NL wild card

[BobbyStrawberry]

Well, this is the Mets-iest start ever to the playoffs...

[Peter_Spaeth]

Scherzer has been sharper.

[BobbyStrawberry]

That's for sure!

[JollyElm]

Right now, the Mets Playoff game on ESPN2 is being pre-empted by the American Cornhole League. What the hell universe am I in??????????

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Scherzer has been sharper.

In the post game he said his fastball wasn't riding, instead it was sinking and he can't figure out why. NOT GOOD.

However, the man, myth, legend, Jeff McNeil spurred the onslaught in game 2 and now we have game 3 tonight.

LGM!!!

[BobbyStrawberry]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

In the post game he said his fastball wasn't riding, instead it was sinking and he can't figure out why. NOT GOOD.

However, the man, myth, legend, Jeff McNeil spurred the onslaught in game 2 and now we have game 3 tonight.

LGM!!!

And Lindor owes him a new car, apparently... How are you feeling about Bassitt tonight??

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by BobbyStrawberry

And Lindor owes him a new car, apparently... How are you feeling about Bassitt tonight??

Bassitt makes me NERVOUS. I've activated my Mookie shrine though lol

[BobbyStrawberry]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

Bassitt makes me NERVOUS. I've activated my Mookie shrine though lol

Ooh nice! We need all the good vibes today.

[mrreality68]

Have faith.

As long as Lindor and/or Alfanso are on their game we should be good.

But San Diego has Machado and Soto so it should be interesting

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by JollyElm

Right now, the Mets Playoff game on ESPN2 is being pre-empted by the American Cornhole League. What the hell universe am I in??????????

That may be the greatest line I've ever heard!!!!

hahahahahahaahaahahahaahahahaaa

[mrreality68]

Perhaps they moved the game to ESPN Ocho right after the dodgeball finals

[Shoeless Moe]

I honestly was watching Dodgeball recently, odd that you say that. I just needed to see someone drilled in the head.

[BobbyStrawberry]

As a Mets fan, the way this game's going I might put the cornhole on any minute now...

[Casey2296]

Originally Posted by BobbyStrawberry

As a Mets fan, the way this game's going I might put the cornhole on any minute now...

Check your ears for pine tar first...

[ledsters]

Musgrove is kicking their ass so they go to the let’s check the pitcher….so desperate!

Go Padres!!!!

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by ledsters

Musgrove is kicking their ass so they go to the let’s check the pitcher….so desperate!

Go Padres!!!!

Ugly game for the Mets terrible pitching and they forgot how to hit.

Sad ending

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by ledsters

Musgrove is kicking their ass so they go to the let’s check the pitcher….so desperate!

Go Padres!!!!

I was actually wondering when they were going to check him, those ears looked covered in something. McCutchen tweeted that it was red hot/icy hot to hype him up I guess. Weird.

[BobbyStrawberry]

Originally Posted by mrreality68

Ugly game for the Mets terrible pitching and they forgot how to hit.

Sad ending

+1

[1952boyntoncollector]

at least it was a 3 game series..much better than the 1 and done series..

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

at least it was a 3 game series..much better than the 1 and done series..

Agreed but you would have thought with Degrpm and Shretzer the results would have been different

Not the year they expected

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by mrreality68

Agreed but you would have thought with Degrpm and Shretzer the results would have been different

Not the year they expected

not like the Padres starters werent any good..

still whats the use of spending a ton of money on a SP if cant pitch 7 innings of 3 run or less ball, maybe even 2 runs or less.

Randy and Schilling were a heck of a 1/2 though.

[Shoeless Moe]

Highest payroll team out, you gotta love that!

Now can the 3rd lowest payroll team knock out the other NY team.

Let's go Cleveland!!!!!!

[mrreality68]

Hopefully San Diego and Atlanta gets knocked out so Robinson Cano does not earn a World Series Ring

[packs]

Why would you want your team to have a low payroll? I'll never understand the haters and small market fans. Your owner can spend the same amount of money as every other owner but chooses not to because they don't care about your team.

How can that be a rallying cry for anyone?

[gonefishin]

Let's Go Padres! Wow - they set a record last night by only allowing 1 hit in a close out game in the play offs.

I would like for all the Mets fans to jump on the bandwagon now and support the Padres please. You can jump off right after they win game 7 of the World Series. Maybe it will be a rematch with the Yankees? Then Boone can check strategy with Buck since they're both in New York. You know, maybe get some tips on when to do an ear check to throw off the pitcher. It's all about strategy at this point, but I didn't see the ear check coming. Classy move for a losing team.

