Advice on Early 70's sets

[betafolio2]

Originally Posted by steve B

That's a tough question.
Personally I like mid grade cards. I don't feel nervous handling them, or letting friends look through them. And a bit of honest wear sometimes adds a bit of character. (I'm ok with beaters and really high grade cards too, I just look at them differently)

Steve B

Funny, but there are probably as many definitions for "mid grade" as there are baseball card collectors. Some would probably consider mid grade to be anything that doesn't warrant a PSA 7 or higher, while others might consider mid grade to mean cards that display obvious corner wear, perhaps a few light creases, some surface wear -- in other words, more like a PSA 4 or 5. I'm convinced that the average meaning of mid grade has tended to slide downward as PSA has created and then continued to feed the artificial appetite for super-high-end cards that qualify for PSA 9 or 10 status. I for one belong to the club of collectors who receive great joy in cracking cards out of their plastic prisons, so I'm obviously not hung up on a PSA number. My chief concern is how nice a card looks to my own eyes -- and how consistent it'll look alongside other cards in my set binders.

[ALR-bishop]

Congratulations, you are a hobbyist and a collector and not an investor

[mintacular]

I would say keep 'em if you think the urge to own/complete the sets will come back...If you sell them now, and wish to get them back, you'd probably be best off financially to plunk down 1K/ea. on the set and that won't be nearly as fun as trying to plug the holes you now have in those sets...That said, if you have zero interest in them and doubt it will come back then you should sell them obviously

[sox1903wschamp]

Originally Posted by betafolio2

My chief concern is how nice a card looks to my own eyes -- and how consistent it'll look alongside other cards in my set binders.

Well put.

[steve B]

Some good points there. For "investment" I suppose I mean anything that isn't exceptionally nice. Investment to me means working most of the potential angles, including the registry crowd.

Personally I consider "mid grade" to be what's usually vg through vg-ex. So no creases but worn corners, and typical early 70's centering. Or maybe sharp corners and typical centering. That pretty much describes my whole collection as far as 70's goes. I know I have some worse and some better, but It's not something I worry about.
I only have a few graded cards, nearly all prewar, and nearly all ones I sent in. The few modern ones are from packs, I think a couple "edge graded" football and maybe one or two random graded baseball that came in a lot.

The grading is something I'm ambivalent about. I typically base my decisions on my own grading scale
Awful - trimmed, missing bits, writing, stains etc.
Not horrible- worn, maybe a couple creases.
Pretty good- no creases but not great corners.
Nice- decent corners and no creasing.
Really nice- sharp corners decent centering.
wow- nearly perfect

And I enjoy some of the written on cards as much as the nearly perfect ones.

I don't worry much about the cards matching the rest of a set either, but I know I'm a bit odd in that. (I did briefly consider trying to complete some set with a wax wrapper stain on each card, but that would take way more focus than I have)

Steve B

Originally Posted by betafolio2

Funny, but there are probably as many definitions for "mid grade" as there are baseball card collectors. Some would probably consider mid grade to be anything that doesn't warrant a PSA 7 or higher, while others might consider mid grade to mean cards that display obvious corner wear, perhaps a few light creases, some surface wear -- in other words, more like a PSA 4 or 5. I'm convinced that the average meaning of mid grade has tended to slide downward as PSA has created and then continued to feed the artificial appetite for super-high-end cards that qualify for PSA 9 or 10 status. I for one belong to the club of collectors who receive great joy in cracking cards out of their plastic prisons, so I'm obviously not hung up on a PSA number. My chief concern is how nice a card looks to my own eyes -- and how consistent it'll look alongside other cards in my set binders.

[theseeker]

why are mid-grade sets from the seventies not considered an investment? The way I see it, it's supply and demand, so if interest drops in these sets, it will be across the board. As a matter of fact, high-grade investors are likely to take the bigger hit. It seems to me, if history is any indicator, there will be proportional price movement, according to grade. All the price guides have a means of pricing sets in various grades. High-grade sets sell for more but, obviously cost more and are more time consumming to obtain. And one more thing to consider, they are less liquid as they tend to take longer to sell.
It's all relative, if you're trying to complete a mid-grade set, then you complete it with mid-grade cards. For bargain hunters, there is greater price fluxuations with mid-grades, so it could be worth the effort to complete the sets. Of course, as the saying goes "time is money."
P.S., why are seventies sets now "coming out of the woodwork?"

[steve B]

I think the early 70's cards will show some modest gains over a few more years. especially 71s. But I've been wrong plenty of times before. Mid 70's might also be ok, and late 70's might not be "good" for some time. Not really an "investment" but some might look at it that way.

It all depends on how people come to view the era and the cards. Eventually the early -mid 70's might be seen as the last era before drug use, free agency creating huge salaries and the game and players getting somewhat unapproachable.

Card collecting had a huge boost from about 75- 81 as well, along with somewhat increased production.

I think we're seeing a lot of 70's stuff becoming available as the few adult collectors of the time get older - if you were 30 in 82 you're 60 now and maybe downsizing or getting ready for retirement. And many who collected then while younger might need money in tight times and will sell the 70's stuff as it's replaceable but still worth enough to sell.

