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#1
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#2
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Period. If he was "the best in baseball" over a five year period, he doesn't get into the Hall. He just doesn't and I don't see how that is debatable. Take away his home numbers from 1962-1966 and just double his road numbers and there is no way that career gets him into the Hall. I don't even see how that can be questioned. He would have been Gary Peters but with a lot more strikeouts from 1962-1966. If Peters isn't a Hall of Famer... |
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#4
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28-8 2.31 ERA 324 k This edges out Dick Ellsworth, though it is fairly close: 22-10 2.11 ERA 185 k 1966 his road numbers doubled are: 28-8 1.96 ERA 314 k That beats Juan Marichal but again it is somewhat close: 25-6 2.23 ERA 222 K However In 1965 Koufax road numbers doubled are: 14-6 2.93 ERA 198k Marichal destroys him. 22-13 2.13 ERA 240k So that gives him 2 Cy Youngs, 2 WS MVPs and 4 rings. And career numbers that aren't close to what they are when Chavez Ravene gets entered into the equation. Maybe a borderline HOFer because he is so likebale and people feel sorry for him having to quit at such a young age? Maybe? Best lefty ever though? Please. Last edited by btcarfagno; 07-22-2020 at 01:01 PM. |
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Boy I botched that up pretty good.
1965 is a toss up for Cy Young. Koufax road numbers doubled are: 24-10 2.72 ERA 348 k Juan Marichal: 22-13 2.13 ERA 240 k And for 1965 if we go to WAR for pitchers, Koufax INCLUDING HIS HOME GAMES is at 8.1 which was third in the league behind Marichal at 10.3 and Maloney at 8.2. But just looking at the "traditional" stats they would have used back then a good argument could be made for either one. If Koufax gets this third Cy I would agree he would be a HOFer in the traditionalist sense. If the third Cy instead goes to Marichal (as WAR says it should have anyway) then if Koufax gets into the Hall he squeaks in with a lot of help from a friendly BBWAA. Last edited by btcarfagno; 07-22-2020 at 01:10 PM. |
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Successful transactions with: Bfrench00, TonyO, Mintacular, Patriots74, Sean1125, Bocabirdman, Rjackson44, KC Doughboy, Kailes2872 Last edited by howard38; 09-11-2020 at 07:15 PM. |
#7
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Found this on SB Nation - looking at WAR/200 innings pitched (https://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/20...-rate-stat-top) [he lists the % of games started because he broke out relievers in another table]
Rank Name Innings WAR WAR/200 IP GS% 1 Pedro Martinez 2827.5 75.9 5.37 85.92 2 Roger Clemens 4916.6 128.4 5.22 99.72 3 Lefty Grove 3940.6 98.3 4.99 74.19 4 Johan Santana 1709.7 42.1 4.92 75.48 5 Sandy Koufax 2324.4 54.5 4.69 79.09 6 Roy Halladay 2046.6 47.4 4.63 91.69 7 Randy Johnson 4135.4 91.8 4.44 97.57 8 Brandon Webb 1319.7 29.2 4.43 99.5 9 Bob Gibson 3884.4 85.6 4.41 91.29 10 Tom Seaver 4782.6 105.3 4.40 98.63 11 Roy Oswalt 1803.4 39.5 4.38 95.76 12 Walter Johnson 5914.7 127.7 4.32 83.04 13 Curt Schilling 3261 69.7 4.27 76.63 14 Bret Saberhagen 2562.6 54.7 4.27 92.98 15 Mike Mussina 3562.8 74.8 4.20 99.81 16 Teddy Higuera 1379.9 28.3 4.10 96.24 17 Harry Brecheen 1907.4 38.8 4.07 75.47 18 Kid Nichols 5056.3 102.3 4.05 90.48 19 Pete Alexander 5189.9 104.9 4.04 86.06 20 Dizzy Dean 1967.3 39.6 4.03 72.56 21 Kevin Brown 3256.3 64.8 3.98 97.94 22 Tim Hudson 2059.5 40.9 3.97 99.68 23 Cy Young 7354.8 146.0 3.97 89.96 24 David Cone 2898.8 57.5 3.97 93.11 25 C.C. Sabathia 1889.4 37.3 3.95 100 |
#8
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Camilo Pascual was likely better than Ford in 1963, with a record of 21-9 2.46 ERA and league leading 202k. Neither of them was as good as "road" Koufax or Ellsworth in 1963 though I don't think. Sam McDowall was likely the best in the AL in 1965 but at 17-11 he would fall short even conceding his league best ERA of 2.18 and league best strikeouts of 325. I would still give the Cy to the "road" Koufax in 1963 and 1966. 1962 and 1964 forget it. 1965 still a Koufax/Marichal toss up, though advanced metrics choose Marichal in 1965 over even the actual Koufax. |
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