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  #1  
Old 04-08-2021, 07:07 PM
ASF123 ASF123 is offline
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Default eBay offer etiquette

So, we all know that many eBay listings have cards at sky-high BIN prices "or best offer." My question is, how high does the list price have to be for you to not bother making an offer? If you think a reasonable price would be, say, 70% of the listed price, would you offer that? 50%?

What about if it's not a BIN price, but a high starting bid "or best offer"? How far above the opening bid would your price need to be to make an offer? Or would you offer less than the opening bid if you thought that was a fair price? Those listings confuse me.

Last edited by ASF123; 04-08-2021 at 07:07 PM.
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  #2  
Old 04-08-2021, 07:09 PM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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I have a dealer over worked w for years. Love the guy. He told me to take 15% off. The thing? I got charged the shipping which came out to the cost of the cards. Anyway. I’ll have to be more specific next time
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  #3  
Old 04-08-2021, 07:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASF123 View Post
So, we all know that many eBay listings have cards at sky-high BIN prices "or best offer." My question is, how high does the list price have to be for you to not bother making an offer? If you think a reasonable price would be, say, 70% of the listed price, would you offer that? 50%?

What about if it's not a BIN price, but a high starting bid "or best offer"? How far above the opening bid would your price need to be to make an offer? Or would you offer less than the opening bid if you thought that was a fair price? Those listings confuse me.
To me, the sellers asking price is irrelevant, I offer what I think is a fair price. If its accepted, great. If not, I move on.
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Old 04-08-2021, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Jim65 View Post
To me, the sellers asking price is irrelevant, I offer what I think is a fair price. If its accepted, great. If not, I move on.
^This^ most of the time. I have been known to pay a little extra for something I really want.

I also regularly send offers to sellers without a best offer option. Sometimes it works like on a bat I got today and sometimes it doesn't.

Had one of those great guys recently. Has had a card so overpriced it has been on eBay for a year and is still overpriced. Sent them an offer I thought was more than fair so they doubled the BIN price.
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  #5  
Old 04-08-2021, 08:36 PM
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Be fair to yourself and fair to the seller, learn what long tome overpricers with good cards will accept. Quote recent auction prices and make your case. Research the card and figure out what they paid for it and allow them a margin. Try to get them off eBay so you both can save $$. Establish a human relationship, overpay once in awhile and let the Seller know you're doing it for the relationship. Be willing to walk away short term on long time listings. Be the Trout (those who fish know this reference)

Always be respectful and require respect back.
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  #6  
Old 04-09-2021, 09:05 AM
hcv123 hcv123 is offline
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Default Mostly agree with earlier response

If I am interested and it has a BIN that I believe to be out of line, I make my offer and back it up with facts (recently sold comps for example). If I can't back it up with something, then I usually don't bother sending. Some guys don't care, others are willing to negotiate. In terms of offer amount - usually if it's that far out of line, I'll throw my best offer out off the bat and be willing to walk if it's not good enough. On something that's closer I will go below my best offer to leave room for the negotiation.
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I have cards for sale here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/185900663@N07/albums

I am actively buying vintage sports cards graded and raw, singles and sets and also open to trading. I love the odd and obscure – food issues, test issues, etc. Some feedback as a buyer: https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=297262
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  #7  
Old 04-09-2021, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casey2296 View Post
Quote recent auction prices and make your case.
One of the 'fine print' terms in my listings:

" I am well aware of what the market is for most anything I sell; trying to "educate" me on pricing is not a negotiation tool, it is just being a tool. And will be mocked mercilessly on hobby chat boards."

I don't need someone telling me what my item should sell for. It presumes that I am interested in selling it at some other price. Quite often, that is not the case.
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  #8  
Old 04-09-2021, 01:32 PM
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I usually offer what I would consider a "good deal" for me, and go from there.
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  #9  
Old 04-09-2021, 02:14 PM
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Interestingly, this week I put two items into my watch list, mostly to consider if I really wanted them.

The prices (magnitude) were not significant enough for me to be bothered with haggling, I just wanted to wait and decide if I really wanted them.

Shorty thereafter I received offers from the seller on both of them at 50% of their BIN price!
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  #10  
Old 04-09-2021, 02:17 PM
esehombre esehombre is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exhibitman View Post
One of the 'fine print' terms in my listings:

" I am well aware of what the market is for most anything I sell; trying to "educate" me on pricing is not a negotiation tool, it is just being a tool. And will be mocked mercilessly on hobby chat boards."

I don't need someone telling me what my item should sell for. It presumes that I am interested in selling it at some other price. Quite often, that is not the case.
My thoughts exactly--those types of responses come off to me at best arrogant. If you can find it at that price, go get it! They get ignored or blocked.
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  #11  
Old 04-09-2021, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exhibitman View Post
One of the 'fine print' terms in my listings:

" I am well aware of what the market is for most anything I sell; trying to "educate" me on pricing is not a negotiation tool, it is just being a tool. And will be mocked mercilessly on hobby chat boards."

