-said, Joshua. One of the down sides to the internet is all the discussion forum preachers. I don't think any more or less of Paterno because of their speeches. The self-righteous pulpit is what Facebook's for.

YankeeCollector · #18 01-23-2012, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wite3

John et. al.

Being a teacher and working with children for the last 25 years, I was appalled at what went on with Sandusky and Paterno until one of my good friends asked me how I would have handled the situation.

I have made that call a few times in my career and each time it was on suspicion of abuse, not proof. And each time it was VERY difficult. I know teachers and staff that were unable to make the call even to possibly save a child. It is a difficult thing to confront. I am not excusing Paterno's actions at all and he had a responsibility to go further and he failed. But how many of you might have made the same calls in his situation. It is not an easy thing to believe, confront, and then take action against.

Before people roast Paterno, take a second and ask yourself how you would have handled it if a close friend/co-worker was possibly caught hurting a child and how would you handle all the implications to follow.

Joshua

Is this a joke? I wouldnt want my kids anywhere near you!

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