New T205 Website with Master Checklist

[Ronnie73]

Hi everyone, Lately there seems to be an increase in T205 questions and posts. Some time ago, I had decided to start a new T205 website but had gotten busy on some other projects. So I decided to make the website live today. Since its new, there are many unfinished areas but wanted to get going with the Master Checklist and work on it from there. I welcome everyone to contribute to the growth of this website and share their knowledge of this popular set.

Thanks,
Ron Kornacki
http://www.t205resource.com

[KrenBats]

Ron, great site! I look forward to the site growing with more content. I have a card not on the Master Checklist, a Broad Leaf black EJ Phelps. Is this a new discovery?

[Ronnie73]

Originally Posted by KrenBats

Ron, great site! I look forward to the site growing with more content. I have a card not on the Master Checklist, a Broad Leaf black EJ Phelps. Is this a new discovery?

Its a new discovery as in its a card I haven't seen in the past year to add it to the list. Thanks for the addition, I will update the website tonight. Right now there are many cards that exist that are not checked off only because I haven't seen them yet.

[Vintagecatcher]

Nice job Ron!


Patrick

Originally Posted by KrenBats

Ron, great site! I look forward to the site growing with more content. I have a card not on the Master Checklist, a Broad Leaf black EJ Phelps. Is this a new discovery?

No it's not new. I owned the card before and believe I got it from another board member.



Ron what your saying is that you started a site that you want fellow T205 collectors to fill out for you because you didn't take the time for research in depth right? So all of us give you info we have collected for yrs and we all have a bad a$$ well informed site made. So how do I get my cut when you start getting headline, banner, and other advertising profits? My time, my knowledge, my research will not be used for someone else's gain when no effort was put forth to do their own. Hell a simple 4-5hrs on the Sgc registry and ebay would give you 90%+ of what you need. Call me sour or bitter or what ever you want but all I ask is that you do not publish any info I have given of finding I have made.

[19cbb]

Tough crowd...

[Vintagecatcher]

Ron,


Here is another one to add:

Patrick

[frankbmd]

I thought we were stewards.
History is immortal.
Sadly we are not.

[dog*dirt]

Originally Posted by Pup6913

No it's not new. I owned the card before and believe I got it from another board member.



Ron what your saying is that you started a site that you want fellow T205 collectors to fill out for you because you didn't take the time for research in depth right? So all of us give you info we have collected for yrs and we all have a bad a$$ well informed site made. So how do I get my cut when you start getting headline, banner, and other advertising profits? My time, my knowledge, my research will not be used for someone else's gain when no effort was put forth to do their own. Hell a simple 4-5hrs on the Sgc registry and ebay would give you 90%+ of what you need. Call me sour or bitter or what ever you want but all I ask is that you do not publish any info I have given of finding I have made.

I am not sure why you are so bitter about this website. Ron has stated this was because of increases in questions and posts on T205's. I hope the website becomes informative and successful for collectors.

There are many of us who could have started a similar website on T205's but Ron took the initiative to start this one. Why should we knock a guy for seeing a need and doing something to address that need? It may not be done how you want it done but that's life.

[KrenBats]

Originally Posted by Pup6913

No it's not new. I owned the card before and believe I got it from another board member.



Ron what your saying is that you started a site that you want fellow T205 collectors to fill out for you because you didn't take the time for research in depth right? So all of us give you info we have collected for yrs and we all have a bad a$$ well informed site made. So how do I get my cut when you start getting headline, banner, and other advertising profits? My time, my knowledge, my research will not be used for someone else's gain when no effort was put forth to do their own. Hell a simple 4-5hrs on the Sgc registry and ebay would give you 90%+ of what you need. Call me sour or bitter or what ever you want but all I ask is that you do not publish any info I have given of finding I have made.

Let me start of by saying that I have been collecting T205's for about 10 minutes and have a total of 4 in my collection. I definitely understand where Andrew is coming from. I have been collecting Kren bats for about 15 years and it is very difficult finding information on these bats. I have paid over $500 for catalogs, traveled to the Louisville Slugger Museum, and have spend countless hours conducting research. I would get annoyed when people would ask my opinion on bats knowing the time and money I invested in my research. (Conversly, I would get annoyed with people not willing to share their knowledge). However, by sharing the infomation that I've collected (often on this board), it has helped the overall collecting community and has hopefully saved some people shelling out big money for a Store model bat that is being called game used.