I don't need someone telling me what my item should sell for. It presumes that I am interested in selling it at some other price. Quite often, that is not the case.
I'm not talking about educating anybody or telling them what their item should sell for, I'm talking about supporting the reason for my offer, which is what OP's question was. You can set your price and refuse to budge, that's your prerogative. There are a lot of sellers that throw way above market prices out there for any number of reasons, arrogance, ego, greater fool, or just to show off their collection. Doesn't matter to me as a buyer. If we can come to terms we come to terms if not no harm no foul.
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  #12  
Old 04-09-2021, 03:39 PM
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I find a lot of enjoyment offering 10-20% for 52T Jackie cards listed for ridiculous prices. If a seller is putting some desperate price on a listing, there is not etiquette.

Last edited by bks14sr; 04-09-2021 at 03:40 PM.
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  #13  
Old 04-09-2021, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exhibitman View Post
One of the 'fine print' terms in my listings:

" I am well aware of what the market is for most anything I sell; trying to "educate" me on pricing is not a negotiation tool, it is just being a tool. And will be mocked mercilessly on hobby chat boards."

I don't need someone telling me what my item should sell for. It presumes that I am interested in selling it at some other price. Quite often, that is not the case.
Quote:
Originally Posted by esehombre View Post
My thoughts exactly--those types of responses come off to me at best arrogant. If you can find it at that price, go get it! They get ignored or blocked.
A huge +1 to this. I don't mind a offer but telling me what it is worth and why with details will definitely get someone added to my ignore list.
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  #14  
Old 04-09-2021, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casey2296 View Post
I'm not talking about educating anybody or telling them what their item should sell for, I'm talking about supporting the reason for my offer, which is what OP's question was. You can set your price and refuse to budge, that's your prerogative. There are a lot of sellers that throw way above market prices out there for any number of reasons, arrogance, ego, greater fool, or just to show off their collection. Doesn't matter to me as a buyer. If we can come to terms we come to terms if not no harm no foul.
The only reason for supporting your offer with evidence is to try and convince the seller to accept your analysis and give you the item at your price. There is no other reason to do it; to me it is the equivalent of arguing balls and strikes. It is especially annoying when I get one of these emails via eBay because I have already stated that I am not interested: in effect the wannbe buyer either didn't bother to read the listing or decided to ignore what I said.
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Last edited by Exhibitman; 04-09-2021 at 09:24 PM.
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  #15  
Old 04-10-2021, 04:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exhibitman View Post
One of the 'fine print' terms in my listings:

" I am well aware of what the market is for most anything I sell; trying to "educate" me on pricing is not a negotiation tool, it is just being a tool. And will be mocked mercilessly on hobby chat boards."

I don't need someone telling me what my item should sell for. It presumes that I am interested in selling it at some other price. Quite often, that is not the case.
I hate the "I'll offer you $100 because there are 3 others on Ebay at that price"
Really? Why waste time haggling with me then?
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  #16  
Old 04-10-2021, 05:28 AM
ClementeFanOh ClementeFanOh is offline
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Default ebay offer etiquette?

The different perspectives between the commenters who sell a lot on ebay,
and those who buy, is profound. I am a 21+ year ebay member (perfect
feedback, almost all as a buyer) who has tired of ebay and most often won't
buy there anymore. A few observations/ pointers from my experience:

1) There is nothing wrong with contacting a person with a card and
making an offer that reflects fair market value, especially when there's a
Make Offer option. I typically don't inundate the seller with sales data unless
they open the door with their own commentary ( "It's a fair price"..."I see
great potential for this card increasing value"... or my personal favorite "I
paid too much for this card and can't go lower"). Sellers who insist that their
$200 card is magically worth $400, despite overwhelming evidence to the
contrary, deserve at least a "scared straight" tour of card collecting hell

2) Someone was throwing around the term "tool" in reference to buyers.
Here are some indicators from a buyer's view, that the seller may be a
"tool":

a) endlessly cycling the same card at the same price for YEARS, without
changing the price (hint- your price is too high)

b) enabling Make an Offer, then automatically rejecting any offer made

c) behaving like ebay owns your cards, rather than you. The amount of
sellers who won't discuss sales outside of ebay- even after the auction
ENDS without a bid!- is astounding. Ebay is a clown show in most cases,
and the desire to transact on venues like net54 instead is a wise one. I
suppose the best way to say this is, 2 party sales are preferable to ones
involving a third party.

In the end, I think sellers would do well to recognize that potential
buyers are a wee bit important in this equation- especially when the seller
has been a buyer himself time and time again. There is nothing wrong
with wanting fair treatment from the seller when you are buying (ie,
accurate shipping costs, clear communication, and realistic price tags).
After all, it's what sellers expect when the shoe is on the other foot.

