Anyone here done business with Chris Long Management?

[mdschulze]

In the last few weeks I've been forced by my wife to clean out the attic and get rid of several items. Instead of throwing them out, I posted a few on Ebay. It didn't take long to see that if I charged a fair amount for shipping, plus Ebay's listing fees, plus Ebay's final value fees, plus Paypal's fees then it was just not worth the headache to package it and drive to the PO to mail it.

What I've done now is start every auction at $.01, but I've set the shipping charges to what I think the item is worth. For instance, I've got a few limited edition prints that were appraised at $1200. I've got the start price at $.01 but shipping set at $799.00. The $.01 start price qualifies for a free listing and if the item sells for $2.00, then my Ebay fees are kept to a minimum. I've had a few Ebayers question the shipping but when I explain, they understand.

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by mdschulze

In the last few weeks I've been forced by my wife to clean out the attic and get rid of several items. Instead of throwing them out, I posted a few on Ebay. It didn't take long to see that if I charged a fair amount for shipping, plus Ebay's listing fees, plus Ebay's final value fees, plus Paypal's fees then it was just not worth the headache to package it and drive to the PO to mail it.

What I've done now is start every auction at $.01, but I've set the shipping charges to what I think the item is worth. For instance, I've got a few limited edition prints that were appraised at $1200. I've got the start price at $.01 but shipping set at $799.00. The $.01 start price qualifies for a free listing and if the item sells for $2.00, then my Ebay fees are kept to a minimum. I've had a few Ebayers question the shipping but when I explain, they understand.

This is against ebay rules...it won't take long before someone will turn you over to ebay for excessive shipping charges. I don't know what ebay does about it though.

[T206Collector]

...really confuses me.

Question for Sellers:
Do you guys honestly just eat ebay/paypal fees, post office/bubble envelope purchase travel and time costs, and charge only what the actual envelope costs with shipping charge? And if so, why would you do that?

Question for Buyers:
Do you guys honestly expect sellers to just eat the ebay/paypal fees, post office/bubble envelope purchase travel and time costs, and charge only what the actual envelope costs with shipping charge? And, if so, why do you think the buyer should not have to bear any of those additional costs?

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

...really confuses me.

Question for Sellers:
Do you guys honestly just eat ebay/paypal fees, post office/bubble envelope purchase travel and time costs, and charge only what the actual envelope costs with shipping charge? And if so, why would you do that?

Question for Buyers:
Do you guys honestly expect sellers to just eat the ebay/paypal fees, post office/bubble envelope purchase travel and time costs, and charge only what the actual envelope costs with shipping charge? And, if so, why do you think the buyer should not have to bear any of those additional costs?

As a seller I try to keep the cost as low as possible and not lose money on shipping...those stars are important because I earn 20% off my final ebay bill if I keep a good rating. As a buyer I always take into account the shipping charges when bidding...if they are unreasonable...and I always determine that when the item arrives as per my example above of $6 to ship an 8x10 photo...which would be okay if it had been protected, but it was just thrown into the envelope with no protection and the mailman bent it putting it into my mailbox which caused a crease.

As a side note it has been noted by a lot of sellers on ebay that if you don't charge anything for shipping you will take a hit on your stars.

[HBroll]

I completely agree with FUBAR that complaining about 4$ for shipping is being petty. Its not like he was charging you $20 to ship the card, it was $4.

You don't know why he was charging $4 anyway. I live out in the country and the closest post office to me is 11 miles away in one direction so thats a 22 mile round trip to ship a card. It roughly cost me $4 just in gas to ship a package (my truck gets 17 MPG). If you count the shipping cost, delivery confirmation and the cost of a bubble mailer and gas, it costs me between $7 or $8 to ship a package. I ususally charge $3.95 for shipping and eat the rest just to get a decent feedback.

What people don't realize is that not everybody is 2 minutes from a post office.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Yeah that bubble wrap really adds up.