I also believe that when you give, you get more. I had provided someone information on Kren bats a couple of years ago and shared everything I had. A couple of weeks ago, he decided to sell his collection and he called me first. I would not have been able to add these bats to my collection if I was not willing to share the info I had.

For someone who is just starting out collecting T205's, it would be great to have resources similiar to the T206 sites to learn more about these cards. There were several posts about the market being down for T205's. What better way to get more people excited about collecting T205's and drive up the market?

Lastly, it is critical for the people that provide infomation get credit for their hard work. And as for advertising profits, is Leon giving us a cut from his advertising? Call me crazy, but I don't see Ron retiring anytime soon from this website. I do agree with Andrew that a little more research should have been done, but it's a start. Anyway, just a perspective from someone just staring out collecting these cards.

Mike Hud$0n

[Leon]

Originally Posted by KrenBats

Let me start of by saying that I have been collecting T205's for about 10 minutes and have a total of 4 in my collection. I definitely understand where Andrew is coming from. I have been collecting Kren bats for about 15 years and it is very difficult finding information on these bats. I have paid over $500 for catalogs, traveled to the Louisville Slugger Museum, and have spend countless hours conducting research. I would get annoyed when people would ask my opinion on bats knowing the time and money I invested in my research. (Conversly, I would get annoyed with people not willing to share their knowledge). However, by sharing the infomation that I've collected (often on this board), it has helped the overall collecting community and has hopefully saved some people shelling out big money for a Store model bat that is being called game used.

I also believe that when you give, you get more. I had provided someone information on Kren bats a couple of years ago and shared everything I had. A couple of weeks ago, he decided to sell his collection and he called me first. I would not have been able to add these bats to my collection if I was not willing to share the info I had.

For someone who is just starting out collecting T205's, it would be great to have resources similiar to the T206 sites to learn more about these cards. There were several posts about the market being down for T205's. What better way to get more people excited about collecting T205's and drive up the market?

Lastly, it is critical for the people that provide infomation get credit for their hard work. And as for advertising profits, is Leon giving us a cut from his advertising? Call me crazy, but I don't see Ron retiring anytime soon from this website. I do agree with Andrew that a little more research should have been done, but it's a start. Anyway, just a perspective from someone just staring out collecting these cards.

Mike Hud$0n

I suggest you participate in the frequent board contests or come to the National and go to the Net54baseball dinner at the National in order to understand what is given back vis a vis profits from our ads (not that I need to, but I have). The dinner has some sponsorship, usually, but I have always had to put in 4 figures or more to pay for it. Try having food and a 6 hour open bar for 200 or so people, at a nice hotel, and let me know the cost. Nah, I have never given anything back. Oh, please send your membership dues asap too. best regards

ps...Good luck with the site Ron!! Nice start.

[KrenBats]

Leon, by no means was I questioning all the great things that you do by investing in this site and the other events. It is a tremendous site and I'm sure there is a significant financial investment hosting the site, the dinners, etc. I never said that you didn't give anything back. I was just making a point that most of us share our knowledge and info on the site and don't expect money in return. The success of the site is clearly attributed to your efforts and reinvesting in the Net54 community!

[Wihawk]

Thanks Ron for the site. I just started collecting a team set of Superbas(still need Dahlen, Daubert and Wilhelm r or no r doesn't interest me), so this site came at a very nice time in my BB card collecting journey.

[rsst206]

Hi Ron was going over my set. You can add this Fred Merkle
Best regards
Ron

Downey and phelps is listed as having both BL backs. Downey is an olive and phelps a black back. It is not possible for them to exist with both backs.

[Ronnie73]

Originally Posted by Pup6913

Downey and phelps is listed as having both BL backs. Downey is an olive and phelps a black back. It is not possible for them to exist with both backs.

