Anyone here done business with Chris Long Management?

[botn]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

That seems a bit sleazy to me.

Really? In a hobby in which virtually everyday someone lowers the standards just a tad more? I would reserve the word sleazy for other charming elements in the hobby.

eBay has turned their site upside down for sellers. Only place where the seller assumes the entire burden and cost of selling an item. The seller gets charged for selling the item and as well as charged for accepting payment. Shipping has to be kept extremely low, if not free, in order to avoid backlash from a buyer. Those costs cannot be recouped. On top of a typical buyer's premium of 17.5%, private auction houses charge outrageous amounts for shipping and virtually none of them have to accept a form of payment which costs them anything to process.

[Leon]

I just factor in shipping costs into the price I am bidding/paying. If they are way, way out of line then I might say something or ding the seller. There is no reason for them to charge WAY more and try to recoup their fees in the shipping....even if they stated it. That being said I can't remember ever dinging anyone. I am just stating an opinion. I don't sell on ebay anymore for a variety of reasons and one of the main ones being the egregious fees they charge (including forcing an online payment, knowing they will get an extra 3% by doing so). regards

btw, I think the worst change of all has been not allowing sellers to leave feedback

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by botn

Really? In a hobby in which virtually everyday someone lowers the standards just a tad more? I would reserve the word sleazy for other charming elements in the hobby.

eBay has turned their site upside down for sellers. Only place where the seller assumes the entire burden and cost of selling an item. The seller gets charged for selling the item and as well as charged for accepting payment. Shipping has to be kept extremely low, if not free, in order to avoid backlash from a buyer. Those costs cannot be recouped. On top of a typical buyer's premium of 17.5%, private auction houses charge outrageous amounts for shipping and virtually none of them have to accept a form of payment which costs them anything to process.

OK not sleazy but still it seems to me that if you are going to use someone's service, i.e. ebay, you should play by the rules and not try to cheat them out of their fees. Easy for me to say I suppose as I don't sell much.

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It seems to me that if you are going to use someone's service, i.e. ebay, you should play by the rules and not try to cheat them out of their fees.

I would agree with that. But if ebay is going to get a huge slice of the pie, I see no reason why the seller must eat the entire cost of that slice and cannot pass -- up front and prior to accepting bids -- some of that cost to the ultimate buyer.

[alanu]

My biggest problem with ebay shipping feedback are the choices:

Very reasonable = 5 stars
Reasonable = 4 stars

That makes me think if actual cost is charged then you give 4 stars and only give 5 stars if you get a discount. Shouldn't actual cost deserve 5 stars?

In order to maintain certain seller privledges, including discounted seller fees, you must keep all ratings above 4.5.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by alanu

My biggest problem with ebay shipping feedback are the choices:

Very reasonable = 5 stars
Reasonable = 4 stars

That makes me think if actual cost is charged then you give 4 stars and only give 5 stars if you get a discount. Shouldn't actual cost deserve 5 stars?

In order to maintain certain seller privledges, including discounted seller fees, you must keep all ratings above 4.5.

Actually in the Ebay universe it goes something like this:

5 stars = Good
4 stars = Very Bad
3 stars = Very, very bad
2 stars = Incredibly, viciously bad
1 star = You should probably spend some time in prison, and think about what you did.

Somehow I accumulated several 1 or 2 star scores on my Shipping cost DSR's, despite an overall average of 4.9 in that category and lost my Ebay seller discount.

I have no idea which items I scored low on, who left the low scores, and have no idea how to make it right, since the people who left those scores never made their dissatisfaction with my shipping charges known to me.

[bobbyw8469]

It was probably your competitors trying to drive you off Ebay.

[mdschulze]

I'll be the "Lost Soul" on this one... call me a crooked snake in the grass but if I have an item for sale that's worth about $10, I want to pocket as much as I can towards the actual price without feeling sore in my lower region the next morning. I have no problem with being charged a flat-rate insertion fee by Ebay... it's the Final Value fee that I find insulting.

Ebay buyers are looking for a deal, as am I when I make a bid. Say for instance you are selling a $10 DVD. You know it's worth $10, the buyer knows it's worth $10 so you list it for $10 and it doesn't sell because the seller has to tack on $3 for shipping. So you relist it for $7 w/$3 shipping. Now it sells for $7.01 (+ $3 shipping) because it's the same price as one can buy it from the local Best Buy. The seller is now out $3, plus Ebay fees, plus a little extra for delivery confirmation, plus PayPal fees. Now the item you knew was worth $10 is now worth about $5.50... give or take. It's a bad deal for the seller and the same deal the buyer would get at Best Buy. If I have the option to use a little Vasoline and reverse shipping costs with the listing price... I'll do it until Ebay snuffs me out! Call me crooked!

[alanu]

Originally Posted by mdschulze

The seller is now out $3, plus Ebay fees, plus a little extra for delivery confirmation, plus PayPal fees. Now the item you knew was worth $10 is now worth about $5.50... give or take. It's a bad deal for the seller and the same deal the buyer would get at Best Buy. If I have the option to use a little Vasoline and reverse shipping costs with the listing price... I'll do it until Ebay snuffs me out! Call me crooked!

Most of the problem in that case seems to be that your DVD starts out being worth only $7 since you have to ship it in any case.

[mdschulze]

Originally Posted by alanu

Most of the problem in that case seems to be that your DVD starts out being worth only $7 since you have to ship it in any case.