[egbeachley]

Originally Posted by HBroll

I live out in the country and the closest post office to me is 11 miles away in one direction so thats a 22 mile round trip to ship a card. It roughly cost me $4 just in gas to ship a package (my truck gets 17 MPG). If you count the shipping cost, delivery confirmation and the cost of a bubble mailer and gas, it costs me between $7 or $8 to ship a package. I ususally charge $3.95 for shipping and eat the rest just to get a decent feedback.

What people don't realize is that not everybody is 2 minutes from a post office.

In the time it takes you to mail your next package you could learn how to size and weigh your packages and calculate your own postage and put the stamps on. Heck, even delivery confirmation can be done at home. Round up to make sure and you still save a ton on gas.

[FrankWakefield]

Well for folks that live 11 miles from a post office, there's a way they can save time and avoid paying for gas...

Someone can put that little red flag up on a mailbox and the carrier will stop. Leave him an envelope with money and he'll leave you an envelope with stamps next time by. Or you can order stamps through the USPS and they'll mail them to someone. Then, someone can put the flag up and they'll pick up the packages that are ready to mail. I think with Priority mail someone can schedule pickups. So a person doesn't have to drive 22 miles round trip while getting 17 MPG, they can choose to do that, or choose to use less gas, save time, and save postage costs.


As for bubble wrap costs, save the packaging when you receive stuff.... I use new envelopes, and use pieces or corners of bubble wrap envelopes that I've received in the mail. Saves money, gets a second use out of that environmentally unfriendly bubble wrap. It's not rocket science.

[LEIDEMEG]

and drop the package off at any mailbox. its very easy. You can print postage right on your printer

George

[HBroll]

I just dont sell cards, I actually sell more memorabilia than cards. Most of the stuff I sell wouldn't fit in my mailbox so I would not be able to leave that little red flag up for the postman. I just sold a Carstairs Ruth cardboard sign (12 x20) what do I do with that? Just leave it on the lawn? Or the 16 x 20 1900's team photo I sold 2 weeks ago? That's a little bit too big for the mailbox too. With the different weights and sizes, its easier to go to the post office unless there is an easier way?

[D. Bergin]

I recently lost my 20% Ebay discount because of anonymous DSR shipping cost scores.

Everything I ship is with Delivery Confirmation in Reinforced Envelopes or Priority Boxes. I use Insurance when I think it's necessary on higher dollar items and cover any possible losses myself if I don't use Insurance.

My shipping charge is clearly stated in every auction and I give deep discounts to multiple auction winners. I would say I lose quite a bit more then I take in every month in Shipping & Handling charges. That's not even taking into consideration that Paypal also takes a little chunk of that shipping charge every time somebody pays you through them.

Doesn't really matter. With Ebay's ingenious system it only takes 1 person out of 100 to decide you purposely ripped them off by charging 50 cents too much for shipping a $10 item...............or somebody else getting pissed because you charged them $12 bucks to ship a group of items that ultimately cost you $20 bucks to ship because they have no idea how much Insurance costs or the fact it cost me twice as much to ship certain Priority packages to California as it does to ship it to the Northeast, since the USPS Zoning rates went into effect.

..........Or somebody leaves a low mark by mistake, or a competitor, or one of your more eccentric customers thinks it would be neat to mark you down here or there...........just because.

Unless you do huge volume it is nearly impossible to overcome a single low score under the present system...........and it's totally anonymous, so you don't even know who to block or avoid.

So forgive me if I'm not entirely sympathetic of post-auction shipping charge negotiations, or even suggestions of I ship this way or that way...........so YOU should also ship this way or that way.................or I don't mind taking a loss, so neither should you.

Also, most International packages, which I send plenty of, need to be dropped off and paid for in person at the Post Office. Also, anything Insured for over $500 also needs to be done at the P.O..

If you are concerned about the sellers shipping practices, a polite request to make sure the item is packed very securely should have done the trick. If he shipped with a 43 cent stamp and no protection to the card............then you can ding him. However to initially request a refund on an already established S&H charge if the stamp on the front didn't exactly match the S&H charge, would have probably annoyed me to no end...............and I am a very patient guy. I most definitely would have responded to your e-mail as politely as possible in return, and you would not have known I was annoyed.........but I most certainly would have been.