Trent King
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  #17  
Old 04-10-2021, 05:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exhibitman View Post
One of the 'fine print' terms in my listings:

" I am well aware of what the market is for most anything I sell; trying to "educate" me on pricing is not a negotiation tool, it is just being a tool. And will be mocked mercilessly on hobby chat boards."

I don't need someone telling me what my item should sell for. It presumes that I am interested in selling it at some other price. Quite often, that is not the case.
While I understand where you're coming from...like others, I would prefer to explain the logic of how I came up with a price in my offer. That's especially true if my offer is a lot lower than the asking price. Not trying to "educate" anyone....just explaining my logic as the basis for a negotiation.

Sometimes this goes down well...other times I'm met with a rude response - which really isn't necessary.

I've seen so many cases of a seller flipping an item that they just bought in another auction. If they're adding 10-15%, I get it. But more often than not they stick a BIN at double the price. I mean, really? an auction just finished and determined the value was X and then seller decides to chance his luck at twice that.

Fair enough if that's what they want to do...but there's no reason to be nasty about it.
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  #18  
Old 04-10-2021, 08:11 AM
hcv123 hcv123 is offline
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Default VERY well said Trent

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh View Post
The different perspectives between the commenters who sell a lot on ebay,
and those who buy, is profound. I am a 21+ year ebay member (perfect
feedback, almost all as a buyer) who has tired of ebay and most often won't
buy there anymore. A few observations/ pointers from my experience:

1) There is nothing wrong with contacting a person with a card and
making an offer that reflects fair market value, especially when there's a
Make Offer option. I typically don't inundate the seller with sales data unless
they open the door with their own commentary ( "It's a fair price"..."I see
great potential for this card increasing value"... or my personal favorite "I
paid too much for this card and can't go lower"). Sellers who insist that their
$200 card is magically worth $400, despite overwhelming evidence to the
contrary, deserve at least a "scared straight" tour of card collecting hell

2) Someone was throwing around the term "tool" in reference to buyers.
Here are some indicators from a buyer's view, that the seller may be a
"tool":

a) endlessly cycling the same card at the same price for YEARS, without
changing the price (hint- your price is too high)

b) enabling Make an Offer, then automatically rejecting any offer made

c) behaving like ebay owns your cards, rather than you. The amount of
sellers who won't discuss sales outside of ebay- even after the auction
ENDS without a bid!- is astounding. Ebay is a clown show in most cases,
and the desire to transact on venues like net54 instead is a wise one. I
suppose the best way to say this is, 2 party sales are preferable to ones
involving a third party.

In the end, I think sellers would do well to recognize that potential
buyers are a wee bit important in this equation- especially when the seller
has been a buyer himself time and time again. There is nothing wrong
with wanting fair treatment from the seller when you are buying (ie,
accurate shipping costs, clear communication, and realistic price tags).
After all, it's what sellers expect when the shoe is on the other foot.

Trent King
I have done thousands of transactions on and off Ebay over 30 years as both buyer and seller. I think a really great point you brought up is the use of the "make an offer" option. If a seller uses that, they are inviting an offer. If they don't want an offer - pretty simple - don't use the option. At best I would send a note asking if there is any "room" in an asking price to the seller of a listing with no "make an offer" option.

As a seller, I usually use the "make an offer" option. I often receive offers that I see as ridiculously low and simply decline them. I've also started to use the "automatically decline offers below....." option.

One thing I have learned is the market is a very inefficient place - a single sale at a particular price is not always a good or fair indicator of "market value". For more regularly traded issues with multiple recent sales all in a similar price window - that is what I would call support for a particular price point and that too not without exception.
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I have cards for sale here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/185900663@N07/albums

I am actively buying vintage sports cards graded and raw, singles and sets and also open to trading. I love the odd and obscure – food issues, test issues, etc. Some feedback as a buyer: https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=297262
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  #19  
Old 04-10-2021, 09:48 AM
jayshum jayshum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh View Post
b) enabling Make an Offer, then automatically rejecting any offer made
I think it has been mentioned on other threads that eBay will sometimes add the Make An Offer option to listings that have been up for a while without the seller knowing that it happens. If that is true then that could be a reason why all offers are rejected.
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Old 04-10-2021, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh View Post

c) behaving like ebay owns your cards, rather than you. The amount of
sellers who won't discuss sales outside of ebay- even after the auction
ENDS without a bid!- is astounding.
Its against Ebay rules to takes sales off Ebay and your account can be suspended. A 30 day suspension could be devastating to some sellers so its not worth the risk.
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  #21  
Old 04-10-2021, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayshum View Post
I think it has been mentioned on other threads that eBay will sometimes add the Make An Offer option to listings that have been up for a while without the seller knowing that it happens. If that is true then that could be a reason why all offers are rejected.
Ebay will send an email when they do that and it takes 10 seconds to turn offers back off again.
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  #22  
Old 04-10-2021, 10:49 AM
jayshum jayshum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim65 View Post
Ebay will send an email when they do that and it takes 10 seconds to turn offers back off again.
For sellers with a large number of listings, it's probably not worth their time to go and turn them off.
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  #23  
Old 04-11-2021, 07:56 AM
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"2) Someone was throwing around the term "tool" in reference to buyers.
Here are some indicators from a buyer's view, that the seller may be a
"tool":

