What's an autograph, anyway?

[mighty bombjack]

Yes! The definitional gray areas are what I want to discuss.

More to come.

Anyone, please post any "gray" examples of autos that you have seen!

[mighty bombjack]

I found this one that I remember being very controversial. Most accepted that the Washington here was written by our first president, but can you call it an autograph? A signature? If not, what do you call it, and what is it worth compared to a beautiful, unquestionable autograph?

[mighty bombjack]

How about these MacPhails? The first is obviously a letter, and the second is an inscription in a book.

Autographs, or no?

[drc]

If Rousch had printed out the letters in his name, instead of using cursive, I would not have called it his autograph. So the Rousch is an interesting example due to his cursive addiction. Visually it's his autograph, but technically it is not.

[David Atkatz]

An "autograph" is anything written in the person's own hand. It does not have to be (or contain) a signature. Hence the autographic designations:

A.L. Autograph Letter (letter in the person's hand, no signature)
A.L.S. Autograph Letter Signed (letter in the person's hand, with signature)
A.D. Autograph Document (document in the person's hand, no signature)
A.D.S. Autograph Document Signed (document in the person's hand, with signature)
A.M. Autograph Manuscript (manuscript in the person's hand, no signature)
A.M.S. Autograph Manuscript Signed (Manuscript in the person's hand, with signature)

That return address cut is at least an A.D., and some would call it an A.D.S. That Washington cut is a piece of an A.D.

[mighty bombjack]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

An "autograph" is anything written in the person's own hand. It does not have to be (or contain) a signature. Hence the autographic designations:

A.L. Autograph Letter (letter in the person's hand, no signature)
A.L.S. Autograph Letter Signed (letter in the person's hand, with signature)
A.D. Autograph Document (document in the person's hand, no signature)
A.D.S. Autograph Document Signed (document in the person's hand, with signature)
A.M. Autograph Manuscript (manuscript in the person's hand, no signature)
A.M.S. Autograph Manuscript Signed (Manuscript in the person's hand, with signature)

That return address cut is at least an A.D., and some would call it an A.D.S. That Washington cut is a piece of an A.D.

Interesting. Where did you find this?

What about initials? I don't know the legal difference as to why I have to initial certin parts of a document and then sign my full name at the end, but are intitials an autograph?

[David Atkatz]

Originally Posted by mighty bombjack

Interesting. Where did you find this?

these are standard terms. They've been in use by autograph collectors and dealers for well over 150 years. There are many others; e.g.,

D.S. Document Signed (document in hand of another, or printed, but signed by person in question.)
L.S. Letter Signed (letter in hand of another, signed by person in question.)
T.L.S. Typed Letter Signed
I.S.P. Inscribed Photo Signed

etc.

[Exhibitman]

Or the ever-popular Roach's Corner version: "P.O.S."

[mighty bombjack]

I'm sure many of you saw this Addie Joss postcard in the last oldjudge auction. Here is an example (if authentic) of a player writing his last name in reference to his son. In any way an autograph?

http://www.oldjudge.com/auction/auto...ost-cards/235/