SGC T206s....It needs to be brought up, it's scary, very scary if you are a collector

[Econteachert205]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Dennis.....Again, it's about value. I have never said SGC is not reputable, they are, absolutely...What I'm talking about is true value for the dollar, it's not even close....

Right, so I was thinking of where the extra value came from. If both companies are reputable then there is only a limited amount of variables contributing to psa's enhanced appeal. The registry seems to be the biggest factor. However some of the grading advantages in terms of a lack of qualifiers are also valid for sure. If I was sgc I would certainly take these concerns seriously and take steps to assure customers cards values are protected.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by Econteachert205

Right, so I was thinking of where the extra value came from. If both companies are reputable then there is only a limited amount of variables contributing to psa's enhanced appeal. The registry seems to be the biggest factor. However some of the grading advantages in terms of a lack of qualifiers are also valid for sure. If I was sgc I would certainly take these concerns seriously and take steps to assure customers cards values are protected.

I guess buy the holder not the card

[wonkaticket]

The value of most "quality" cards isn't determined by a major TPG holder. Yes will certain cards sell for more over another sure that's the hobby. Will some things in PSA get more due to registry no doubt. In the end if you're buying nice examples of cards in any grade that tick all the boxes (centering, color, register) in either SGC or PSA you will be fine.

[Vintagecatcher]

Has anyone here forgot how PSA launched their brand with the T206 Wagner...strict grades...what BS!

Patrick

[SMPEP]

Sorry Peter, I have to say BS that PSA is stricter. Here's a PSA 7 (HA!) 1952 Billy Martin for you. Who gives a rat's @$$ if the corners are sharp. You can barely make him out because of the OBVIOUS registration errors. (And for the t206 freak collectors - no, this doesn't make this card more vluable - there are TONS of cards like this troughout this set. Dozens are on Ebay right now.)

Heck, even the centering isn't great.

That card grade is garbage.

PSA should be embarassed.

Cheers,
Patrick Prickett (in case I need my full nae on this one)

[1880nonsports]

you were joking right???? Countless examples of inept grading for all the companies - see the last Heritage auction with PSA 7's that have front and back paper loss.
The major TPG's do a decent job with regard to authenticity and more easily discernable faults. You're not submitting to some kind of crime lab - for the ten bucks no-one is taking out the micrometer or neutron scale. ANYONE can render an opinion about a "grade". Such grades really only matter in terms of commerce - buying and selling the commodity.
Historically PSA cards have been shown to bring higher prices on many issues. They were first, better advertised, and developed the wildly successful registry. With the passage of time SGC has taken over the larger share of the more niche-like 19th century market and made inroads in the "T" card market. I think they do a better job, the holders look nicer, they offer excellent customer service. That said - it's a personal preference thing - you align yourself with the company whose condition/grade parameters feel "right".

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by 1880nonsports

you were joking right???? Countless examples of inept grading for all the companies - see the last Heritage auction with PSA 7's that have front and back paper loss.
The major TPG's do a decent job with regard to authenticity and more easily discernable faults. You're not submitting to some kind of crime lab - for the ten bucks no-one is taking out the micrometer or neutron scale. ANYONE can render an opinion about a "grade". Such grades really only matter in terms of commerce - buying and selling the commodity.
Historically PSA cards have been shown to bring higher prices on many issues. They were first, better advertised, and developed the wildly successful registry. With the passage of time SGC has taken over the larger share of the more niche-like 19th century market and made inroads in the "T" card market. I think they do a better job, the holders look nicer, they offer excellent customer service. That said - it's a personal preference thing - you align yourself with the company whose condition/grade parameters feel "right".

right heres another 'sgc is better for prewar' it is what it is....PSA sells for more than SGC on a large scale.....theres always bad examples for each in terms of why a grade was given.....you can buy sgc cards cheaper for the same grade as psa.... which is fine for the people who want cards cheaper and who believe the card looks the same as the psa counterpart.....really no problem there....just don't expect to get the same money back as the psa counterpart ..it can happen from time to time of course..