a) endlessly cycling the same card at the same price for YEARS, without
changing the price (hint- your price is too high)

b) enabling Make an Offer, then automatically rejecting any offer made

c) behaving like ebay owns your cards, rather than you. The amount of
sellers who won't discuss sales outside of ebay- even after the auction
ENDS without a bid!- is astounding. Ebay is a clown show in most cases,
and the desire to transact on venues like net54 instead is a wise one. I
suppose the best way to say this is, 2 party sales are preferable to ones
involving a third party."

Hey, Trent, gotta disagree with you on some of this.

eBay allows an automatic rejection on best offers below a certain level. I use it to weed out lowballers. My main issue with eBay is that the anonymity allows for behavior no one would engage in at a card show. I mean, if you were at the National and you saw a Babe Ruth card for sale for $3000 would you go up to the seller and offer $300? Of course not, you'd be embarrassed to even try it.
Yet that is exactly what I get on eBay all the time. Same with arguing the price. No one at a card show would do that, so why do it on eBay?

As far as taking things off eBay, it could get the seller in trouble, as noted above. The polite way to do this is to contact the seller through N54 rather than through eBay, so that the eBay thought police don't come down on the seller. Demanding an off-eBay transaction through the eBay PM system is inconsiderate to the seller.

i also disagree with the idea that the buyer is more important than the seller. They are equals. I don't need to sell a specific buyer anything and I am tired of buyers acting like they are doing me a favor by making low offers on my inventory, especially in a seller's market like the last year.
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Last edited by Exhibitman; 04-11-2021 at 08:00 AM.
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  #24  
Old 04-11-2021, 08:23 AM
ClementeFanOh ClementeFanOh is offline
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Default ebay offer etiquette?

Adam- you are certainly free to disagree. Out of concern for space, I
abbreviated my remarks just to get the main points across. In answer
to yours:

1) automatic rejections- I have made offers that were a mere 10% lower
than the BIN- say, $360 rather than $400. They have been rejected, so
I messaged the seller and try to discern what they are looking for. Sellers
have directly told me that they reject offers under the BIN. So, why offer?

2) taking things off ebay- I have NEVER asked an ebay seller to end an
auction early. I ask them to contact me when/if the auction ends without a
bid (usually, this is for people whose sale price is far too high). Here's the
important part- when that auction ends, so does ebay's interest. Period.
Despite that reality, some sellers (not all, some) behave like it's heresy to
sell outside ebay. It's as if they've forgotten the main goal- to sell the card!

3) Buyers> sellers all day long. One thing sellers tend to overlook ( to their
favor, of course) is that buyers set card values, NOT sellers. I recall reading
an anecdote that a 1970 price guide listed the T206 Wagner as a $100 card.
Today it's a $1 million dollar card, and it's foolish to say that $1m today is
the equivalent of $100 in 1970. The point is that, if buyers "decide" over
time with their wallets/spending habits that certain cards are more or
less valuable, then sellers can't blindly stick to what they expect, or
demand, or- even worse- think they are entitled to. Getting back in
some way to the original motivation for this topic, I have consistently been
underwhelmed by the subject matter knowledge/hobby interest/ integrity
of an uncomfortable percentage of ebay sellers. Naturally there are some
good ones; however, I find it's better in many ways to fish in better waters
like net54, and establish relationships with folks I like or trust. That way, I
don't have to argue with some random dude who expects me to pay triple
shipping costs on ebay so he can squeeze extra profit- and who takes
offense when I call him on it.

Trent King
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  #25  
Old 04-11-2021, 09:39 AM
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"3) Buyers> sellers all day long. One thing sellers tend to overlook ( to their
favor, of course) is that buyers set card values, NOT sellers."

I disagree. The phrase "seller's market" applies at certain times, like right now, where items in many categories are getting multiple offers and setting new price records. In that circumstance, the seller has the leverage, and proceeding on the premise that the buyer is always the superior party means you won't get the card. The same is true of a rare card: buyers do not set the value, sellers do. I am often approached to sell something I have that is an only known example, one of one, etc. My answer is to set a price and not haggle. if the buyer wants that price, fine, we have a deal. If not, they are free to go find it somewhere else. Which they cannot. 90% of the time I end up getting my price. 50% of the time I am depressed that I sold it, but that is another story altogether.
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Old 04-11-2021, 02:08 PM
hcv123 hcv123 is offline
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Default I agree with BOTH of you!

Just about point 3 - "who is more important" or "sets the price" - This will vary from card to card dictated by the simple economic principles of supply and demand.