Tip - I did watch Ha Song Kim pull up his pants after sliding into second. Maybe Buck should have asked them to have Kim pull down his pants for a check. That way, Buck could kiss his ass after making a fool of himself.

Go Padres!

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by gonefishin

Let's Go Padres! Wow - they set a record last night by only allowing 1 hit in a close out game in the play offs.

I would like for all the Mets fans to jump on the bandwagon now and support the Padres please. You can jump off right after they win game 7 of the World Series. Maybe it will be a rematch with the Yankees? Then Boone can check strategy with Buck since they're both in New York. You know, maybe get some tips on when to do an ear check to throw off the pitcher. It's all about strategy at this point, but I didn't see the ear check coming. Classy move for a losing team.

Tip - I did watch Ha Song Kim pull up his pants after sliding into second. Maybe Buck should have asked them to have Kim pull down his pants for a check. That way, Buck could kiss his ass after making a fool of himself.

Go Padres!

Go padres as well

[BobC]

Originally Posted by packs

Why would you want your team to have a low payroll? I'll never understand the haters and small market fans. Your owner can spend the same amount of money as every other owner but chooses not to because they don't care about your team.

How can that be a rallying cry for anyone?

I don't think they really can all spend the same amount. Unlike the NFL, which I believe handles all the TV contracts and deals for the entire league, and then shares the money among all the teams, MLB teams I believe are much more on their own when it comes to TV and contracts. It was Steinbrenner who I believe was the first to really make a big difference when he started putting the Yankees games on their own cable network. Big market teams get bigger paydays because advertisers pay more to advertise in larger markets.

Now of course the owners of smaller market teams could, if they're rich enough, just spend tons of their own money to try and compete more easily against the big market teams, and simply have their franchises operate at a loss every year. But then don't forget, MLB teams are, and always have been, businesses first. And even very rich small market team owners likely can't afford to just keep funding losing businesses year after year after year.

[packs]

Originally Posted by BobC

I don't think they really can all spend the same amount. Unlike the NFL, which I believe handles all the TV contracts and deals for the entire league, and then shares the money among all the teams, MLB teams I believe are much more on their own when it comes to TV and contracts. It was Steinbrenner who I believe was the first to really make a big difference when he started putting the Yankees games on their own cable network. Big market teams get bigger paydays because advertisers pay more to advertise in larger markets.

Now of course the owners of smaller market teams could, if they're rich enough, just spend tons of their own money to try and compete more easily against the big market teams, and simply have their franchises operate at a loss every year. But then don't forget, MLB teams are, and always have been, businesses first. And even very rich small market team owners likely can't afford to just keep funding losing businesses year after year after year.

Sorry, I don't believe that. Everyone knows a winning product is a valuable product. If an owner wanted to maximize profit they would build a winning team. It worked for the Patriots. It can work for any losing franchise.

But absent owners don't do that because they don't care about the team. They care about maximum profits on minimum budgets and that means operating as cheaply as possible and not really caring about a championship. Look at the Pirates. They've had grievances filed against them twice for not spending their revenue share money on their team. Every team also made 100 million dollars in TV contracts before even selling a ticket this year.

How a fan of a small market team can be both satisfied and wear that as a badge of honor is not something I'll ever understand.

[KCRfan1]

I agree PACKS.

A winning team is great for the bottom line.

This is accomplished via FA, assuming the right player / players are available and a fit for the team. In baseball, is the player a fit for the stadium? The player also has to want to play for the team. When Pete Rose became a FA from the Reds, KC made a generous offer and I believe the highest offer. And Pete signed with Philly.

A more cost effective way to build the team is via the draft. If a team has high picks, they cannot whiff those picks. KC cannot develop a pitcher to save their life. Yet they have high pitching draft picks and they are getting rocked in the minors. Perhaps they were poor selections, but it continues to be an issue regardless. This is not lost on those pitchers who have seen former KC arms go elsewhere and experience much better success.

So a combination of smart FA signings with players who want to play for the team AND being able to develop players are essential.

Pro franchises are very valuable. I am surprised that more owners aren't involved or current on the state of that asset.

[packs]

It's about WANTING to win. There is no way you'll ever convince me the owner of the Pirates wants to win. How could you? But then if by some miracle the Pirates do find themselves in a World Series, all of their fans will want to pat themselves on the back for backing the small guy.

But you aren't backing the small guy. You're backing the guy who could care less.

