1952 Rosen Mantle SGC 9.5 Final Price � Too high, too low, just right?

Exhibitman · #1 08-29-2022, 10:33 AM

It's the highest price ever paid for a card, so I don't have a criticism of the price; how could I?

Is $75,000 for a PSA 1 a good price now???

Johnny630 · #2 08-29-2022, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exhibitman

it's the highest price ever paid for a card, so i don't have a criticism of the price; how could i?

Is $75,000 for a psa 1 a good price now???

hell to the no it's not !!!

jchcollins · #3 08-29-2022, 10:39 AM

Agreed, every time the "highest price ever paid for a sportscard" gets upped, it's hard to assert that whatever it is necessarily should have gone for more...

I think the goal of the person who consigned it was to just get over $10M. I would agree it was probably overgraded a tad due to the provenance, but that was still cool to see, especially the Rosen letter from 1991.

If Marshall Fogel ever parts with his PSA 10 Mantle, (he's said he will be buried with it...) I would expect that to go for considerably more.

It would be interesting to see if Ken K. ever sells the Gretzky Wagner, how that would do in comparison to this most recent '52 Mick. I think many collectors who have been around for more than 5 minutes still likely consider that the most valuable card in existence - whether it's trimmed or not.

Peter_Spaeth · #4 08-29-2022, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

It's the highest price ever paid for a card, so I don't have a criticism of the price; how could I?

Is $75,000 for a PSA 1 a good price now???

Not clear to me if this has a gravitational pull on other 311s or it's just its own thing, what do people think?

Johnny630 · #5 08-29-2022, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peter_spaeth

not clear to me if this has a gravitational pull on other 311s or it's just its own thing, what do people think?

fomo

Leon · #6 08-29-2022, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny630

fomo

I am neutral on the prices on the lower end going up much, very quickly, due to this sale.
They have elevated a lot, quickly and recently. But who knows? It wouldn't surprise me if I am wrong. fomo is real LOL
.

Exhibitman · #7 08-29-2022, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leon

fomo is real LOL

Rare Stuff · #8 08-29-2022, 11:13 AM

https://youtu.be/qBXSUVWY1Ug

Here is a close look video I took of the Rosen 52 Mantle at The National.

BeanTown · #9 08-29-2022, 11:19 AM

It�s amazing the trust people put into TPG. I would be curious, as to who submitted the card for grading. Special people get special treatment like in all industries. I know most on this forum still look at the card, but there is a growing number of people who just care about the grade. Long live the registry!

Peter_Spaeth · #10 08-29-2022, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeanTown

It’s amazing the trust people put into TPG. I would be curious, as to who submitted the card for grading. Special people get special treatment like in all industries. I know most on this forum still look at the card, but there is a growing number of people who just care about the grade. Long live the registry!

Heritage, presumably. Does anyone at Heritage have any connection to SGC?

Snowman · #11 08-30-2022, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Heritage, presumably. Does anyone at Heritage have any connection to SGC?

Not sure if you were joking or not, but Derek Grady works for Heritage, and he is the one who had to decide where to send the Mantle for grading (on the seller's behalf). He used to be the head grader at SGC for some number of years. He also knew PSA wouldn't give it a 10, and he didn't want it in a PSA 9 holder because he thought it was nicer than all the PSA 9s and two of the 10s.

jchcollins · #12 08-29-2022, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeanTown

It�s amazing the trust people put into TPG.

Yes it is. Especially given how both PSA and SGC are absolutely all over the place right now with virtually every other type of vintage card. Within the past 2 years I've had the same nice '65 Mantle grade both a 5, and then an 6.5 with SGC. I've also seen slabs where noob graders who were not taught how to compute centering ratios properly gave some cards 5's based on centering that really should have been closer to 7's. Grading has always been a crapshoot, but I feel like it's worse right now than it has been in some time.

Peter_Spaeth · #13 08-29-2022, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny630

fomo

Well, low and midgrade ones come up often enough in auctions, we'll know soon.

G1911 · #14 08-29-2022, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

It's the highest price ever paid for a card, so I don't have a criticism of the price; how could I?

Is $75,000 for a PSA 1 a good price now???

Judging by the 9 different PSA 1 52 Mantles on eBay priced lower than this and not selling, it is nowhere near $75K.

Lorewalker · #15 08-29-2022, 11:49 AM

I have no idea if the price is right but it was another great shot in the arm to that segment of the hobby and for SGC. I think it could cause more collectors to buy a 52 who did not already own one and it might bring newer more affluent individuals to jump into the hobby. So it could have an impact on demand, short term.

My hope is that all centered PSA 4.5s will increase in value. If not certain people's Sundays will be at risk.