When Supply > demand - there is downward pressure on price and buyers are more in the drivers seat. When demand > supply there is upward pressure on price and sellers are more in the drivers seat. With regard to graded cards - it is grade/condition specific, not absolute quantity. So a graded 8 of a particular card could be in limited supply with upward price pressure, while the same card in a graded 5 could have greater supply and downward price pressure assuming demand for both is equal. You can sometimes see this visually in VCP.

A factor that hasn't been mentioned about taking transactions off Ebay is it puts both parties at greater risk. I support transactions on and off the platform (as mentioned can be better for both parties), but wouldn't do it with just any Ebay user.

I agree with Trent on point 1 - absolutely ridiculous for a seller to accept offers if they are unwilling to consider anything less than their BIN.
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Old 04-11-2021, 03:52 PM
ClementeFanOh ClementeFanOh is offline
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Adam- Although I have most frequently bought/traded rather than sold cards, I have
no aversion to selling something when it a) has lost it's meaning in my collection or b)
has dramatically increased in value, thus paving my way to buy other things I want
more. So, I'm not averse to making money. I'm also very, very well aware that there
are many knowledgeable, kind and fair sellers- they get my business, and many use
this site

The reality is this, however. As much as I love cards, no one "needs" a card in the
way they "need" food, shelter, etc. Many sellers, on the other hand, "need" to sell.
Buyers control the purse strings, end of story. This doesn't mean that sellers are
somehow powerless- it merely means card values and sales, like any extravagant
collectible, start with the folks who want them (and who have the final say on whether
they will buy). Some sellers shy away from the reality of this statement, which doesn't
change it's ultimate accuracy. Many sellers are buyers themselves and understand the
reality. The ones who don't, eventually dig holes for themselves by employing pretzel
logic or "entitlement economics" while explaining their sales philosophy (you know, the
guy who buys a card for $1000 and insists he "has to get" $1500 to make it
worthwhile in a sale, or who expects a possible buyer to overpay for a certain card's
"potential", among many examples). I can smell that greed from a mile away, and
there is no clever oratory which will persuade me otherwise. Sadly, I am much more
likely to run into this type of seller on ebay, thus my preference to avoid it if possible.

Trent King
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Old 04-11-2021, 10:45 PM
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Old 04-12-2021, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClementeFanOh View Post

As much as I love cards, no one "needs" a card in the way they "need" food, shelter, etc. Many sellers, on the other hand, "need" to sell. Buyers control the purse strings, end of story. This doesn't mean that sellers are somehow powerless- it merely means card values and sales, like any extravagant collectible, start with the folks who want them (and who have the final say on whether they will buy). Some sellers shy away from the reality of this statement, which doesn't change it's ultimate accuracy. Many sellers are buyers themselves and understand the reality. The ones who don't, eventually dig holes for themselves by employing pretzel logic or "entitlement economics" while explaining their sales philosophy (you know, the guy who buys a card for $1000 and insists he "has to get" $1500 to make it worthwhile in a sale, or who expects a possible buyer to overpay for a certain card's "potential", among many examples). I can smell that greed from a mile away, and there is no clever oratory which will persuade me otherwise. Sadly, I am much more likely to run into this type of seller on ebay, thus my preference to avoid it if possible.

Trent King
That's the first time I've ever been accused of being clever

I don't think we are saying truly different things. To be clear we are focusing on BIN behavior, not auctions. I think we can both agree auctions are the best way to allow a card to price via the market and that people who pester sellers to end active auctions are genuinely annoying and are doing a disservice to everyone. I just ignore those people entirely.

The core is seller "need" versus "want." Some sellers may need to sell to put bread on the table. Other sellers do not. Some seller do not actually want to sell at all. They list cards to avoid having to pay sales taxes on their purchase by classifying the item as inventory (run it once and then you have a record to prove it) or to appease a spouse who tells them they must try to sell (true story: a member here told me that is exactly what he does, which is why his asks are so high--he wants to keep his collection and his wife), so the cards are priced not to sell. I don't need to sell; thankfully, I have a day job that puts bread on the table. I want to sell sometimes to get rid of the weeds in my collection garden or because a card has gone up to a point where I think it makes sense to take a profit or because I was fortunate enough to obtain a collection and i want to turn it out. That last one is where auctions are useful. Post 'em up and let it rip.

i completely agree that no one needs a card, which is why I find it hard to understand a collector getting all bunged up over a seller asking too much for a card. Just move along, there is likely to be another one eventually, and the hunt will probably be more satisfying than the ending:

"After a time, you may find that having is not so pleasing a thing after all as wanting. It is not logical, but it is often true."



What I object to are the bottom-feeders on eBay, who I find far more annoying as the sellers who run card museums on eBay. I forgot to turn on the automatic reject on one of my Best Offer listings over the weekend. I was peppered with offers to buy the card at 10% of the asking price, which was itself set at about 90% of the most recent sales. One person even offered the same 10% offer multiple times. I have since activated the automatic rejection function.