Steve B

[RobertGT]

Originally Posted by steve B

I think the early 70's cards will show some modest gains over a few more years. especially 71s. But I've been wrong plenty of times before. Mid 70's might also be ok, and late 70's might not be "good" for some time. Not really an "investment" but some might look at it that way.

It all depends on how people come to view the era and the cards. Eventually the early -mid 70's might be seen as the last era before drug use, free agency creating huge salaries and the game and players getting somewhat unapproachable.

Card collecting had a huge boost from about 75- 81 as well, along with somewhat increased production.

I think we're seeing a lot of 70's stuff becoming available as the few adult collectors of the time get older - if you were 30 in 82 you're 60 now and maybe downsizing or getting ready for retirement. And many who collected then while younger might need money in tight times and will sell the 70's stuff as it's replaceable but still worth enough to sell.

Steve B

+1. The hope is that as the Baby Boomers decide to part with their collections, there will be a significant number of people in the 25-40 age group who have the interest and financial means to catch these collections and keep the hobby moving in a positive direction. I am 37 and trying to do my part.

[theseeker]

Originally Posted by RobertGT

+1. The hope is that as the Baby Boomers decide to part with their collections, there will be a significant number of people in the 25-40 age group who have the interest and financial means to catch these collections and keep the hobby moving in a positive direction. I am 37 and trying to do my part.

Sorry, but I'm just not seeing any evidence of 1970's cards "coming out of the woodwork." So if I have it straight, people who were 30 in '82 and would have grown up collecting early '60's cards, are now selling off there 1970's cards to prepare for retirement??? All this is loosely anecdotal at best.

This does, in a round about way bring up the greater issue of an aging hobby going forward as the baby boomer generation heads further into retirement age. As far as moving the hobby forward, the fact a 37 year old is taking up the cause as a young vangaurd of the hobby is telling. And by moving forward, does that mean sustaining prices? Because, it is the investment angle that killed off the hobby interest of the majority of those in their late 20's and early 30's, after the investment craze of the late '80's/early '90's abrutely turned cardboard investments into "shiny junk." The new card quality ushered in by UD in 1989 was a huge leap forward for the industry. Unfortunately, they were viewed (and sold) mostly as investments. As a result, those younger than this age group largely haven't grown up with collector interest and simply won't pick it up as adults.

[mintacular]

I think the early 70s will hold some value, lots of HOFers like Mays, Aaron, Banks, Clemente on their way out with new rookies/stars coming in...The high series cards will always have some tougher cards to find so break out potential there. Lot of bang for your buck/affordable for most collectors 700+ cards from this time era in EX for around 1K make it fun for collectors to chase

[steve B]

Not so much the baby boom as the cards as a collectible boom that existed for much of the mid 70's to mid 80's (With a bit of a dip in 81)

The guys who were 30 in 81 had collected as kids, and either looked at completing sets or buying stuff that had been tossed. I'm only using 30 as a rough age, that's about the time many people that collect something get into it somewhat seriously. Student loans paid off, career going well, etc.

When I started being more "serious" about cards in 77-78 There were a few adults, and some kids that collected, maybe 50/50 (Not counting kids that just bought packs at the corner store) I had 4 friends that collected during high school, and none of them would admit it around non-collectors. By 84 that had really changed, card collecting had become acceptable as a hobby for an adult, and there were more older guys buying cards.

So a lot of people who were 30-40 got into collecting and without a large number of sets it was common to buy the new ones already sorted into sets each year. And many dealers carried early 70's sets (Fritsch supplied many of them and may still be working off their inventory bought as new vending cases. )
I had a "job" sorting cards into sets each spring, paid in trade value instead of cash until all three companies made factory sets. Fleer in 82, topps and donruss a bit later. (Or maybe at the same time but more expensive than vending?)

Personally I never bought the "quality" of Upper Deck. Bland design, the silly hologram, the cardboard that made 81 donruss seem sturdy.....And all at double the price- what a bargain!

Steve B

Originally Posted by theseeker

Sorry, but I'm just not seeing any evidence of 1970's cards "coming out of the woodwork." So if I have it straight, people who were 30 in '82 and would have grown up collecting early '60's cards, are now selling off there 1970's cards to prepare for retirement??? All this is loosely anecdotal at best.

This does, in a round about way bring up the greater issue of an aging hobby going forward as the baby boomer generation heads further into retirement age. As far as moving the hobby forward, the fact a 37 year old is taking up the cause as a young vangaurd of the hobby is telling. And by moving forward, does that mean sustaining prices? Because, it is the investment angle that killed off the hobby interest of the majority of those in their late 20's and early 30's, after the investment craze of the late '80's/early '90's abrutely turned cardboard investments into "shiny junk." The new card quality ushered in by UD in 1989 was a huge leap forward for the industry. Unfortunately, they were viewed (and sold) mostly as investments. As a result, those younger than this age group largely haven't grown up with collector interest and simply won't pick it up as adults.