That's correct. If the item for sale is a known price (like a DVD), the seller has to reduce the price to include shipping for the item to move; Otherwise the buyer won't touch it for $13 if he can get it for $10 at Best Buy.... that doesn't mean the item is now worth $7 (only in Ebay land). Now the seller has already paid the insertion fee, now they pay a final value fee (I believe 9%), plus extra $.80 for delivery confirmation & then Paypal fees. By the time the meat is picked off the bone... it's really not worth selling on Ebay (like Leon mentioned earlier). That's why I don't have a moral issue with listing the item for a penny with a higher shipping cost to minimize Ebay's fees. Ebay hits an item twice with fees (before and after a sale) and passes them along to the Seller. The Buyer pays the same costs regardless of how it's listed, the Seller pockets more and Ebay takes less from the Final Value Fee.

I'm just now seeing this first-hand from a Seller's perspective since I just started selling some extra items I had in storage. It's probably better in the long run, in my case, to have a garage sale or just donate it for a very small tax credit.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by mdschulze

I'll be the "Lost Soul" on this one... call me a crooked snake in the grass but if I have an item for sale that's worth about $10, I want to pocket as much as I can towards the actual price without feeling sore in my lower region the next morning. I have no problem with being charged a flat-rate insertion fee by Ebay... it's the Final Value fee that I find insulting.

Ebay buyers are looking for a deal, as am I when I make a bid. Say for instance you are selling a $10 DVD. You know it's worth $10, the buyer knows it's worth $10 so you list it for $10 and it doesn't sell because the seller has to tack on $3 for shipping. So you relist it for $7 w/$3 shipping. Now it sells for $7.01 (+ $3 shipping) because it's the same price as one can buy it from the local Best Buy. The seller is now out $3, plus Ebay fees, plus a little extra for delivery confirmation, plus PayPal fees. Now the item you knew was worth $10 is now worth about $5.50... give or take. It's a bad deal for the seller and the same deal the buyer would get at Best Buy. If I have the option to use a little Vasoline and reverse shipping costs with the listing price... I'll do it until Ebay snuffs me out! Call me crooked!

It really doesn't matter what you feel, in your head or your groin. When you opened an Ebay account, you agreed to abide by their rules and regulations. Period.

Clearly, shifting the revenue dollars from the "Sales" column (where you pay a % to Ebay) to the "Shipping" column (where you pay no % to Ebay), is an attempt to cheat Ebay out out their fees. There is no other way to look at it. Any honest person would see it that way. Ebay will see it that way. A judge or jury would see it that way.

Coming on a public message board and admitting that you go out of your way to cheat someone (in this case, Ebay) out of what's due them is very telling. Your exact words were: "The seller saves several bucks and Ebay loses a few." Unless Ebay was a party to this agreement to "lose a few bucks," you are stealing from them.

Since you admit to being a crooked seller, would you mind telling us your Ebay ID?


Edited to add: I don't really think for a second that you are a crooked seller. I just think you haven't thought this through completely.

[mdschulze]

Originally Posted by Jim VB

It really doesn't matter what you feel, in your head or your groin. When you opened an Ebay account, you agreed to abide by their rules and regulations. Period.

Clearly, shifting the revenue dollars from the "Sales" column (where you pay a % to Ebay) to the "Shipping" column (where you pay no % to Ebay), is an attempt to cheat Ebay out out their fees. There is no other way to look at it. Any honest person would see it that way. Ebay will see it that way. A judge or jury would see it that way.

Coming on a public message board and admitting that you go out of your way to cheat someone (in this case, Ebay) out of what's due them is very telling. Your exact words were: "The seller saves several bucks and Ebay loses a few." Unless Ebay was a party to this agreement to "lose a few bucks," you are stealing from them.

Since you admit to being a crooked seller, would you mind telling us your Ebay ID?


Edited to add: I don't really think for a second that you are a crooked seller. I just think you haven't thought this through completely.

I hear what you are saying. I've actually had potential buyers ask why shipping was high and I answered the question and posted it (just like on this forum) for everyone to see... including Ebay.

My Ebay ID is mds0319. If Ebay chooses to shut me down... Oh well! It's not like I make a living from selling crap out of my attic.... (I'll run out eventually)! Hell, if Ebay wants... they can come over and take the rest of the crap out and keep it as a replacement value for the fees they were shorted on by my sales.... it must be up to at least $4.00 now!!

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by Jim VB

Since you admit to being a crooked seller, would you mind telling us your Ebay ID? Edited to add: I don't really think for a second that you are a crooked seller. I just think you haven't thought this through completely.

You would agree that the buyer is not being screwed here, right? And that the only entity that loses in this transaction is ebay, right?

If anything, that might make someone a crooked user of ebay, but it doesn't make them a crooked seller. I hardly think it's my business as a buyer to assess whether the seller is improperly working around ebay's ever-changing rules and escalating fees.

Unless you own stock in ebay or are otherwise dependent upon the health of ebay for your hobby or business, I do not fully appreciate the perspective that defends ebay's rules and rights to its fees.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

You would agree that the buyer is not being screwed here, right? And that the only entity that loses in this transaction is ebay, right?

If anything, that might make someone a crooked user of ebay, but it doesn't make them a crooked seller. I hardly think it's my business as a buyer to assess whether the seller is improperly working around ebay's ever-changing rules and escalating fees.

Unless you own stock in ebay or are otherwise dependent upon the health of ebay for your hobby or business, I do not fully appreciate the perspective that defends ebay's rules and rights to its fees.

Cheating is cheating in my book. Doesn't matter to me if it's a person or a company being cheated.

And, it really doesn't matter if you "appreciate the perspective" or not. If you use their system, you have agreed to abide by their rules. If you don't like them, then use another conduit for sales.

It could not be any clearer to me.

It's funny, Paul, for most issues in life (politics, the economy, religion, etc.) I have noticed that most people have been sucked into a "left or right," "black or white," vortex, and I always tend to see things as very middle of the road and/or gray.

This isn't one of those issues.