I also have a bone to pick with self-righteous buyers who demand discounts on the equivalent of Babe Ruth and pitch a hissy fit when I say no. If I do not need to move the card, why should I ever discount Babe Ruth? I mean, it's Babe Ruth. He's as safe a long term bet as anything can be. I have never regretted not selling a Babe Ruth card. I have always regretted selling some of them. You want me to deal on Harold Baines, sure, I get that, and I usually start those as auctions with cheap openers but not on the Babe Ruths of the world.
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Old 04-12-2021, 03:24 PM
Brianruns10 Brianruns10 is offline
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When I reach out to make offers on BINs, I will star off by saying something like, "That's a great card, and I hope you get for it what you are asking. But if after a while, you've not yet found a buy, I'd love to offer $XX.XX."

That way you're not implicitly insulting the seller by trying to low ball them, you're wishing them well, and offering an alternative, if they should consider revising their price. I've never had a negative reaction to this, and a few times I've made a deal.
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Old 04-14-2021, 09:09 PM
doug.goodman doug.goodman is offline
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All's fair in love, war, and on ebay.

I make offers for amounts that I consider to be a fair price, with no regard for the asking price. If accepted, great. If countered, maybe. If rejected, no hard feelings. There is always going to be another one.

My offer acceptance is often set to a level that I might be willing to think about, often set to accept any amount, just because it's easy to ignore if I care to, and often I don't even have the offers turned on. It all varies from item to item, and sometimes I change them.

Many of my items might qualify as "museum pieces" since my prices are set on the high end, but in my defense, none of them have anything similar listed on ebay (or often any place on the interwebs).

I buy off ebay frequently.

I sell off ebay even more frequently.

Ebay doesn't care about me, so I spend minimal time caring about ebay.

Doug
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Old 04-14-2021, 09:40 PM
Gorditadogg Gorditadogg is offline
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I have had offers accepted at 50% of the BIN price. Lower than that I've had no luck.

I saw a new listing for a 2005 Topps Big Game /33 Jay-Z yesterday. I have 2 of the 33 already, bought one for $20, another for $40. Seller has it listed for $3,800 obo. I offered $50 and he flat declined! Didn't even counter.

I don't know what to think about someone who puts up a $50-100 card for $3,800. On the one hand you can do what you want, it's America. On the other hand, some of the stuff people do is really annoying.

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Old 04-15-2021, 10:14 AM
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So, follow up on my previous post about the bottom feeders. I had a hot card listed on eBay for sale and someone PMd me to offer me 6% above the opening bid to end the auction early. I said no: I wanted to see where the card would go, but I did add a Best Offer to the listing. It did not sell. I relisted. The guy then offered me my opening price for it when the listing renewed, which was fine, so I added a Best Offer to the listing for him so he could make the offer formally and buy it. My mistake for feeding the troll. Next think I know, he reneges on the offer to buy the card and offers me 5% less than the price he offered the day before. Well I could see where this was going so I pulled the card and relisted it with the following in 24 pt red print:

OK, I am only going to say this once: I've gotten a lot of tire-kickers on this card the two times I've listed it and I've revised the prior listings twice to allow people to make offers that they have then reneged on, which really chaps my hide. So, I've decided to relist the card again and make everything clear to everyone right up front by answering the main questions I have gotten before you ask them again:

--No, I am not interested in any offers below the asking price. Please do not PM me asking for my "best price" or asking for a discount: the answer is "no". I am not interested. If you like the card and think the price is fair then buy it; if you don't like it or think the price is unfair then move along, Shleprock.

--I don't care if you think the card is overgraded, undergraded, or graded just right, Goldilocks. Opinions are like...you know the rest.

--No, I am not going to render a grading opinion on the card for you. I paid CSG to do that and I am not going to substitute my judgment for theirs. If you are grown up enough to buy an expensive card, Richie Rich, then put on the big boy pants and make your own assessment based on the scans I provided. If that does not appeal to you, just move along to the next card.

--No, I do not know what PSA or Beckett will grade it. If you want a PSA or Beckett graded card, then BUY ONE OF THOSE, Scooby Doo.


The card sold in under three hours and not to him. Of course, he emails to ask me what happened to the card, I tell him it sold for more than he offered. Sometimes you gotta lose a card to learn not to be too sharp about your dealings. And I am blocking his ass from my sales. I try to avoid dishonest, manipulative people: life is too short to deal with jackholes.
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Old 04-15-2021, 05:28 PM
mrmopar mrmopar is offline
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I offer what I think is fair and/or reasonable. Don't care what the seller thinks of the offer unless it is accepted.

Most are rejected or auto rejected when they are listed too high in my opinion, but sometimes people accept. I've gone under 50% a number of times when I felt the ask was exceptionally high. Have even had at least 1-2 accepted. Can't win if you don't try.
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Old 04-15-2021, 06:06 PM
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Default offers

I quit "make an offer" on ebay because I got really low offers, like $10 on a $50 dollar card. I price my cards fairly and have no make an offers. I still get emails with offers and if its reasonable I will take it, but again most times its not, so I think them for the offer but tell them I'm not taking offers at this time

The best one is the person that tells me that PSA shows the value of the card as >>>>> PSA should take down the auction values down it is so far behind the market.