Thank you Andrew, This is one of the topics that will be in tonights update because the scans are hard to tell sometimes between the black and olive green. I've corrected these two and it will show in tonights update. Thanks again,

Ron

[CobbSpikedMe]

Originally Posted by Pup6913

No it's not new. I owned the card before and believe I got it from another board member.



Ron what your saying is that you started a site that you want fellow T205 collectors to fill out for you because you didn't take the time for research in depth right? So all of us give you info we have collected for yrs and we all have a bad a$$ well informed site made. So how do I get my cut when you start getting headline, banner, and other advertising profits? My time, my knowledge, my research will not be used for someone else's gain when no effort was put forth to do their own. Hell a simple 4-5hrs on the Sgc registry and ebay would give you 90%+ of what you need. Call me sour or bitter or what ever you want but all I ask is that you do not publish any info I have given of finding I have made.

Andrew,

I totally understand your point here. But I also like the idea of the site growing and being built by the contributions of advanced T205 collectors like yourself. The site (and collectors looking to it for guidance) would benefit greatly with your input and contributions. It would be great to have articles written by you published on the site as well.

However, like I said, I understand your point about more research and development being put into it by the developer prior to going live with it.

Best,

AndyH


.

[doug.goodman]

...So all of us give you info we have collected for yrs and we all have a bad a$$ well informed site made. So how do I get my cut when you start getting headline, banner, and other advertising profits? My time, my knowledge, my research will not be used for someone else's gain...

Wow, I'm glad that the various contributors to the Encyclopædia Britannica weren't of a similar mindset.

And, while Mr. Webster certainly deserves most of the credit for his dictionary, I'm glad for the help he surely got which may, or may not, have been credited somewhere in a section that I doubt anybody ever reads.

Doug

[Wite3]

Just for the record...I asked not to have my initials put on the board but Ron said other people wanted it. I prefer not to have them there.

Joshua

[Ronnie73]

Originally Posted by Wite3

Just for the record...I asked not to have my initials put on the board but Ron said other people wanted it. I prefer not to have them there.

Joshua

I can remove your initials if you would like. It only takes a minute to do. As you know, this site is a work in progress and its everyones site to use. Its not what makes me happy but what makes the users and contributors happy.

[peterb69]

Ron, nice site so far.

[barrysloate]

Thanks Mike, and there is no question that the world is changing in every way imaginable. Maybe the days of sharing information freely have gone the way of the dinosaur. Hey, I'm just a cranky old white guy.

There is a great emphasis today on the value of baseball cards, and perhaps some collectors feel that sharing too much information will hurt them in the pocketbook. That's why we often see collectors refusing to add new cards to established checklists; they feel if they keep them uncatalogued they will be worth more money. When the cards weren't so valuable the information was happily shared.

[Wite3]

Okay...after talking it over, I sent Ron an email...I will be going through his list and my master list and sending him data on cards he is missing from his list. I hope this helps collectors. Good luck all.

Joshua

[Ronnie73]

Originally Posted by Wite3

Okay...after talking it over, I sent Ron an email...I will be going through his list and my master list and sending him data on cards he is missing from his list. I hope this helps collectors. Good luck all.

Joshua

Thank you Joshua. I look forward to updating the website with your information. Also, thank you to the others that have posted their additions to the site. I plan to do the updating late tonight which seems to be the only time I have thats free.

As far as having more information on a card, makes it less valuable, I don't agree. Seems the more info on T206's only increases the value. Knowing whats needed to complete a subset, has only increased the number of collectors willing to give the monster a shot, wether it be a teamset, backs set, or any of the other many different ways to collect them. I feel the same can happen with the T205's.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Wite3

Okay...after talking it over, I sent Ron an email...I will be going through his list and my master list and sending him data on cards he is missing from his list. I hope this helps collectors. Good luck all.

Joshua

As a collector, thank you. I am one of those that believes sharing information is good for the hobby .....and I enjoy helping others.
And I guess it's worth saying again, thanks to all members here who contribute. It is appreciated. I have actually had lurkers tell me they are upset about something concerning our forum. I generally thank them and tell them when they contribute I will be happy to entertain their critique. Until then I wish them all the best.

Originally Posted by Wite3

Okay...after talking it over, I sent Ron an email...I will be going through his list and my master list and sending him data on cards he is missing from his list. I hope this helps collectors. Good luck all.