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by FrankWakefield

Someone can put that little red flag up on a mailbox and the carrier will stop.

First of all, don't have those in my neighborhood. And even if I did, I would never leave anything of value in a curbside mailbox with a red flag up to alert passersby that something was in their waiting to be stolen.

But, putting aside the mileage costs, do you think the seller in your transaction should be solely responsible for the ebay and paypal fees? And, if so, why?

[teetwoohsix]

I do think some shipping charges seem too high, but if it's clearly stated in the auction or BIN, and you choose to bid on the item or BIN, then there is no reason to be upset, IMO. You chose to participate and hoped to win, knowing what the seller was charging for shipping.

I'm not siding with what the seller charges for shipping, just the fact that you knew what he was charging and still chose to bid.

Clayton

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

First of all, don't have those in my neighborhood. And even if I did, I would never leave anything of value in a curbside mailbox with a red flag up to alert passersby that something was in their waiting to be stolen.

But, putting aside the mileage costs, do you think the seller in your transaction should be solely responsible for the ebay and paypal fees? And, if so, why?

Good point on the red flag. I have pickups at my house occasionally but leave a note in the mailbox for my mail person to come to the front door to pick the boxes up.........and only when I am home already.

As a seller, I see Ebay and Paypal fees as a cost of doing business on my end. I DO get annoyed when I am told I also should be covering more of the general S&H charges myself or somebody e-mails me and tells me that they can ship so and so for a buck..........so I should be able to also.

Overall, my goal is to break even in that area each month........and I usually fail miserably at it.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by mdschulze

In the last few weeks I've been forced by my wife to clean out the attic and get rid of several items. Instead of throwing them out, I posted a few on Ebay. It didn't take long to see that if I charged a fair amount for shipping, plus Ebay's listing fees, plus Ebay's final value fees, plus Paypal's fees then it was just not worth the headache to package it and drive to the PO to mail it.

What I've done now is start every auction at $.01, but I've set the shipping charges to what I think the item is worth. For instance, I've got a few limited edition prints that were appraised at $1200. I've got the start price at $.01 but shipping set at $799.00. The $.01 start price qualifies for a free listing and if the item sells for $2.00, then my Ebay fees are kept to a minimum. I've had a few Ebayers question the shipping but when I explain, they understand.

That seems a bit sleazy to me.

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

That seems a bit sleazy to me.

I'm pretty sure ebay considers it "theft of services."

[Doug]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

I'm pretty sure ebay considers it "theft of services."

I thought eBay had found away around that. I occasionally sell used video games on eBay and they have a $4.00 limit on shipping charges in that category.

[mdschulze]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

That seems a bit sleazy to me.

Sleazy? Really? What's the difference of listing an item's start price at $799 and free shipping, versus listing the start price at $.01 and $799 for shipping? The buyer still pays $799 regardless of the scenario and is not injured at all. The seller saves several bucks and Ebay loses a few.

BTW, I don't regularly sell on Ebay but I did notice several categories where the shipping fees are capped (cd's, books, movies, etc). I've sold about a dozen or so miscellaneous items in categories that aren't capped.

If Ebay wishes to "punish" me for a rule infraction... so be it! Half the crap I'm selling/sold is under $50 and it's stuff that would have been thrown out or donated anyway. Ebay has access to my Paypal account so I guess if they really wanted to, they can go in and recover a few bucks or whatever they think I owe!

[botn]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

That seems a bit sleazy to me.

Really? In a hobby in which virtually everyday someone lowers the standards just a tad more? I would reserve the word sleazy for other charming elements in the hobby.

eBay has turned their site upside down for sellers. Only place where the seller assumes the entire burden and cost of selling an item. The seller gets charged for selling the item and as well as charged for accepting payment. Shipping has to be kept extremely low, if not free, in order to avoid backlash from a buyer. Those costs cannot be recouped. On top of a typical buyer's premium of 17.5%, private auction houses charge outrageous amounts for shipping and virtually none of them have to accept a form of payment which costs them anything to process.