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by packs

Why would you want your team to have a low payroll? I'll never understand the haters and small market fans. Your owner can spend the same amount of money as every other owner but chooses not to because they don't care about your team.

How can that be a rallying cry for anyone?

See the problem with New Yorkers, such as yourself, is you were spoiled all those years when New York spent more than anyone and bought several WS. Now that the playing field has been closed, you can't win.

Gonna be fun watching Francona pitch around Judge and letting that cast of misfits try to win.

If the Indians don't bounce the Yankees you can bet your ass the Astros will. How bad are Yankee fans rooting for Seattle, you know you are admit it. It's alright to be scared of the Astros, you should be!

[packs]

[QUOTE=Shoeless Moe;2272155]See the problem with New Yorkers, such as yourself, is you were spoiled all those years when New York spent more than anyone and bought several WS. Now that the playing field has been closed, you can't win.

Gonna be fun watching Francona pitch around Judge and letting that cast of misfits try to win.

If the Indians don't bounce the Yankees you can bet your ass the Astros will. How bad are Yankee fans rooting for Seattle, you know you are admit it. It's alright to be scared of the Astros, you should be![/]

The Yankees Core Four teams were made up of the Core Four, players drafted by the Yankees and developed by the Yankees. Bernie Williams played his entire career with the Yankees. They were further strengthened by great trades that didn't cost any money. If you forgot, Paul O'Neill came to the Yankees by way of Roberto Kelly. The Yankees traded two minor leaguers and Marty Janzen for David Cone. Tino Martinez? Traded to the Yankees for Russ Davis and Sterling Hitchcock. Joe Girardi? Even he was traded to the Yankees for Mike DeJean. Knoblauch? Traded to the Yankees. Tim Raines? Traded to the Yankees.

In fact, thinking back on those teams the two biggest free agent signings I remember everyone making a big deal about were Hidecki Irabu (4 years / 12.8 million) and Orlando Hernandez (four years / 6 million dollars).

[KCRfan1]

I LOVED George Steinbrenner.

The man was passionate about winning and a great evaluator of talent in players that others overlooked.

Nettles taylor made for Yankee Stadium. Chambliss just consistently good, never a league leader, but a LEADER on the team. Rivers, again made for the massive OF in Yankee Stadium and the need for speed to cover ground. Pesky table setter at the plate for the rest of the team. Piniella, another professional bat in the lineup or off the bench.

This is sorely missing now, the ability to evaluate talent and intrinsic value to the team. It's not all about the big names but how the pieces of the puzzle fit together.

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by packs

The Yankees Core Four teams were made up of the Core Four, players drafted by the Yankees and developed by the Yankees. Bernie Williams played his entire career with the Yankees. They were further strengthened by great trades that didn't cost any money. If you forgot, Paul O'Neill came to the Yankees by way of Roberto Kelly. The Yankees traded two minor leaguers and Marty Janzen for David Cone. Tino Martinez? Traded to the Yankees for Russ Davis and Sterling Hitchcock. Joe Girardi? Even he was traded to the Yankees for Mike DeJean. Knoblauch? Traded to the Yankees. Tim Raines? Traded to the Yankees.

In fact, thinking back on those teams the two biggest free agent signings I remember everyone making a big deal about were Hidecki Irabu (4 years / 12.8 million) and Orlando Hernandez (four years / 6 million dollars).

Let's just see about that, from 1996 to 2009 they won 5 WS, and were THEE TOP PAYROLL 4 of those 5, and 2nd once. This is out of 30 each year mind you and were almost always double the payroll of more than half the teams of any given season.

[Shoeless Moe]

I also find it interesting that Yankee Fans, several on here, say Judge is the new single season MLB HR champ.

Refuse to acknowledge the real single season champ, Bonds.

Yet Yankee fans sure arn't giving back any of their WS trophies, yet their teams were littered with Steroid guys like Arod, Clemens, Pettitte, Knoblauch, Giambi, etc etc.

Nice double standard Yankee fans.

Such morons.

[packs]

The trades happened and the players who were the core on those teams were home grown players. Payroll does not dispute that.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by packs

Sorry, I don't believe that. Everyone knows a winning product is a valuable product. If an owner wanted to maximize profit they would build a winning team. It worked for the Patriots. It can work for any losing franchise.

But absent owners don't do that because they don't care about the team. They care about maximum profits on minimum budgets and that means operating as cheaply as possible and not really caring about a championship. Look at the Pirates. They've had grievances filed against them twice for not spending their revenue share money on their team. Every team also made 100 million dollars in TV contracts before even selling a ticket this year.