Joshua

Josh thank you got the contributions. I have probably not nearly the list you do so even at this point my work is futile in comparison to yours. You stated earlier about giving info with no credit. That's my worry. The work we all out into this is no way distinguished from the person publishing it. All info I have gotten from fellow collectors is identified by color coding as to give credit to them if or when it ever went public. As someone said earlier Ron should have taken a bit more time compiling info of his own. SGC's registry would almost completely fill the list minus back colors and factory designations. Those are easily found via auction houses and ebay. The info is a lot of researching and time but its fulfilling to see the list come together just like building a master set of cards minus the money cost.

As this board should know I am not against sharing info and findings. So to say that is incorrect. As far as costing a ton to run a site I can only say it cost me less than $10 a month to have my business site up when I did. How much for an advertising banner? Probably far more than $20+ a month(guessing). Isn't this the issue that came up about the T206 resource web site. Info taken and used as someone else's? There's a thread a mile long about it. It was a crappy deal for all parties involved.

So in closing I was planning on emailing Ron tonight and discussing the issues I have but have been in a stand all day. I am still in it btw. Ron I wish you the best from one 205 guy to the next and the work Josh has done will probably fill all your needs. I will take a look after it is uploaded and see if I have anything to add(doubtful) and email you them. I am trusting what you and Josh discussed would be the same questions I would have asked anyways. If he's ok sharing then I will if I have anything to add. Happy collecting everyone.

[RCMcKenzie]

t205cubsf.jpg

t205cubsb2.jpg

Thank y'all for putting the t205 website together. looking forward to reading it. Here are two of only a handful that I own.

Also, great article on Dots Miller about how he got his name.


edit--Richie is Hassan Fact 30, Graham Cubs is Hassan Fact 649

[npa589]

I can't wait to look through this. I've been looking for exactly what you have provided here...

Thank you Ron!

[z28jd]

I don't think anyone gets rich off a website such as his like some people think. The site I write for had over six million page views last year and we surpassed that in late August this year. We have independent advertisers and google ads as well. I wrote a story this morning that took just over an hour to write/edit/publish/market(facebook/twitter) and I will make approx $4 on it, unless someone big picks it up and references it, then I might get about $10. Part of that is because it is baseball off-season but the show must go on.

I have posted news items or live game recaps that have paid well per time spent, but I have also written stories on Pirates history that have made about $.50 per hour spent writing it. I personally like the history articles better because it is something I enjoy more and I don't consider it wasted time.

I would've paid the site I write for(don't tell the owner) to let me publish this bio on Dots Miller because of the family relation to him. Every regular reader on this board could read this and I might get $2 from it in my next check so click away just to see the work put into it for reference purposes. I spent about three hours on it and that was coming into the story already well-armed with info on Dots. http://blogs.piratesprospects.com/hi...r-dots-miller/

[npa589]

I can add one: John Kling SOVEREIGN --- I currently own two. One is getting graded, the other is raw, as it should be, in my collection.

I also can add:

1. Pfeister Sovereign
2. Richie American Beauty Black

--- both of which are currently in my possession, scans are below!

[npa589]

Scans for the Richie/Pfeister

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Ronnie73

Hi everyone, Lately there seems to be an increase in T205 questions and posts. Some time ago, I had decided to start a new T205 website but had gotten busy on some other projects. So I decided to make the website live today. Since its new, there are many unfinished areas but wanted to get going with the Master Checklist and work on it from there. I welcome everyone to contribute to the growth of this website and share their knowledge of this popular set.

Thanks,
Ron Kornacki
http://www.t205resource.com

Ron, don't know how I missed this before, but thanks for mentioning me on your website.

As far as any concerns anyone has over advertising, banners, $$$, etc. - just die broke in a cave, and at least you will be remembered fondly.

[nebboy]

I was doing a lot of research on Sov and Peid 42s and tried to share the info as I found it. Had to take a break but hope take up the search again and will post for the new site all I can. Good job and keep the info flowing!