Another is when you get a message questioning the price you have placed on a card. I explain to them why based on being only 1 of 2 graded PSA 10, etc.
I usually get a think you.
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Old 04-16-2021, 08:44 AM
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Interesting conversation. On the whole, I hate selling cards - but looking back at my history over the past two years, I've actually done quite a lot of it given the boom, my ability to make profit, and then to turn that profit into more / different cardboard that I still want / "need" for my various collecting endeavors.

I quit selling on eBay probably sometime in early 2019. The numerous hassles there just got quickly outweighed by other venues to sell which had none of the same problems. On eBay you have to deal with their fees; elsewhere such as FB groups and the BST here (an option I will admit I forget about way too often...) you of course don't. eBay also especially in recent years is notorious for standing behind buyers no matter what on disputes and problems, and rarely backing up the seller. The "DND" Deal No Deal format groups on Facebook got a hold of me about a year ago, and I made some strong sales there. The format has its downsides though, and lowball bidders exist there in droves just as they do on eBay. No, I will not take $150 delivered for my EX-MT+ and nicely centered Reggie Jackson RC; thank you for playing. "We don't do eBay prices here, buddy" I was once told by a lowball surfer who apparently expected me to gift a HOF RC to him. Amusing, as my LCS dealer has been known to quip that he "cannot compete" with eBay prices. I guess every type of collector has a perception. But I digress.

As to the offer format on eBay, when I sold there regularly I would set a floor, below which the platform would auto reject offers. When making offers myself, my policy was to offer in combination what I thought was fair with what I could pay, and not to get offended when I was rejected. eBay really pushes the Offer format now; it's a default. So if you don't turn it off, it will be on, and sometimes if your item has not sold for a few days or a week, they will turn it on FOR you without your permission, which to me was super annoying and another reason I grew to hate selling on eBay. The point however is that some sellers who rush through listings don't even KNOW they have offers enabled, and are therefore offended when you send them what they perceive as a lowball offer, even though it may be 85% of their asking price.

The Offer format for buyers can be great if you are patient and don't get offended. Before the real start of the boom, I made what was admittedly a lowball offer for a PSA 8 '65 Topps Richie Allen rookie cup card. The card is a short print in the semi-high number series. To my utter surprise, the seller accepted. He had had the card out there forever, and it was overpriced to begin with, so my assumption was that he was frustrated and washing his hands of it. So that was cool, and then maybe 18 months later I sold the card at close to $200 profit after everyone had been stuck at home in pandemic mode for months and were pouring cash without regard into nice vintage like that.

Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't. At least I'm mostly past my old habit of busting slabbed cards that I was considering PC for life, only to change my mind and sell later at a loss - of course because they were no longer graded.
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Old 04-16-2021, 11:22 AM
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When I make offers I do my research first then offer a good % of what I believe is the FMV of the items, leaving some room for counters. Sometimes you get a weirdly favorable result. I recall one card I saw that had a $2K ask and a history of around $1500-$1800 in sales. I offered $1K assuming we would go a a few rounds and the seller took the first offer. I was very pleasantly surprised.
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Old 04-16-2021, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exhibitman View Post
Sometimes you get a weirdly favorable result.
Yes, sometimes you are calling someone's rather large bluff and don't know it.
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Old 04-16-2021, 01:28 PM
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Last week on ebay..... seller asking $89, offered $40 autodeclined, sent seller email.... offered $65, seller counter at $79, countered back with $65 and explanation of value and this is my max. Seller accepted. 27% reduction on an overpriced listing. Still a little overvalued but I am happy.

Today on ebay..... seller asking $17, offered $7.50, seller countered $14, countered back with $7.50 and explanation of value and this is my max. Seller declined. Seller is so overvalued that they refuse to admit it even though the ad has been running for 4yrs.

Bought another card with nicer signature for $7 less shipped within minutes.
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Old 04-16-2021, 01:40 PM
Frankish Frankish is online now
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I will offer as low as 50% of the BIN price if I want a listed item and think it is overpriced. Usually I shoot for closer to 60%, as it seems to get more interest. Never really offer an explanation or try to argue why the BIN is too high. It's a marketplace, so I figure if someone is open to offer, why not just make my offer and see. At less than 50% of BIN, it just seems the chances of getting a deal done are so low that I'd rather spend my time elsewhere. That said, I hadn't know that ebay automatically added offers even if sellers didn't ask.

Really, I've only started making these lower offers in the last few years. Ebay has changed so much since I started there around 1997 or so....
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Old 04-19-2021, 08:38 AM
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Interesting discussion. Now that ebay has dropped ebay bucks completely, I find myself shopping there less. I was already perturbed when they lowered the percentage. But I digress.

