Braun Suspended for Balance of the 2013 Season

[Peter_Spaeth]

Is anyone except Derek Jeter clean?

[AndyG09]

Did the guy who worked for MLB lose his job after the technicality? It will be interesting to see what comes of his career from this point on.

Best,

Andy

[glchen]

Originally Posted by AndyG09

Did the guy who worked for MLB lose his job after the technicality? It will be interesting to see what comes of his career from this point on.

Best,

Andy

I thought that the arbitrator who ruled in favor of Braun got fired. Maybe it was both of them. Personally, I don't think we're at the end of the steroid era, more like the middle, since HGH is so hard to catch.

[quinnsryche]

I hope they catch and expel every last one of these cheatin' bastards. They guys on MLB made a good point today. They said that from now on anyone caught cheating should be exempt from any award (MVP, Cy Young etc.), all star team or any accolade they may be given in the future. Teams should also be allowed to void any contract if a player is found guilty. I agree 100%. I vote for lifetime banishment after any offense. 1 and done. Get out and stay out. The days of McGwire, Sosa, Bonds, Rodriguez, Braun and all the others are OVER stating right now.

[DixieBaseball]

I wonder if he was cheating back when he played with the Nashville Sounds? Yet another clean player's roster spot has been stolen from them. Glad to see baseball continue to move in the right direction. I would like to not only see a suspension, but also make the player go down to Triple A to spend a year probation. I think this would really curb the cheating. Spending a year back down in the minor's would be very sobering after being in the big's... I don't think taking money away sends the message. Time to ride the bus again for several months might change the thinking...

[drcy]

If Braun's career tanks and the Brewers are on the hook for $100 million, that will work as incentive for the teams, the folks signing the contracts, to prevent players from taking PEDs.

Everyone but the ostriches in Wisconsin said he was probably on PEDs. If the Brewers were still willing to sign him to a $100 million contract, that's their own fault when he gets caught. Maybe next time the Brewers will steer clear of players they know are PED users.

[the 'stache]

Originally Posted by drcy

If Braun's career tanks and the Brewers are on the hook for $100 million, that will work as incentive for the teams, the folks signing the contracts, to prevent players from taking PEDs.

Everyone but the ostriches in Wisconsin said he was probably on PEDs. If the Brewers were still willing to sign him to a $100 million contract, that's their own fault when he gets caught. Maybe next time the Brewers will steer clear of players they know are PED users.

Don't let anything like the facts get in the way of your stupid diatribe.

Ryan Braun signed his extension prior to the 2011 season (April of 2011). His positive urine test came in the postseason of the 2011 season (October 2011), and the story broke in December of 2011. Eight months later.

So, by what stretch of the imagination did the Brewers extend a known PED user?

As for us "ostriches" in Wisconsin, I'm relatively certain that every single Brewers fan, myself included, accepted that there was a very good possibility that Ryan Braun was indeed guilty of what he'd been accused. The difference between us and everybody else, it seems, is that we decided to wait for the facts to come out before assassinating somebody's reputation. A lot of people were ready to take what ESPN was reporting as cold-hard facts, even though their story seemingly changed by the day ("Ryan Braun is being suspended for using PED". "Ryan Braun is being suspended for using a banned substance". "Ryan Braun tested positive for a banned substance being used to treat a STD".) ESPN completely lacks in journalistic integrity, yet people were treating their word as the Bible. Never mind that the appeals process in place for baseball players was supposed to be confidential. ESPN didn't care if they ruined his reputation sans facts. They cared more about their web hits, their television ratings, and their magazine sales.

[HRBAKER]

It may be more than just a passing coincidence that he decided to step forward and acknowledge his mistakes after the good doctor at the clinic began cooperating with MLB.

I've sat where your sitting being a Cardinals fan. Personally I think what McGwire did to the HR record in 1998 is reprehensible in hindsight.

I'm long passed giving any of them the benefit of the doubt, they've proven me gullible too many times.

Edited to add: It would be truly refreshing if you were right.

[kmac32]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

It may be more than just a passing coincidence that he decided to step forward and acknowledge his mistakes after the good doctor at the clinic began cooperating with MLB.

I've sat where your sitting being a Cardinals fan. Personally I think what McGwire did to the HR record in 1998 is reprehensible in hindsight.

I'm long passed giving any of them the benefit of the doubt, they've proven me gullible too many times.

Edited to add: It would be truly refreshing if you were right.

As a diehard Cub fan, I still believe that you can add Sammy Sosa to the list of PED guys. I personally believe Braun got caught the first time and even though the chain of evidence was broken, he still took a prohibited substance. You can accurately believe that whatever they found in the urine test was what he was taking. It's not rocket science to figure that point out. Even worse, he lied about it. I strongly believe that if he were innocent and did not do anything wrong, he would and should fight the charges tooth and nail. Revoking his MVP title should be a no brainier.

[the 'stache]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

It may be more than just a passing coincidence that he decided to step forward and acknowledge his mistakes after the good doctor at the clinic began cooperating with MLB.