BeanTown · #16 08-29-2022, 11:51 AM

Now, I’m not a Topps expert and I have never collected the 52 set. I know the Mantle is a “short print” but correct me if I’m wrong…. Didn’t they make 2 print runs or was it 3? How many Mantles are out there which are ungraded and graded.

rats60 · #17 08-29-2022, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeanTown

Now, I�m not a Topps expert and I have never collected the 52 set. I know the Mantle is a �short print� but correct me if I�m wrong�. Didn�t they make 2 print runs or was it 3? How many Mantles are out there which are ungraded and graded.

It is in the high series, the 1952 Topps high series is the shortest print run of any Topps series. Within that series it was printed twice on the sheet, along with Robinson and Thompson. So those 3 have double the population of other 1952 high numbers, but less than any other Topps cards.

53toppscollector · #18 08-29-2022, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeanTown

Now, I�m not a Topps expert and I have never collected the 52 set. I know the Mantle is a �short print� but correct me if I�m wrong�. Didn�t they make 2 print runs or was it 3? How many Mantles are out there which are ungraded and graded.

SGC has graded 590 Mantles, but only 3 copies at a 9 or higher (2 are 9s, and this 9.5) and PSA has graded 1,496 Mantles, which includes 8 9s (2 with qualifiers) and 3 10s.

So the total population is 2,086 graded between those 2 (plus however many Beckett has graded, though I wonder how many are still in Beckett slabs that haven't been crossed over) with (3) 10s (1) 9.5, (8) 9s, and (2) 9 qualifiers

SGC has graded only (6) at a 8 or 8.5, and PSA (35) 8s, (5) 8.5s, and (8) 8 Qualifiers.

So, its not a rare card, but its rare in high grade. Most of the other cards in the set have been graded 400-500 times by PSA and less than 100 times by SGC.

1952boyntoncollector · #19 08-29-2022, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 53toppscollector

SGC has graded 590 Mantles, but only 3 copies at a 9 or higher (2 are 9s, and this 9.5) and PSA has graded 1,496 Mantles, which includes 8 9s (2 with qualifiers) and 3 10s.

So the total population is 2,086 graded between those 2 (plus however many Beckett has graded, though I wonder how many are still in Beckett slabs that haven't been crossed over) with (3) 10s (1) 9.5, (8) 9s, and (2) 9 qualifiers

SGC has graded only (6) at a 8 or 8.5, and PSA (35) 8s, (5) 8.5s, and (8) 8 Qualifiers.

So, its not a rare card, but its rare in high grade. Most of the other cards in the set have been graded 400-500 times by PSA and less than 100 times by SGC.

also its supply and demand of course..not just about POP when comparing 2 different players in same set of course.....there can be 800 x more mantles in the 1952 set and they would still be worth more than the common cards that have 800 less in POP

chriskim · #20 08-29-2022, 12:15 PM

Waiting on Rob Gough to announce his new addition of the Mantle 9.5. Since he started the whole thing of setting the "finish line" of this 9.5 at $10Mil and he better finish it with the card.

Ricky · #21 08-29-2022, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 53toppscollector

SGC has graded 590 Mantles, but only 3 copies at a 9 or higher (2 are 9s, and this 9.5) and PSA has graded 1,496 Mantles, which includes 8 9s (2 with qualifiers) and 3 10s.

So the total population is 2,086 graded between those 2 (plus however many Beckett has graded, though I wonder how many are still in Beckett slabs that haven't been crossed over) with (3) 10s (1) 9.5, (8) 9s, and (2) 9 qualifiers

SGC has graded only (6) at a 8 or 8.5, and PSA (35) 8s, (5) 8.5s, and (8) 8 Qualifiers.

So, its not a rare card, but its rare in high grade. Most of the other cards in the set have been graded 400-500 times by PSA and less than 100 times by SGC.

So maybe this has been discussed, but with all the hype about how this is the finest 52 Mantle, how does this 9.5 compare with the three PSA 10�s?

Peter_Spaeth · #22 08-29-2022, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ricky

So maybe this has been discussed, but with all the hype about how this is the finest 52 Mantle, how does this 9.5 compare with the three PSA 10�s?

This was discussed at great length in another recent thread.

MattyC · #23 08-29-2022, 03:54 PM

Anyone who thinks this card went low is nuts. 12.6 million dollars is an enormous amount of money.

The card was gorgeous, also.

As to that 7.5, it was tilted as shit for that kind of cash.

And as to PSA 1s, I paid 60k for a particular PSA 1 recently� and I'd do it again and again.

Ricky · #24 08-29-2022, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

This was discussed at great length in another recent thread.

Can you point me to the thread?

darwinbulldog · #25 08-29-2022, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G1911

Judging by the 9 different PSA 1 52 Mantles on eBay priced lower than this and not selling, it is nowhere near $75K.

Phew. I sold mine for about $2500 back in 2005.

G1911 · #26 08-29-2022, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog

Phew. I sold mine for about $2500 back in 2005.

I was going to offer you $2,600!

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