For me, when the listed price is just stupidly above market value, I won't even bother making an offer. Because what's the point? In cases like that, I assume that the seller has no intention of selling unless some clueless buyer comes along and overpays. For all collectables, not just cards, I find that many sellers tend to do this. I think they're trying to influence the market. As in if people see the high asking price, they'll assume the item is worth more than the actual market value and the market for the item will go up. Surely, this has actually happened in some cases.

I generally prefer buying from forums, as it's easier to develop relationships that way. I do find it annoying when guys post ebay prices on forums though. They want to get the full ebay value without paying the fees. It's understandable from their perspecive, but if I'm going to pay ebay prices, I'll do so on ebay or at a brick and mortar shop. That way I'll get some buyer protection/piece of mind.

Also, as has been mentioned somewhat, when I see an item on ebay that I like (generally with pricier items), I often check if the seller sells outside of ebay. Many ebay sellers have online stores that they sell on for a bit cheaper than their Ebay price. And some guys who sell a lot here on net54 do the same thing. Posted on ebay, but also here for a bit cheaper. It's smart to ask the seller or at least check around the net a bit before pulling the trigger on the full ebay price.
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Old 04-19-2021, 04:42 PM
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Sure, I will knock 10% off my eBay price for a buyer here. 13% if the buyer pays via a method that doesn't ding me for a transaction fee. I usually pay the shipping as a courtesy too.
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Old 04-20-2021, 05:52 AM
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Quote:
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Interesting discussion. Now that ebay has dropped ebay bucks completely,
When did this happen? I got a 5% EBucks offer yesterday.
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Old 04-20-2021, 06:23 AM
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When did this happen? I got a 5% EBucks offer yesterday.
They haven't dropped them completely. What they dropped was a certain miniscule percentage on every single thing you buy - which is how collectors like me usually wound up with an extra $20-30 to spend every quarter as kind of a little bonus. But if there are specific promotions that pay bucks, my understanding is that those are still in place. You just have to wait for them and participate in them.
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Old 04-20-2021, 08:33 AM
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Yes, that's what I meant. A few years back, I think it was 3% ebay bucks for each purchase. And then they often had 10% promos that would last a few days. For the last couple years it has been only 1% for each purchase with the occasional 5% promotion. As of April 1 they have dropped the 1%. Apparently they still have occasional 5% promotions though, so that's good to know. I haven't seen one yet, but I haven't checked.
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Old 04-20-2021, 08:47 AM
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They've also closed the door on anyone new signing up for bucks for at least the past several months. They're pretty clearly phasing out the entire thing. Because "Hey, less for you, more for us!!"

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Old 04-20-2021, 10:18 AM
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With the frenzied activity of the last 12 months it is apparent that they don't need general incentive programs to drive sales. What they are trying to do instead is to devolve the cost of incentives to the sellers by conditioning certain ratings that carry discounts on eBay fees with offering customers things like free shipping or free returns that will boost customer purchasing similar to a rebate.
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Old 04-20-2021, 11:06 AM
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By the way, thanks to all for the interesting and informative discussion here. I'm not sure I'm any closer to a definitive answer , but I'm glad to hear other's perspectives, including sellers.
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Old 05-01-2021, 02:42 AM
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I think it has been mentioned on other threads that eBay will sometimes add the Make An Offer option to listings that have been up for a while without the seller knowing that it happens. If that is true then that could be a reason why all offers are rejected.
...And it defaults to 50%! That is a dirty little game the seller's "partner," eBay, is playing.
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Old 05-05-2021, 11:25 PM
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Quote:
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By the way, thanks to all for the interesting and informative discussion here. I'm not sure I'm any closer to a definitive answer , but I'm glad to hear other's perspectives, including sellers.
I am only ever a buyer in this situations. When I deal with these, it isn't by considering a percentage of the ask price as described in the opening post, but rather determining what the recent comps are and then depending on the scarcity of the item, adding a premium to that which I am guessing should make it interesting to the seller. If it is a certified card that I can tell what that exact item last sold for, then it helps even more to guess what sort of multiple the seller is trying to get (presuming they made that purchase on record).

Depending on how absurd the BIN is, this can mean I am offering less than 50% of the ask, but still 100-200% more than a comparable item has ever sold for or that any sensible person would agree it ever could in the relative future. It rarely works. These are the exorbitantly over-priced items that someone mentioned stay listed literally for years. I guess as someone else explained, these are often items that are there for show that the "seller" has no intention of actually selling.

However, it sometimes does work, and it also can work when explaining the rationale for the offer. Got one of my most prized items off eBay against a very high BIN through a reasoned back-and-forth with the seller.

As others have said, I also have tired of ebay in this way since the odds of a favorable outcome are so low, but remembering my occasional successes will usually get convince me to take a stab at something every now and then. I am thinking more and more that it comes down to whether the seller is truly interested in selling, or otherwise just showing off or pretending to sell on those ridiculously high BIN listings.
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