Its not just moser/pwcc...more trimmers exposed

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

The SGC website home page still promises good things to come, but starts with a video about autograph authentication, which - as they say on the homepage as well - they stopped doing on April 1 after their autograph authentication business was obliterated by a forgery ring in Girard, OH. (PSA would be similarly wise to give up card grading until they come up with a better mouse trap.)

I used to love SGC, and had my entire first T206 set encapsulated by SGC. But all the folks that made SGC so great are now at REA. I have given up on them.

I remember when you were their biggest fan, we used to have some discussions about that. Very interesting. Have their graders left as well or just administrative people?

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I remember when you were their biggest fan, we used to have some discussions about that. Very interesting. Have their graders left as well or just administrative people?

When Senior Grader Rob Luce left in 2016 to follow Brian Dwyer to REA, I knew it wasn't a good move for SGC. Luce used to travel to the shows, and you could sit down with him and ask how he graded cards, and what he thought of your cards before you submitted them. It was that first-class customer service -- and much more consistent and accurate grading -- that made me their biggest fan.

That they somehow are surviving despite their best efforts to kill themselves is more a testament to the outrageous waiting times for PSA grading than support for their current business model.

[The Nasty Nati]

It's crazy that they are even getting away with recoloring. I mean I can understand how trimming can get past the PSA graders but recoloring the back of a high dollar t206 card. How do you miss that?

See Demmitt post:
https://www.blowoutforums.com/showpo...postcount=2204

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by The Nasty Nati

It's crazy that they are even getting away with recoloring. I mean I can understand how trimming can get past the PSA graders but recoloring the back of a high dollar t206 card. How do you miss that?

See Demmitt post:
https://www.blowoutforums.com/showpo...postcount=2204

Conventional wisdom was always a blacklight would pick that up. I have no idea what to think.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I have no idea what to think.

Ummm...yes, you do. You just don't want to admit it.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Ummm...yes, you do. You just don't want to admit it.

David, do you believe David Hall, Joe Orlando and/or Steve Sloan have overtly or tacitly approved the knowing grading of altered cards, or do you think some submitters have a grader on the inside?

Let's flesh out your conspiracy theory.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

David, do you believe David Hall, Joe Orlando and/or Steve Sloan have overtly or tacitly approved the knowing grading of altered cards, or do you think some submitters have a grader on the inside?

Let's flesh out your conspiracy theory.

The latter.

[joshuanip]

I hope the industry (TPG, auctioners, etc) response will lift us above this to put us in a better spot at the end of the day.

The hobby is too big for there not to be a measured response; its make or break and their mouse trap is threatened.... I think they will build a better mousetrap to re-instill confidence in our hobby at the end of the day.

The fact that we have this forum and BO to identify bad players and force the hands of TPGs to prevent their name from being besmirched, makes me think we will come out better from this.....

[CuriousGeorge]

This investigation will focus on PWCC, Brent Huigens, Gary Moser and now Bobby Binder at VCP, who foolishly got himself involved with his implausible eBay story. The good news Bobby is we won’t be the ones you need to convince so start compiling those emails from eBay because I suspect you’re going to need them soon.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by CuriousGeorge

This investigation will focus on PWCC, Brent Huigens, Gary Moser and now Bobby Binder at VCP, who foolishly got himself involved with his implausible eBay story. The good news Bobby is we won’t be the ones you need to convince so start compiling those emails from eBay because I suspect you’re going to need them soon.

I think you missed a rather key player... the people who authenticated all of this crap.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Believe it or not Betsy is technically correct with her definition of shilling. An owner is allowed to bid on his or her items in most, if not all states, as long as they pay if and when they win. Now many auction houses (including mine) see the ethical flaw in the law, especially as it pertains to online auctions. Hell Ebay won't let you bid on your own offerings. If you don't believe me check the UCC I believe it's somewhere around 235. Peter and I discussed this a couple years back and he was surprised to see it in black and white as I recall. Of course the gulf between legal and ethical can be a wide one...

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Believe it or not Betsy is technically correct with her definition of shilling. An owner is allowed to bid on his or her items in most, if not all states, as long as they pay if and when they win. Now many auction houses (including mine) see the ethical flaw in the law, especially as it pertains to online auctions. Hell Ebay won't let you bid on your own offerings. If you don't believe me check the UCC I believe it's somewhere around 235. Peter and I discussed this a couple years back and he was surprised to see it in black and white as I recall. Of course the gulf between legal and ethical can be a wide one...

Scott I recall a discussion about retracting that surprised me but you may well be right we discussed this too.

[egbeachley]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Conventional wisdom was always a blacklight would pick that up. I have no idea what to think.

Buy special hobby paint that doesn’t have optical brighteners added to it?