Heritage Rosen Mantle - Greatest Card Ever Auctioned?

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by G1911

Who has criticized Mickey Mantle? Do you not know the card is not a rookie? Did you not know it was a DP? Do you not understand it does not meet SGC’s published criteria of a 9.5? What statement is “bile”?

Got to love the pumpers.

Yeah his post was self-serving. Apparently his Sunday is/was not going quite as good as he stated. Happens. Hopefully Mon is better for him.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Lorewalker

Yeah his post was self-serving. Apparently his Sunday is/was not going quite as good as he stated. Happens. Hopefully Mon is better for him.

The 52 Topps Mantle is very unique in the emotional connection people seem have to it. It seems like half the hobby gets triggered if you simply state "the card is a double print" or correctly state that it's not a rookie (it's, what, his third or fourth mainstream card?). These statements are undeniably 100% factually true, and are not even an assault on the card, but it ruins a lot of Sunday's. It's the only card for which people do this. Tell the T206 guys that there are many cards rarer than a Wagner and they will agree with you instead of getting pissed. Tell a Baltimore Ruth fan that the card isn't a rookie but a pre-rookie because it's not a major league card and they will agree it's a minor league card. I suspect the reason for this is that the Mantle card is not difficult or rare and there are tons of copies, so many collectors own one and are bought into the seemingly never-ending pump with a vested interest in rocketing that as high as possible. T206 Wagner owners are much fewer and don't have to go agro to defend their investment because its demand and growth was more organic instead of an investment hype train.

Fans of the T206 Wagner, the Baltimore Ruth, and other cards have never tried to claim Mr. Mint as an authority of integrity before that's for sure

[Peter_Spaeth]

I think Matt just loves the card and takes this shit personally, I don't think he's pumping it.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I think Matt just loves the card and takes this shit personally, I don't think he's pumping it.

If one makes a thread hyping a card that they own, gets upset when anybody says anything that is not even necessarily critical but doesn't further hype the card and is 100% undeniably factually true... I mean, I have a hard time seeing the difference between it being "personal" versus "pumping". I guess the difference is the internal thought process? The act is the same thing here.

The 52 Mantle has the longest and biggest pump and marketing campaign of any card in hobby history. Which is fine, if people want to treat cards as an investment vehicle, they can go ahead. But it is what it is.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by G1911

If one makes a thread hyping a card that they own, gets upset when anybody says anything that is not even necessarily critical but doesn't further hype the card and is 100% undeniably factually true... I mean, I have a hard time seeing the difference between it being "personal" versus "pumping". I guess the difference is the internal thought process? The act is the same thing here.

The 52 Mantle has the longest and biggest pump and marketing campaign of any card in hobby history. Which is fine, if people want to treat cards as an investment vehicle, they can go ahead. But it is what it is.

This card has been near and dear to Matt for the many years he's been posting here. It's genuine IMO, whether or not one agrees with it.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

This card has been near and dear to Matt for the many years he's been posting here. It's genuine IMO, whether or not one agrees with it.

I'm going to maintain my position; getting upset over objective facts is a little weird. Whether it's a genuine love or a cold hearted calculation isn't something I addressed nor care about; the end result is blatant pumping of a card. I'm not even anti-52-Mantle, it's a nice card and a nice picture of a young Mickey from a great set. But facts are facts.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by G1911

I'm going to maintain my position; getting upset over objective facts is a little weird. Whether it's a genuine love or a cold hearted calculation isn't something I addressed nor care about; the end result is blatant pumping of a card. I'm not even anti-52-Mantle, it's a nice card and a nice picture of a young Mickey from a great set. But facts are facts.

I guess to me pumping requires an element of intent, but if you're defining it otherwise we can both be right.

[Lorewalker]

Originally Posted by G1911

The 52 Topps Mantle is very unique in the emotional connection people seem have to it. It seems like half the hobby gets triggered if you simply state "the card is a double print" or correctly state that it's not a rookie (it's, what, his third or fourth mainstream card?). These statements are undeniably 100% factually true, and are not even an assault on the card, but it ruins a lot of Sunday's. It's the only card for which people do this. Tell the T206 guys that there are many cards rarer than a Wagner and they will agree with you instead of getting pissed. Tell a Baltimore Ruth fan that the card isn't a rookie but a pre-rookie because it's not a major league card and they will agree it's a minor league card. I suspect the reason for this is that the Mantle card is not difficult or rare and there are tons of copies, so many collectors own one and are bought into the seemingly never-ending pump with a vested interest in rocketing that as high as possible. T206 Wagner owners are much fewer and don't have to go agro to defend their investment because its demand and growth was more organic instead of an investment hype train.

Fans of the T206 Wagner, the Baltimore Ruth, and other cards have never tried to claim Mr. Mint as an authority of integrity before that's for sure

I would wager that even the most ardent or sensitive owners of the double printed 2nd year card of Mantle--the 1952 Topps--would probably agree that the appreciation the card has seen is somewhat disproportionate. Given the sheer number of them that have survived there are a great deal of collectors who have benefited from its appreciation over the last few years so I can see why saying anything negative even about the 1952 Topps set might put in jeopardy someone's Sunday.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Lorewalker

I would wager that even the most ardent or sensitive owners of the double printed 2nd year card of Mantle--the 1952 Topps--would probably agree that the appreciation the card has seen is somewhat disproportionate. Given the sheer number of them that have survived there are a great deal of collectors who have benefited from its appreciation over the last few years so I can see why saying anything negative even about the 1952 Topps set might put in jeopardy someone's Sunday.

I agree, I would expect this why this one alone of the top tier investment cards so frequently has this defensive theme.

The 52 Mickey is a great card and you will all make money, relax investors and Mickey lovers. It's also a DP and not a rookie by any definition.

[darwinbulldog]

Originally Posted by G1911

The 52 Topps Mantle is very unique in the emotional connection people seem have to it. It seems like half the hobby gets triggered if you simply state "the card is a double print" or correctly state that it's not a rookie (it's, what, his third or fourth mainstream card?). These statements are undeniably 100% factually true, and are not even an assault on the card, but it ruins a lot of Sunday's. It's the only card for which people do this. Tell the T206 guys that there are many cards rarer than a Wagner and they will agree with you instead of getting pissed. Tell a Baltimore Ruth fan that the card isn't a rookie but a pre-rookie because it's not a major league card and they will agree it's a minor league card. I suspect the reason for this is that the Mantle card is not difficult or rare and there are tons of copies, so many collectors own one and are bought into the seemingly never-ending pump with a vested interest in rocketing that as high as possible. T206 Wagner owners are much fewer and don't have to go agro to defend their investment because its demand and growth was more organic instead of an investment hype train.

Fans of the T206 Wagner, the Baltimore Ruth, and other cards have never tried to claim Mr. Mint as an authority of integrity before that's for sure

Some good points there.

[Republicaninmass]

Try and tell a t206 set collector a set isnt complete without a wagner...hmmmm

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Republicaninmass

Try and tell a t206 set collector a set isnt complete without a wagner...hmmmm

I don't think T206 Wagner owners would disagree with this at all. They are the ones happy to count the set correctly