[Leon]

I just factor in shipping costs into the price I am bidding/paying. If they are way, way out of line then I might say something or ding the seller. There is no reason for them to charge WAY more and try to recoup their fees in the shipping....even if they stated it. That being said I can't remember ever dinging anyone. I am just stating an opinion. I don't sell on ebay anymore for a variety of reasons and one of the main ones being the egregious fees they charge (including forcing an online payment, knowing they will get an extra 3% by doing so). regards

btw, I think the worst change of all has been not allowing sellers to leave feedback

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by botn

Really? In a hobby in which virtually everyday someone lowers the standards just a tad more? I would reserve the word sleazy for other charming elements in the hobby.

eBay has turned their site upside down for sellers. Only place where the seller assumes the entire burden and cost of selling an item. The seller gets charged for selling the item and as well as charged for accepting payment. Shipping has to be kept extremely low, if not free, in order to avoid backlash from a buyer. Those costs cannot be recouped. On top of a typical buyer's premium of 17.5%, private auction houses charge outrageous amounts for shipping and virtually none of them have to accept a form of payment which costs them anything to process.

OK not sleazy but still it seems to me that if you are going to use someone's service, i.e. ebay, you should play by the rules and not try to cheat them out of their fees. Easy for me to say I suppose as I don't sell much.

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It seems to me that if you are going to use someone's service, i.e. ebay, you should play by the rules and not try to cheat them out of their fees.

I would agree with that. But if ebay is going to get a huge slice of the pie, I see no reason why the seller must eat the entire cost of that slice and cannot pass -- up front and prior to accepting bids -- some of that cost to the ultimate buyer.

[alanu]

My biggest problem with ebay shipping feedback are the choices:

Very reasonable = 5 stars
Reasonable = 4 stars

That makes me think if actual cost is charged then you give 4 stars and only give 5 stars if you get a discount. Shouldn't actual cost deserve 5 stars?

In order to maintain certain seller privledges, including discounted seller fees, you must keep all ratings above 4.5.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by alanu

My biggest problem with ebay shipping feedback are the choices:

Very reasonable = 5 stars
Reasonable = 4 stars

That makes me think if actual cost is charged then you give 4 stars and only give 5 stars if you get a discount. Shouldn't actual cost deserve 5 stars?

In order to maintain certain seller privledges, including discounted seller fees, you must keep all ratings above 4.5.

Actually in the Ebay universe it goes something like this:

5 stars = Good
4 stars = Very Bad
3 stars = Very, very bad
2 stars = Incredibly, viciously bad
1 star = You should probably spend some time in prison, and think about what you did.

Somehow I accumulated several 1 or 2 star scores on my Shipping cost DSR's, despite an overall average of 4.9 in that category and lost my Ebay seller discount.

I have no idea which items I scored low on, who left the low scores, and have no idea how to make it right, since the people who left those scores never made their dissatisfaction with my shipping charges known to me.

[mdschulze]

I'll be the "Lost Soul" on this one... call me a crooked snake in the grass but if I have an item for sale that's worth about $10, I want to pocket as much as I can towards the actual price without feeling sore in my lower region the next morning. I have no problem with being charged a flat-rate insertion fee by Ebay... it's the Final Value fee that I find insulting.

Ebay buyers are looking for a deal, as am I when I make a bid. Say for instance you are selling a $10 DVD. You know it's worth $10, the buyer knows it's worth $10 so you list it for $10 and it doesn't sell because the seller has to tack on $3 for shipping. So you relist it for $7 w/$3 shipping. Now it sells for $7.01 (+ $3 shipping) because it's the same price as one can buy it from the local Best Buy. The seller is now out $3, plus Ebay fees, plus a little extra for delivery confirmation, plus PayPal fees. Now the item you knew was worth $10 is now worth about $5.50... give or take. It's a bad deal for the seller and the same deal the buyer would get at Best Buy. If I have the option to use a little Vasoline and reverse shipping costs with the listing price... I'll do it until Ebay snuffs me out! Call me crooked!