How a fan of a small market team can be both satisfied and wear that as a badge of honor is not something I'll ever understand.

Don't entirely disagree, but have you ever been involved with a sale of a business, any business? If a small market team owner generates losses from the business year after year, even if the result is a winning team, those recurring losses will normally drive the business' value down, not up. Do you know what EBITDA is and how most businesses are valued and sold using some multiple of that factor?

Also, I fully realize there is a revenue sharing aspect when it comes to TV/cable revenue, like with the MLB network. But there are also then local broadcast rights, and an even bigger exception to that revenue sharing concept as I understand it if the baseball team itself also owns a share/interest in the TV/cable network that handles a team's local broadcasting. For example, my understanding is the Red Sox own something like 80% of the company they have contracted with to provide local broadcasts of their games. So, if after receiving and accounting for the normal revenue they got for their local broadcast rights, let's say the company doing the broadcasting ended up making $100M for the year. That means the Red Sox have an additional $80M of revenue that doesn't get counted towards any revenue sharing, that they can potentially spend on players.

You are correct though in that ALL baseball teams are businesses, and the only thing that ALL of them have in common is that ALL any of the owners possibly truly care about is making money, first and foremost. The fact is that some teams, mostly all from the bigger market teams, end up getting so much more revenue than their smaller market brethren that those big market team owners can almost indiscriminately spend as much as they want to lure away the top talent in free agency. Those big market team owners don't really care so much about the fans either. They know they can outspend the other team owners, thereby having the winning bragging rights they can then lord over the other owners, AND still make a sh@tload of money doing it. And don't kid yourself, the bigger market team owners do want to win to not necessarily make the fans happy, but likely more so to keep the viewing numbers up so they can show those figures to advertisers, and charge them even more money.

[packs]

Let’s be real. We’re not talking about a general store and we’re not talking about an owner just trying to keep the lights on. Every team has billions of dollars behind it. But not every owner wants to win.

[clydepepper]

Meanwhile, the Braves keep locking up their talent long-term...Strider today...

I don't know why they haven't gotten Dansby signed...starting to worry.

He's been Mr. Clutch lately.


...oh, I'm sorry...this was the wild card thread...oops. (snicker; chuckle)

.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by packs

Let’s be real. We’re not talking about a general store and we’re not talking about an owner just trying to keep the lights on. Every team has billions of dollars behind it. But not every owner wants to win.

Believe what you like, but when it comes to business, regardless of it being a general store or a baseball team, they do all tend to follow a similar pattern and treatment, whether you can admit that or not.

[packs]

Originally Posted by BobC

Believe what you like, but when it comes to business, regardless of it being a general store or a baseball team, they do all tend to follow a similar pattern and treatment, whether you can admit that or not.

You can see it playing out though. The A’s, Rays, Pirates and Marlins all had grievances filed against them for not reinvesting the revenue sharing money into their team. Those owners don’t want to win. It has nothing to do with market.

The Warriors were a dead franchise going nowhere. They have always played in the Bay Area. The same market as the A’s. Now the Warriors are NBA royalty and Steph Curry is one of the most recognizable faces in the NBA. How did that happen? They started winning in the same market they’ve always been in.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by Shoeless Moe

I also find it interesting that Yankee Fans, several on here, say Judge is the new single season MLB HR champ.

Refuse to acknowledge the real single season champ, Bonds.

Yet Yankee fans sure arn't giving back any of their WS trophies, yet their teams were littered with Steroid guys like Arod, Clemens, Pettitte, Knoblauch, Giambi, etc etc.

Nice double standard Yankee fans.

Such morons.

who would be taking back their WS trophies and what team should they go too. Bonds I agree is the single season champ

[BobC]

Originally Posted by packs

You can see it playing out though. The A’s, Rays, Pirates and Marlins all had grievances filed against them for not reinvesting the revenue sharing money into their team. Those owners don’t want to win. It has nothing to do with market.

The Warriors were a dead franchise going nowhere. They have always played in the Bay Area. The same market as the A’s. Now the Warriors are NBA royalty and Steph Curry is one of the most recognizable faces in the NBA. How did that happen? They started winning in the same market they’ve always been in.

In those cases where teams did not properly spend the money they were supposed to, I can see and agree with you on that. Still we don't really khow what the monies were spent on. Just assuming the owners pocketed it may, or may not, be accurate. It is also possible they were saving up to make offers to free agents that did not get accepted. Or they're pooling and saving the funds to make future offers and deals. Also, I know it isn't looked upon favorably, but occasionally sports teams will tank to get higher draft picks. Doesn't seem to be as prevalent in baseball, but who knows for sure if some team doesn't want to spend the money on better players right now so they can get that higher draft spot.