[Peter_Spaeth]

I am not joking at all. Ask people who submit regularly (that is, people not getting favors or to put it more charitably benefits of the doubt, and I am sure there are some of those) and they will tell you that these days -- which is all I said in my post -- PSA is very strict with grades. I have seen numerous examples of this.

My observation is not at all contradicted by the fact that in its 24 year history PSA has overgraded many cards or graded many altered cards. Of course they have.

I have no doubt that if you took a cross section of mid to high grade cards with no paper loss or wrinkles, and had someone unknown to either company submit them, the PSA batch would grade lower in the aggregate. That is not a criticism of SGC, just an observation that the grading standards are not the same these days.

And putting up a single example of an overgraded PSA card to prove your point is really not a very good argument. I am talking about overall, in the aggregate, etc.

[rocarroll]

I don't know why PSA's sell for more, probably a "self fulfilling prophecy" because people think they are worth more and should sell for more so they pay more for no other reason than that. It's certainly not for PSA's beautiful holders in comparison to SGC

I keep hearing about PSA being stricter in their grading. I disagree on that, at least in the low to mid grade cards say grades 2-6. SGC has been crazy picky on some of the cards that I have had graded and when it comes to any type of paper loss I've found them to be much harder on that than PSA. I've submitted to both many times and have had many more comparison cards. Depending on the issue(s) that a card may have that usually determines where I send it (that and whether or SGC has a good monthly special ) If the card has a small amount of paper loss I can be certain that SGC is going to grade that 1.5 or maybe 2. I can usually get a 3 out PSA all other things being equal.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by rocarroll

I don't know why PSA's sell for more, probably a "self fulfilling prophecy" because people think they are worth more and should sell for more so they pay more for no other reason than that. It's certainly not for PSA's beautiful holders in comparison to SGC

I keep hearing about PSA being stricter in their grading. I disagree on that, at least in the low to mid grade cards say grades 2-6. SGC has been crazy picky on some of the cards that I have had graded and when it comes to any type of paper loss I've found them to be much harder on that than PSA. I've submitted to both many times and have had many more comparison cards. Depending on the issue(s) that a card may have that usually determines where I send it (that and whether or SGC has a good monthly special ) If the card has a small amount of paper loss I can be certain that SGC is going to grade that 1.5 or maybe 2. I can usually get a 3 out PSA all other things being equal.

Fair point. I was not really talking about low grade cards with wrinkles or paper loss, but mid to high grade cards where the grade is going to depend on centering and corners.

[rocarroll]

Originally Posted by rocarroll

I don't know why PSA's sell for more, probably a "self fulfilling prophecy" because people think they are worth more and should sell for more so they pay more for no other reason than that. It's certainly not for PSA's beautiful holders in comparison to SGC

I keep hearing about PSA being stricter in their grading. I disagree on that, at least in the low to mid grade cards say grades 2-6. SGC has been crazy picky on some of the cards that I have had graded and when it comes to any type of paper loss I've found them to be much harder on that than PSA. I've submitted to both many times and have had many more comparison cards. Depending on the issue(s) that a card may have that usually determines where I send it (that and whether or SGC has a good monthly special ) If the card has a small amount of paper loss I can be certain that SGC is going to grade that 1.5 or maybe 2. I can usually get a 3 out PSA all other things being equal.

Piggy backing on what I said earlier about it being a "self fulfilling prophecy" I really do think it is a heard mentality. People think PSA is better cause that's what other people are telling them. Its almost like certain auctions that take place and their stuff sells for more just because they are selling it. Have you ever noticed when PWCC has an auction on EBAY their cards sell for about 30%or more than they would if I were selling them. I looked at that previous auction that closed recently and compared it to almost identically graded cards selling at the same time by individual buyers and they were going for way more. Tolstoi PSA 3's by an individual selling for in the $80s PWCC going for $110-120. In short its a reputation that has no real gold backing the currency so to speak. People just think its better.

If an industry wide rumor started next week that SGC was better within a month you would see the pricing reverse.