Original 12-card horizontal E91 strip may reveal 1909 printing format

[brianp-beme]

To review: because this strip contains players from the A's, Giants and Cubs, it would have to be either from the E91A issue or the E91B issue. The players from this strip are listed below, first as how the image would be identified as if it were from the E91A set, and second the identification as if it were from the E91B set.

Listed from left to right (players names spelled exactly as on front of card):

Set E91A Set E91B

Frederick L. Hartsel / Frederick L. Hartsel
Frederick L. Hartsel / Frederick L. Hartsel
Daniel F. Murphy (2b) / Edw. Collins
Harry Davis / Harry Davis
Joseph F. Tinker / Joseph F. Tinker
John J. McGraw / John J. McGraw
Ralph O. Seybold / Dan Murphy (RF)
Daniel F. Murphy (2b) / Edw. Collins
Harry Davis / Harry Davis
Joseph F. Tinker / Joseph F. Tinker
John J. McGraw / John J. McGraw
Ralph O. Seybold / Dan Murphy (RF)

As can be seen, there are two basic differences in the lists: the 3rd and 8th player from the left are identified as Daniel F. Murphy in the E91A set, and as Edw. Collins in the E91B set, and the 7th from left as well as the last player are identified as Ralph O. Seybold in the E91A set, and as Dan Murphy in the E91B set.

Despite the blurry name designations as seen in the scan (are these guys in the witness protection program, or what? Perhaps they are, or feel they need to be, since they are included in the widely--but wrongly--despised E91 sets), I think it is fairly obvious, due to the spacing of the above mentioned player's names and inclusion of middle initial, that this strip is from the E91A issue.

By the way, the 12 card wide theory is interesting for this set. Perhaps the sheet was 12 cards wide by 11 high, thus making it a 132 card sheet, which could possibly indicate that each of the 33 cards of the E91A set were printed 4 times per sheet.

Brian

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by brianp-beme

By the way, the 12 card wide theory is interesting for this set. Perhaps the sheet was 12 cards wide by 11 high, thus making it a 132 card sheet, which could possibly indicate that each of the 33 cards of the E91A set were printed 4 times per sheet.

Brian

Brian

I appreciate your keen analysis of the E91 set. And, I agree that these 12 cards on this horizontal strip are representative of the E91-A series.

Also, I think your comment about this 12-card x 11 rows sheet structure certainly makes practical sense to me. For years now on this forum, I have proposed
this format (12-card wide sheet) for the T205 & T206 cards. But, I have been met with a number of naysayers. Whatever, they are entitled to their opinions.

But now, this 12-card strip may be a significant discovery, for it is the first real evidence that these advertising premiums (Tobacco or Candy) whose width is
approx. 1 1/2 inches were printed on sheets in rows of 12 cards. This fact certainly reinforces my confidence that my theory is also valid for T205's & T206's.

Illustrated here is an example of my theory as applied to T206's. It's my simulated sheet of the 12 subjects in the 460-series I refer to as the "Exclusive 12".
This arrangement of 96 cards was most likely printed on a 19" x 24" sheet diagramed here....which was a standard size cardboard sheet (circa 1908-1919).


.... v................................................. ............................................... 19" wide .................................................. ..............................................v





TED Z
.

[scooter729]

Not sure if it adds much, but attached here is my 13-card strip of E91s. It follows the same layout pattern as the strip shown already, except with 3 copies of the first card at the left end.

[ZachS]

13-card strip of E91s

And the plot thickens...

I really like watching these threads unfold. It's fun reading all the different perspectives.

[DaveW]

Not sure if it adds much, ...

Wow. It certainly adds lots of questions to the mix. Did they print them in 2 or more different widths (12, 13, more)? Did they just use whatever width paper they had on hand and repeat groups of 5 and fill in another player on the left as many times as needed? It's interesting that Hartsel is the fill in player on both strips. It certainly seems that every player is double printed if every row follows this pattern. Very interesting.

[scooter729]

Ha - apologies for the naive "not sure if it'll add much" comment!

I just poked around - another 13 card strip of different cards was on eBay back in January. Followed the same pattern as mine, with 3 repeating cards on the left end.

eBay link to 13 card strip

[Pat R]

Originally Posted by scooter729

Not sure if it adds much, but attached here is my 13-card strip of E91s. It follows the same layout pattern as the strip shown already, except with 3 copies of the first card at the left end.

What does your 13 card strip measure Scott?


Patrick

[tedzan]

There are many examples of the "12 Factor" in the printing of the T206's. And, here is an example of the 12 Factor in play in the printing of T205's............


v................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .......... 19-inch track width press .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...........v







TED Z
.

[scooter729]

Originally Posted by Pat R

What does your 13 card strip measure Scott?


Patrick

I have had it framed but to the best I can tell, it measures about 19.75 inches in length.

Scott

[Pat R]

Thanks Scott Cool piece. Mile High had this 13 card strip in one of their
auctions.

[canjond]

From the looks of things, I wonder if the strip Ted posted was actually a 13 card strip, and one card was trimmed off the left border. I see how wide the other strips are on the boarder, compared to the one Ted posted. Plus, the 13 card strips start with the first 3 cards being the same, Teds starts with the first 2 being the same (hence why I'm speculating it may be one card short on the left).

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by atx840

Great thread. Fun to figure this stuff out.

That is one sweet looking strip....thanks for posting it.

And, cut out Mr. Chase and kindly sell (or trade) it to me


TED Z
.