Truth is, we don't know for sure. There may be some team owners looking just for the cash, but by a team operating to win it usually makes the fans happier and more interested, which usually equates to more tickets sold and more viewers, which then generally equates to more revenue and profit, and ultimately more team value, to the owner. Some team owners may not be too worried and care much about the fans, but the bottom line is they'll usually try to win because it should lead to them making even more money when the fans are happy. So in essence, such owners probably do worry about making the fans happy, just maybe not for the reason(s) we'd like.

[Shoeless Moe]

Also, just look at Judge & DeGrom, both will be free agents.

So technically all 30 teams have a shot at them right?

Wrong.......look at any article out there, or anyone in the know. They will have the top 5 or top 7 landing spots for them.

And it will be the same 5 or 7 teams. Maybe 1 different. You think Judge is signing with the Angels? or the A's? or the Pirates?

Not bloody likely.

Mr. Packs Man you are nutty if you think the playing field is level.

[packs]

The same 5 teams you’re talking about are the teams trying to win. Again I really don’t understand what you’re suggesting when you say you root for a team who doesn’t want to win but are also upset when teams do want to win.

The Yankees have a good team because they want to win. Yankee fans go to the games because the team wins. They have high expectations season in and season out because the team has built a winning culture. Every fan should want to see an owner in the box and have a culture in the stands like ours.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Another thing to support my contention that closers shouldnt be in the HOF except maybe Mariano R is the fact the Dodgers dont even have a designated closer and Kimbrel not on the playoff roster and was terrible this year yet they still won 115 or so games.

good luck winning a championship without 2 good starting pitchers or winning 110 games.......any top number 2 pitcher could put up HOF closer numbers and now you see a closer isnt necessary to be a leading contender to win a World Series or to win 110 games etc....lots of guys can 'close' but there are only so many andy petites in the world and andy not in the HOF....

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by packs

The same 5 teams you’re talking about are the teams trying to win. Again I really don’t understand what you’re suggesting when you say you root for a team who doesn’t want to win but are also upset when teams do want to win.

The Yankees have a good team because they want to win. Yankee fans go to the games because the team wins. They have high expectations season in and season out because the team has built a winning culture. Every fan should want to see an owner in the box and have a culture in the stands like ours.

I have no idea what you are talking about. What teams don't want to win???

Even the Angels, they "want" to win, they just can't.

And I'm not a fan of one team spending 200 million and another team spending 83 million. It gives the one team a huge advantage, and when they spend that much and flop I love it, what's hard to understand about that?

And Yankees fans brag of this core 4, like that is some significant achievement,, many teams have 4-5-6-7-8-9-10 home grown guys on their teams. Core 4, who cares, even proves my point that much more.

You've got the core 4, and the other "bought" 21.

And your shitty management usually gets it wrong.

I find that humorous.....and enjoy when they lose to lesser payroll, better teams.

[Shoeless Moe]

Originally Posted by packs

Every fan should want to see an owner in the box and have a culture in the stands like ours.

And as for culture.......please........they have 1 WS in the past 20 years.

Here's who also have "1" WS win in the past 20 years:

D-Backs
Angels
Marlins
White Sox
Cardinals
Phillies
Royals
Cubs
Astros
Nationals
Braves
Dodgers

2 WS:
Cardinals

3 WS:
Giants

4 WS:
Red Sox

ALL THESE TEAMS HAVE EQUALED NEW YORKS 1 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONSHIP, while half the league has 1 and some 2, some 3, some 4 times to the Yankees 1, and the Yankees have outspent these teams by the BILLIONS!!!!!!

That's some winning culture.

You're living in the past!!!!!!

[packs]

I don’t know how else to break it down for you. Yankee fans expect to win every year because that’s the culture of being a Yankee fan. I highly doubt Nationals fans go into every season with their eye on a title. Why would they? As soon as they did win their owners blew up the team. Why? No hunger for winning.

Ask an Angels fan if they think Artie Moreno wants to win.

[G1911]

Teams that win are teams that want to win and invest into winning.

The teams are not all playing on an even field. The Pirates cannot compete for free agents like the Yankees can, even if they wanted a World Series win with every fiber of their being. It's a hell of a lot easier for the rich teams to lift themselves up than the poor teams.