[Ronnie73]

Thank you Ed (T205Guy) and Peter (peterb69) for your additions to the checklist. Ed, two of the Drum cards you verified were already checked off so thats the reason for only 5 cards next to your name. Credit is given in the order that the cards are verified. Remember everyone, weather its one card or many, its still important to the growth of the website and appreciate all the support.

Scott, I enjoy your website, especially the postcard and cabinet photos and it made me want to contribute to the research of the hobby and thats why I started T205Resource.com. I also have plans to do a T212 website but decided to get the T205 site near complete first before starting the T212 Obak site.

Again, Thank you everyone for all the support and hopefully i'm not boring anyone with near daily updates while the sites checklist is growing each day.

Ron
T205Resource.com

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Ronnie73

Scott, I enjoy your website, especially the postcard and cabinet photos and it made me want to contribute to the research of the hobby and thats why I started T205Resource.com. I also have plans to do a T212 website but decided to get the T205 site near complete first before starting the T212 Obak site.

Ron
T205Resource.com

Well, seeing your website, and your above post, has inspired me to get after the cabinet and postcard sections - pre-wwi photos are really my passion, as they bring to life the era when the cards you mention were actually being pulled out of cigarette packs. It's also the reason I collect signed letters written by the T206 guys.

You (and others who are posting in this thread) are also kind of inspiring me to revive my T205 collection - I only have 6, but they are good ones

[Wite3]

Geno,
I will have to check...probably do not have scans but may actually own the cards. Will let you know.

Joshua

[sb1]

I can add Broadleaf Green -- Austin and A. Latham on back.

Scott

I noticed there was the Matty cycle var listed but not the PB White partial quotes and no quotes, Collins mouth closed yellow elephant, graham signature variation blue and black (blue sig pied 25 only- black sig not found on pied 25), Miller B, D, or D over B print. Any reason those aren't listed? I don't think we need SCD, PSA, or SGC to tell us guys what is and isn't a variation. There are 2 more I am working on. The HLC backed Latham had a period before the A and I believe was intended to be a WA variation. The other is a new find and currently a work in progress.

[peterb69]

Originally Posted by Pup6913

I noticed there was the Matty cycle var listed but not the PB White partial quotes and no quotes, Collins mouth closed yellow elephant, graham signature variation blue and black (blue sig pied 25 only- black sig not found on pied 25), Miller B, D, or D over B print. Any reason those aren't listed? I don't think we need SCD, PSA, or SGC to tell us guys what is and isn't a variation. There are 2 more I am working on. The HLC backed Latham had a period before the A and I believe was intended to be a WA variation. The other is a new find and currently a work in progress.

Andrew, I actually started another thread just about this topic as I agree with you they should be listed. I assume that thread would become a big debate just like the others, so I didn't want to hijack this thread.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=158953

[Ronnie73]

Originally Posted by Pup6913

I noticed there was the Matty cycle var listed but not the PB White partial quotes and no quotes, Collins mouth closed yellow elephant, graham signature variation blue and black (blue sig pied 25 only- black sig not found on pied 25), Miller B, D, or D over B print. Any reason those aren't listed? I don't think we need SCD, PSA, or SGC to tell us guys what is and isn't a variation. There are 2 more I am working on. The HLC backed Latham had a period before the A and I believe was intended to be a WA variation. The other is a new find and currently a work in progress.

I did think about listing many of those variations but at what point is a variation not worth adding to the list. I don't know if they should be added to the Master List or maybe a Master List Extention. I was just worried that I would be getting scans of cards with 5 different shades of red and expect to list them all as different variations. I am open to any suggestions anyone might have since its everyones site to use.

Ron you listed the Matty cycle 1 loss variation. It's only missing a number. No different than any other variation.

[Tcards-Please]

I do agree with Andrew that if you are going to identify variations separately on the master list, then you would need to have all of them. If you would list the Christy Mathewson once with all confirmed backs, then you would capture the 1 loss. Same thing with Wilhelm, you will capture both variations by listing all confirmed backs as both variations are found separately on one specific back (i.e. both variations aren't found on HASSAN backs). I would think at some point that if you list all possible front/back combinations, that you would capture most (not ALL) variations.