I've sat where your sitting being a Cardinals fan. Personally I think what McGwire did to the HR record in 1998 is reprehensible in hindsight.

I'm long passed giving any of them the benefit of the doubt, they've proven me gullible too many times.

While I agree with the spirit of what you're saying, respectfully, I have to say these situations are a little different, Jeff. McGwire was a pretty big guy as a rookie with the A's, but by the time he was hitting his 70 home runs with the Cardinals, he was just huge. In 1987 he was 6'5" 213 lbs. In 1998, he was listed as 6'5" 250 pounds. In 2007, Ryan Braun was 6'1" 202 lbs. In 2012, he was 6'1" 210 pounds. Braun added some muscle, but his body mass didn't bloat up like McGwires. Big Mac added 37 pounds. Also, Ryan Braun, if you look at his numbers, has hit pretty much the same number of home runs every year, save for 2010 when he hurt his hand. As a rookie, he hit 34 home runs in 492 at bats (once every 14.47 at bats). In 2012, he hit 41 home runs in 598 at bats (once every 14.58 at bats). He's been consistent across the board. There haven't been any substantial jumps in his performance that one would associate with taking performance enhancing drugs.

I agree with you that cheating in any form is reprehensible, and I know I'm probably coming off as a homer by not jumping on the "let's hang Ryan Braun as a scum bag" bandwagon. But we haven't heard the real facts of what happened with Braun. His reputation was already shot because of the first suspension + overturn (he clearly got off on a technicality, right? Nevermind that science has shown how improper storage of a specimen can skew results. See Diane Modhal). It's clear that MLB had it out for him (they were willing to give a complete pass to the dirt bags who were dealing drugs in order to "get their guys"), and they were going to suspend him no matter what he did. Isn't it at least possible that Braun said to himself "since I'm suspended no matter what I do, why not take a lesser suspension now. My thumb is still messed up, so I can get healthy. The team is 18 games out of first place, Corey Hart is out for the season, as is Aramis Ramirez pretty much. We can't compete with our three best power hitters out. Better I serve now that the season is lost than fight this, and possibly have to face suspension next year".

We don't know what he took. We don't know if this all relates back to the 2011 suspension, or if this is something new. But it's clear that MLB was on a witch hunt of sorts. No confidentiality whatsoever. They aired their dirty laundry in public for all to see. Hell, when his suspension was overturned by Shyam Das, a well respected arbiter (and somebody who looked at all the evidence for three months beforre making his ruling), MLB fired him. What chance did Ryan Braun have? At what point does a player just throw up his hands after being beaten into submission for nearly two years? I'm not saying he's an angel at all. He did something wrong. But it really appears to me that we're not seeing the whole picture. If he got off on a technicality, why did it take Das so long to reach his decision? One would think that would be an open and shut case, right? Or was there a lot more compelling evidence that we haven't seen? Braun's Brewer teammates have come forward to say "if the public knew the truth, we'd think differently". Aaron Rodgers of the Packers said he'd bet his 2013 salary that he was innocent. Are all these guys dead from the neck up? Or is there something we've not yet seen?

It's possible I'm grasping at straws, and that Ryan has played everybody for a fool for a very long time. But there's something inside me that says we're only getting one half of the story. Ryan hasn't spoken at length before, as he was bound by the confidentiality clause of the arbitration process. Maybe now he can do so.

I don't know, I'm just sick of this whole thing. It's ruined my enjoyment of this season. It's been a dark cloud circling over 2013's head.

[itjclarke]

Originally Posted by the 'stache

ESPN completely lacks in journalistic integrity, yet people were treating their word as the Bible. Never mind that the appeals process in place for baseball players was supposed to be confidential. ESPN didn't care if they ruined his reputation sans facts. They cared more about their web hits, their television ratings, and their magazine sales.

Being a Bay Area native (BALCO) and Giants fan, I've engaged in enough steroid talk to last a life time, and feel little need to weigh in on Braun.. except in saying that I had little/no suspicion of his PED use prior to the 2011 test. His swing looked pure, his power seemed body & hip generated, but oh well.

Anyway, I totally agree about ESPN. I grew up watching ESPN, but have grown tired of what they've become. They have little to no integrity, and seem far more interested in getting a story out first, rather than being right.. hey, they can just correct themselves later (sadly this seems the case with most news outlets now). I was also very put off having been told first hand a few years back that a major sports network (ESPN strongly hinted) was offering six figures to someone that had priveledged access to the Mitchell Report. Apparently they eventually got to someone or several people as those names trickled out one by one for weeks... just as grand jury testimony had leaked prior. I'm not saying that ESPN or its reporters had a hand in this dirtiness, but I had season tickets at AT&T park during this period and got so sick of seeing Pedro Gomez and his camara guy wandering around my section like vultures for 2 straight years.