[alanu]

Originally Posted by mdschulze

The seller is now out $3, plus Ebay fees, plus a little extra for delivery confirmation, plus PayPal fees. Now the item you knew was worth $10 is now worth about $5.50... give or take. It's a bad deal for the seller and the same deal the buyer would get at Best Buy. If I have the option to use a little Vasoline and reverse shipping costs with the listing price... I'll do it until Ebay snuffs me out! Call me crooked!

Most of the problem in that case seems to be that your DVD starts out being worth only $7 since you have to ship it in any case.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by mdschulze

I'll be the "Lost Soul" on this one... call me a crooked snake in the grass but if I have an item for sale that's worth about $10, I want to pocket as much as I can towards the actual price without feeling sore in my lower region the next morning. I have no problem with being charged a flat-rate insertion fee by Ebay... it's the Final Value fee that I find insulting.

Ebay buyers are looking for a deal, as am I when I make a bid. Say for instance you are selling a $10 DVD. You know it's worth $10, the buyer knows it's worth $10 so you list it for $10 and it doesn't sell because the seller has to tack on $3 for shipping. So you relist it for $7 w/$3 shipping. Now it sells for $7.01 (+ $3 shipping) because it's the same price as one can buy it from the local Best Buy. The seller is now out $3, plus Ebay fees, plus a little extra for delivery confirmation, plus PayPal fees. Now the item you knew was worth $10 is now worth about $5.50... give or take. It's a bad deal for the seller and the same deal the buyer would get at Best Buy. If I have the option to use a little Vasoline and reverse shipping costs with the listing price... I'll do it until Ebay snuffs me out! Call me crooked!

It really doesn't matter what you feel, in your head or your groin. When you opened an Ebay account, you agreed to abide by their rules and regulations. Period.

Clearly, shifting the revenue dollars from the "Sales" column (where you pay a % to Ebay) to the "Shipping" column (where you pay no % to Ebay), is an attempt to cheat Ebay out out their fees. There is no other way to look at it. Any honest person would see it that way. Ebay will see it that way. A judge or jury would see it that way.

Coming on a public message board and admitting that you go out of your way to cheat someone (in this case, Ebay) out of what's due them is very telling. Your exact words were: "The seller saves several bucks and Ebay loses a few." Unless Ebay was a party to this agreement to "lose a few bucks," you are stealing from them.

Since you admit to being a crooked seller, would you mind telling us your Ebay ID?


Edited to add: I don't really think for a second that you are a crooked seller. I just think you haven't thought this through completely.

[Bilko G]

Originally Posted by mdschulze

In the last few weeks I've been forced by my wife to clean out the attic and get rid of several items. Instead of throwing them out, I posted a few on Ebay. It didn't take long to see that if I charged a fair amount for shipping, plus Ebay's listing fees, plus Ebay's final value fees, plus Paypal's fees then it was just not worth the headache to package it and drive to the PO to mail it.

What I've done now is start every auction at $.01, but I've set the shipping charges to what I think the item is worth. For instance, I've got a few limited edition prints that were appraised at $1200. I've got the start price at $.01 but shipping set at $799.00. The $.01 start price qualifies for a free listing and if the item sells for $2.00, then my Ebay fees are kept to a minimum. I've had a few Ebayers question the shipping but when I explain, they understand.

wow..... just wow. Your auctions wont last long.

[DaveW]

Just to get the thread back on topic - I also won 3 of his raw T206s last month. He charged me $6 for shipping. I paid and the cards came and were much better than I had expected. I don't care what it really cost him to ship the cards - he stated clearly in the auction that shipping was $4 for the auction, and I was happy that he combined shipping on 3 cards and charged only $6. They were packaged pretty well so I had no problem with the transaction. When I bid, I had accounted for the $4 in the final price so I was happy with the final price also. If I was willing to pay $20 for a card and shipping was $2, I would bid $18.
If shipping was $10, then I would only bid $10. What difference does it make to me?