I do agree that it probably would be beneficial to add a separate section that does include the variations that are found on the same back as the corrected version, for instance for those collectors that aren't aware that the Moran Polar Bear back has both the correct back and the stray line of text.

I do think that for the most part, this would be a good site and would only help the collecting community. I also know that some of us will not disclose everything that we know (as Andrew acknowledged) either because of further research or due to not having to compete with other collectors to obtain certain cards. I'm not picking on Andrew as there are other board members that aren't going to give up everything they know, but he was the one who was honest enough to say so.

Great job Ron and I'm glad that someone took the initiative to create a site that I believe will only help promote and provide information on one of the best T sets out there.

r/
Frank

[HercDriver]

Joshua --

Do you own these two cards? Or have a scan of them? I don't believe they exist and the number is actually 123, but I'm very happy to be corrected!

Take Care,
Geno

[Ronnie73]

Originally Posted by HercDriver

Joshua --

Do you own these two cards? Or have a scan of them? I don't believe they exist and the number is actually 123, but I'm very happy to be corrected!

Take Care,
Geno

Hi Geno, I can tell you that I don't have scans of either of these cards yet and did notice my 125 count compared to your 123 but added them for now and see if a scan would show up since I knew what 2 to search for. As I fill in the Gallery of all the back scans, we will see what cards might be questionable but I would say nearly 100 percent of the checklist is accurate with maybe just a few questionables.

I do have a scan of the Hummel that was questioned a few months back and can confrim the Willet but just waiting on a scan.

Ron

[familytoad]

Well, I pulled data for my SGC graded cards so far, the raw ones are still a work in progress. I don't think any of the 150 cards are unique to the master checklist already compiled, although I am not completely finished with that comparison...Hey I think I smell Turkey Dinner!

Ron,
If you are lacking scans I can possibly help. I will email you the list. But for this post, I'll just show the breakdown of the SGC portion of my collection. I'm curious as to how this relates to other collectors:

Card Back Count Pct

American Beauty- Black 0 0%
American Beauty- Green 1 1%
Broadleaf -Black 0 0%
Broadleaf -Green 0 0%
Cycle 5 3%
Drum 0 0%
Hassan -Factory 30 13 9%
Hassan -Factory 649 9 6%
Hindu 0 0%
Honest Long Cut 18 12%
Piedmont -Factory 25 44 29%
Piedmont -Factory 42 2 1%
Polar Bear 20 13%
Sovereign 6 4%
Sweet CapFact.25 Black 10 7%
Sweet CapFact.42 Black 11 7%
Sweet Caporal- Red 11 7%
Familytoad SGC 150 cards

[Ronnie73]

Originally Posted by familytoad

Well, I pulled data for my SGC graded cards so far, the raw ones are still a work in progress. I don't think any of the 150 cards are unique to the master checklist already compiled, although I am not completely finished with that comparison...Hey I think I smell Turkey Dinner!

Ron,
If you are lacking scans I can possibly help. I will email you the list. But for this post, I'll just show the breakdown of the SGC portion of my collection. I'm curious as to how this relates to other collectors:

Card Back Count Pct

American Beauty- Black 0 0%
American Beauty- Green 1 1%
Broadleaf -Black 0 0%
Broadleaf -Green 0 0%
Cycle 5 3%
Hassan -Factory 30 13 9%
Hassan -Factory 649 9 6%
Hindu 0 0%
Honest Long Cut 18 12%
Piedmont -Factory 25 44 29%
Piedmont -Factory 42 2 1%
Polar Bear 20 13%
Sovereign 6 4%
Sweet CapFact.25 Black 10 7%
Sweet CapFact.42 Black 11 7%
Sweet Caporal- Red 11 7%
Sweet Caporal- Red 11 7%
Familytoad SGC 150 cards

Thanks Brian, I received your email and will let you know what scans I need after I finish going through all the ones I have. As far as the T205 breakdown of my collection, I mainly collect Piedmont 42's, American Beauty's, and Cycle's in that order but only in PSA 4/SGC 50 grades. I have a few others also that i've bought when the price is good. For some reason, I buy more T206's than T205's and have well over 1000 different front/back combinations but rare back prices are so out of control that i've been trying to add more to my T205 collection lately.