Some of the mysteries and myths surrounding the most famous card in the hobby.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by G1911

I ain’t no printing expert, but it seems to me that, while certainly not easy to remake the setup, of a period press of the correct type, making printing stones, and sourcing period correct stock and ink (may not need stock even, it is probably possible to remove the ink off a T card), the hundreds of millions of dollars to be gained by counterfeiting Wagner alone would make it a venture worthwhile. Even a single reprinted EX Wagner would net, what, $10,000,000 for the maker? It seems to me inevitable that reprints will improve (almost all of them are easily spotted today) with the absurd amounts of money sitting there to be made. A single strip faked in such a way would provide lifetime wealth for one’s self, children and grandchildren.

Reprints are now and have been undetectable for decades. Seriously people have counterfeited complete historic books that have fooled ALL the experts. When entire books can be counterfeited a beyond simple baseball card has to be like childs play.

But don't worry everyone the cards you collect isn't the typwe of cards anyone would counterfeit or alter.

Here is a thread I posted on counterfeiting. https://net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=289753

[G1911]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Reprints are now and have been undetectable for decades. Seriously people have counterfeited complete historic books that have fooled ALL the experts. When entire books can be counterfeited a beyond simple baseball card has to be like childs play.

But don't worry everyone the cards you collect isn't the typwe of cards anyone would counterfeit or alter.

Here is a thread I posted on counterfeiting. https://net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=289753

I wouldn't be shocked if it has been done, but I have not seen any actual evidence. I prefer to follow the evidence.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by G1911

I wouldn't be shocked if it has been done, but I have not seen any actual evidence. I prefer to follow the evidence.

My post has nothing to do with a specific card. Just showing that it would be beyond easy to do for someone with a little knowledge and willingness to learn.

People always bring up the 52 Mantle and the T206 Wagner and say why don't they make/counterfeit them. For the same reason nobody tries to counterfeit the Mona Lisa.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by bnorth

My post has nothing to do with a specific card. Just showing that it would be beyond easy to do for someone with a little knowledge and willingness to learn.

People always bring up the 52 Mantle and the T206 Wagner and say why don't they make/counterfeit them. For the same reason nobody tries to counterfeit the Mona Lisa.

I am not referring to a specific card either. I've heard many tales of imperceptible fakes of many baseball cards, but nary evidence. Perhaps that evidence is out there, but I have never seen it.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by G1911

I am not referring to a specific card either. I've heard many tales of imperceptible fakes of many baseball cards, but nary evidence. Perhaps that evidence is out there, but I have never seen it.

LOL, If it is undetectable how would you ever see it.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by bnorth

LOL, If it is undetectable how would you ever see it.

LOL, how did they figure out those historic books were actually fakes? Most conspiracies come undone by the tongue.

I know critical reasoning is very unpopular around here, but believing gossip sans evidence is foolish. I believe what evidence suggests. If I see no evidence to support a conclusion, then I do not draw that conclusion. It is not complicated.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by G1911

LOL, how did they figure out those historic books were actually fakes? Most conspiracies come undone by the tongue.

I know critical reasoning is very unpopular around here, but believing gossip sans evidence is foolish. I believe what evidence suggests. If I see no evidence to support a conclusion, then I do not draw that conclusion. It is not complicated.

If you read the entire story on the book in the link the counterfeiter left a tell it was fake so when/if he got caught he would do way less time. Watching the PBS special is highly recommended. I know I really enjoyed it.

[Carter08]

Originally Posted by bnorth

LOL, If it is undetectable how would you ever see it.

Ha

[RCMcKenzie]

Is this the other known Piedmont Wagner? (from t206resource) Does it have a history? Grandpa's Attic, under a doll house, etc? Is the caption darker? maybe not a good scan?

If you found a Van Gogh in the 1980's and wouldn't tell anyone where it came from, would it be old lady gossip to ask questions about authenticity? The burden of proof is not on the skeptics. I don't have a position, I'm just trying to learn.

[Lorewalker]

I am far from an expert on T206s or even the theories or stories behind the provenance on the PSA 8 but has that it could be a "vintage" reprint or an example that was not intended to be placed into packs of cigs, if I have read this correctly, was not one that I had heard.

The being cut twice, once from a strip or sheet and then again by Mastro, years later, was nothing new but not sure I ever read the info that benjulmag shared today. Appreciate this sharing it.

Very interesting developments. Not sure this ever gets any more clear than it is now.

[brass_rat]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Reprints are now and have been undetectable for decades. Seriously people have counterfeited complete historic books that have fooled ALL the experts. When entire books can be counterfeited a beyond simple baseball card has to be like childs play.

But don't worry everyone the cards you collect isn't the typwe of cards anyone would counterfeit or alter.

Here is a thread I posted on counterfeiting. https://net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=289753

Thanks for linking to that. I just watched the PBS special referred to in your post, and I enjoyed it. The video includes a lot more context and information than the short article.

Here’s a direct link to the full episode:
https://www.pbs.org/wnet/secrets/gal...n-i3gwo5/4400/

Steve