[the 'stache]

Originally Posted by itjclarke

Being a Bay Area native (BALCO) and Giants fan, I've engaged in enough steroid talk to last a life time, and feel little need to weigh in on Braun.. except in saying that I had little/no suspicion of his PED use prior to the 2011 test. His swing looked pure, his power seemed body & hip generated, but oh well.

I agree, and I've been watching Braun closely since he first stepped on the field at Miller Park (in addition to the footage I've seen of him in the minors, and back at Miami). I see a guy that's a career .312 hitter...strong, but lean. He generates incredible bat speed with very fluid mechanics. He's got a really fast twitch, strong legs, and powerful wrists. That allows him to hit with power to all fields.

After the story was leaked, all I seemed to read was "well, Braun is only a great hitter because he has Prince Fielder behind him. Pitchers have to throw to him, so he gets more good pitches to hit". Then he has the best year of his career in 2012 while Prince is in Detroit backing up Miguel Cabrera.

This is why I still don't believe that he took performance enhancers. I know he took something, but I just don't see a guy that's benefiting from juicing up. This isn't a guy hitting 60-70 home runs a season. He's consistent in all aspects of the game. He's pretty much famous in Milwaukee for his work ethic.

There's often more to stories like this, and I think when the other shoe drops, some opinions will change.

[ScottFandango]

Originally Posted by itjclarke

Being a Bay Area native (BALCO) and Giants fan, I've engaged in enough steroid talk to last a life time, and feel little need to weigh in on Braun.. except in saying that I had little/no suspicion of his PED use prior to the 2011 test. His swing looked pure, his power seemed body & hip generated, but oh well.

Anyway, I totally agree about ESPN. I grew up watching ESPN, but have grown tired of what they've become. They have little to no integrity, and seem far more interested in getting a story out first, rather than being right.. hey, they can just correct themselves later (sadly this seems the case with most news outlets now). I was also very put off having been told first hand a few years back that a major sports network (ESPN strongly hinted) was offering six figures to someone that had priveledged access to the Mitchell Report. Apparently they eventually got to someone or several people as those names trickled out one by one for weeks... just as grand jury testimony had leaked prior. I'm not saying that ESPN or its reporters had a hand in this dirtiness, but I had season tickets at AT&T park during this period and got so sick of seeing Pedro Gomez and his camara guy wandering around my section like vultures for 2 straight years.

I posted this years ago, I thought he was surely on something by the LOOK OF HIS EYES....he has that drug induced "pinned open eyes " where his entire iris was visible...looked like he had a "shocked" look on his face all the time...this is not a normal look and I thought he was on speed/uppers but it was way more than that

[z28jd]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Is anyone except Derek Jeter clean?

How would you have any idea that Jeter has played clean during his entire career? I wouldn't assume anyone has played clean unless you were with them 100% of the time. Nothing against you Peter, it just bothers me when people say without doubt that certain people were clean and are willing to just believe rumors on other players(Jeff Bagwell for example)

[drumback]

What makes you so sure Jeter is clean?

[stewbacca]

I don't think we will ever find out what Braun did or took. Part of this apology and acceptance of his 65 game ban was done with attourneys and legal counsel which probably allows him to not admit publicly what exactly he did or took as long as he says "I have made mistakes and will do better". As a West coast Brewers fan since around 1980, there is no way I can defend Braun and his attitude over the past few years about his positive test. He beat the test on a technicality. Then he goes all Lance Armstong on anyone who would try to say differently(news conference about beating the test? I told you I was clean?). Was he taking them before the big contract? Did he take them only for the playoffs? We will never know and Mr Braun will never admit publicly what he did...there is no reason to. He will sit out his 65 games and start collecting his big contract again next season. We are a forgiving society.....even without being asked.

[slidekellyslide]

I think we are nearing the end of the PED era in baseball...the union has finally decided they are no longer going to stand behind the users. I believe the penalties will get stiffer now. It should be test once and you're done for a full year, and the team should have the right to cut you loose without paying the contract. Test twice and you get a lifetime ban...the same ban that Rose got, no association with baseball at all...you want to watch a game, you buy a ticket. No participation in any baseball sanctioned events. Persona non grata.

[chaddurbin]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

I think we are nearing the end of the PED era in baseball...the union has finally decided they are no longer going to stand behind the users. I believe the penalties will get stiffer now. It should be test once and you're done for a full year, and the team should have the right to cut you loose without paying the contract. Test twice and you get a lifetime ban...the same ban that Rose got, no association with baseball at all...you want to watch a game, you buy a ticket. No participation in any baseball sanctioned events. Persona non grata.

agree with this, should be 1st time out for season...2nd offense means lifetime. imo this will still not deter some latin/central american players who came from nothing and will still risk it for the payday.

sorry i didn't read the walls of text, but of course braun cheated...with PED! he's laying down like a dog because he knows he's at a dead-end and if he fights it any longer the WHOLE truth will come out. interesting to hear from the "insiders" that he's not very well-liked with the players because he's a cheater who got off on a technicality.